| Subject: | Soon to be Announced - City Creek Center |
| Date: | Apr 28, 2010 |
| Author: | The Mighty Builder |
| is now at 4 Billion dollars. This was discussed in a progress meeting just held 26 April 2010. And we're not done yet. |
| Subject: | I have enjoyed your updates |
| Date: | Apr 28 15:48 |
| Author: | Odell Campbell |
| Thanks for the information you have provided since
early in the project. Some of the figures you mention for the entire cost of the project don't seem to be reported to the press. Is this so? Also, I believe in a post last year you mentioned that from the inception of the project the anticipated cost was always known to be in the $6-8 billion range and that LDS church leaders developed a strategy to announce "price increases" over time as opposed to announcing the projected cost correctly from the initial announcement. Is my summary correct? Thanks again. |
| Subject: | Re: I have enjoyed your updates |
| Date: | Apr 28 17:00 |
| Author: | The Mighty Builder |
| Odell Campbell Stated - Some of the figures you
mention for the entire cost of the project don't seem to be reported to the
press. Is this so? TMB Response - Yes. The cost of the project is used both as a PR tools (see how much money we can waste and not be hurt) and as a warning (see what happens when you're not vigilant in your duties - Example Big D Construction and their public thrashing by the Mormon church). Odell Campbell Stated - Also, I believe in a post last year you mentioned that from the inception of the project the anticipated cost was always known to be in the $6-8 billion range and that LDS church leaders developed a strategy to announce "price increases" over time as opposed to announcing the projected cost correctly from the initial announcement. Is my summary correct? TMB Response - I was our firm's estimate that the project would cost between $6 and $10 Billion. However you will note that the Mormon church has incrementally increased the cost of the project over time, thus softening the shock to the members. |
| Subject: | Re: Soon to be Announced - City Creek Center |
| Date: | Apr 28 08:15 |
| Author: | blinkered |
| The Big and Spacious Building gets bigger every day. You can buy anything with money! |
| Subject: | Two Questions? |
| Date: | Apr 28 00:04 |
| Author: | BS mith |
| Two questions: 1. How high will it go....what are those on the "in" saying? 2. Why has this not broke with the news media? |
| Subject: | The most expensive mall in America cost 2 billion to build. |
| Date: | Apr 28 00:10 |
| Author: | Emalee |
| The name of the mall is Xanadu and it is located in
New Jersey. They have been losing money since they opened last summer. So, LDS inc. is going to build a mall that costs two times the amount of the most expensive mall in America. This is unbelievable! I thought churches were supposed to give money to the poor. |
| Subject: | Holy....! What was the very first figure quoted on KSL news? nt |
| Subject: | Re: The most expensive mall in America cost 2 billion to build. |
| Date: | Apr 28 11:32 |
| Author: | anon |
| this more than just a mall. this also includes office
towers and residential condos. We need to compare apples to apples. How many total square feet is being developed, and what is the cost per square foot? |
| Subject: | "And it came to pass, that thou mixed-use development thou buildest..." |
| Date: | Apr 28 13:17 |
| Author: | Enlightened |
| "...shall be a marvelous work and a wonder." |
| Subject: | No wonder LD$ Inc. is having volunteers clean its Conf. Center in SLC! More info., please, as you... |
| Date: | Apr 28 00:15 |
| Author: | Prof. Plum |
| ...learn of it. BTW, how does a project that was projected to cost 'just' $500M in 2003 increase in cost eight-fold in just seven years? Has the project scope expanded that much? Surely the cost of building materials and labor hasn't gone up 700+ percent since '03. |
| Subject: | 500 million? They've always known how much it's going to cost, but they're not saying. |
| Date: | Apr 28 00:21 |
| Author: | April |
| Milk before meat. They broke it to us gently. Even a non-real estate person like myself--I knew the initial figure they quoted was vastly unrealistic! I couldn't remember the exact figure, though. I think it is veeeeerrrrrryyyyy interesting. |
| Subject: | aint it beautiful video link |
| Date: | Apr 28 00:40 |
| Author: | lkj;lkj;lkj |
| http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qAOg3e4flN8 |
| Subject: | Re: Soon to be Announced - City Creek Center |
| Date: | Apr 28 00:58 |
| Author: | designed4joy |
| What's up with the SL tribune quoting such a big
difference today? http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_14368374 |
| Subject: | Oh wow, a Subway AND a McDonalds! Whoo boy, upscale all the way. |
| Date: | Apr 28 01:34 |
| Author: | Shummy |
| And a grocery store to boot? What kinda cockamamie mall features grocery retailers? Selling that high-end wonder-bread cuisine, no doubt. |
| Subject: | Hey, that's high-end in Utah! nt |
| Subject: | City Creek Center losing financing? Here's Line_Doggie's comment, one of several... |
| Date: | Apr 28 01:53 |
| Author: | Adult of god |
| The problem as I posted yesterday, and checking no
posts from yesterday's same story have been removed, just a new blog began,
which is alright, is that City Creek is losing its financing. By stating a
retail "interest" does not imply committal. There are various macro and
micro-economic problems with the project. Let me get this clear at first. The project would have been a great improvement to Downtown SLC. I stress would have. I maintain that the whole project will shut down late 2010 into 2011 due to lack of financing. I ask the Trib to finally report on the fact that in Nevada Cumorah and Ensign shut its doors. Nevada state funds and federal funds were used to cover deposits. These two credit unions are currently under investigation in Nevada. Failed**poof** The project is under financial strain. See, sltrib, Las Vegas is a SMALL town in reality. It's hard to keep a financial secret, here, and that goes true for the LDS businesses. I am investigating and preparing an on-line article with facts, facts being hidden by the Church re: how City Creek is being financed on the backs of the Church's membership and LDS businesses. This (to next) year when the project fails and halts before completion, don't come up with an article on how surprising this has been. Truth is, is that the Church would wish not to have engaged in the project. The recession-depression, and the next shoe to drop is the collapse (COLLAPSE) of the retail-commercial sector will be the last coffin in the nail of City Creek. The financing chess and poker game the church is playing to keep the project alive and financed will collapse with further financial strain. It's not a crime, nor is it the Church's fault that this financial crisis and deep recession hit! But, not to pare down the project and build it as planned results in financial strain for the Church. As I stated, Las Vegas is a small town. My lead began with a former senior employee. |
| Subject: | Wow, the Burj in Dubai only cost $1.5 billion. n/t |
| Subject: | Let me guess the construction companies they are using are owned by family members of the Quorum. nt |
| Subject: | Is there some documentation on this claim? |
| Date: | Apr 28 02:03 |
| Author: | rt |
| Can you leak meeting minutes or something like that? |
| Subject: | That is an extraordinary increase |
| Date: | Apr 28 03:54 |
| Author: | MK ULTRA |
| I am a skeptical of that figure. However, I do find
much of the documented claims about the City Creek Center to be intriguing.
From a year ago in the NY Times: "Signs of the church’s financial strength — and managerial approach — abound. City Creek’s retractable glass roof will provide protection for shoppers during inclement weather. It would not be feasible without the deep coffers of the church, Mr. Collins said." http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/13/realestate/commercial/13utah.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2 |
| Subject: | Downtown malls rarely work well |
| Date: | Apr 28 11:50 |
| Author: | ExmoDad |
| My hometown built a downtown mall about 2 decades ago.
It was a big deal, and everyone involved in the building project hoped it
would bring more people downtown. Unfortunately, it did nothing of the sort. People avoid this mall like crazy for some reason. The only time anyone goes downtown is to a sports arena and to a food market, both which are on the opposite side of this mall, and not even connected to it. Oh well. Good luck, SLC. |
| Subject: | A retractable glass roof? That's outrageous! Do the sheep even know about that part? nt |
| Subject: | A little perspective |
| Date: | Apr 28 12:34 |
| Author: | Riverman |
| I was living in Vegas when the Belagio was built. If I remember right the cost was about $2 billion. That was about 10 years ago. |
| Subject: | Strange, since the cost of construction has gone down. |
| Date: | Apr 28 12:58 |
| Author: | bender |
| Since the housing collapse, the price of steel,
lumber, and pretty much every other construction material has dropped
significantly. I'm working on a large hospital being built in Portland's
Western suburbs. They are well into construction and under budget because of
the drop in prices of materials. Also because of lack of work, contractors are having to bid very low. A few years ago it was normal to have 4 or 5 contractors bid on a job. Now, a job we put out to bid at the beginning of this year had over 30 contractors bid on it. I'm guessing LDS.Inc gave out no-bid contracts to LDS owned construction firms, keeping the money within the good ol' boys network, and are now getting screwed. |
| Subject: | No tithing money used? |
| Date: | Apr 28 13:11 |
| Author: | Anon |
| Church claims that not a cent of tithing money is being used for the mall. If this is true, where does the money come from? |
| Subject: | Re: No tithing money used? |
| Date: | Apr 28 14:35 |
| Author: | gemini |
| Once upon a time tithing money was paid to TSCC [this so called church]. They invested in ranches, real estate and lots of other stuff that made a profit. THAT is supposedly the money that is paying for this mall. But, the seed money was tithing and they will not admit to that. They are a bunch of liars! |
| Subject: | Funny, the deseret news recently reported the cost as.. |
| Date: | Apr 28 13:26 |
| Author: | ramanujam |
| "1.5 billion plus" I had to laugh at the "plus" part. It's like saying Joesph had only "one plus" wives. |
| Subject: | Re: Funny, the deseret news recently reported the cost as.. |
| Date: | Apr 28 14:44 |
| Author: | drilldoc |
| Well it makes sense. Temple square has moons, stars, Saturns, suns, why not a black hole? |
| Subject: | Mormon Times estimate |
| Date: | Apr 28 15:04 |
| Author: | battle Ax |
| Here is a link to the Mormon Time the online church
news.... It says by the time it is done it will be $3 billion. If that
number was wrong do you think they would of let that through?? http://www.mormontimes.com/people_news/church_news/?id=13759 |
| Subject: | Re: Soon to be Announced - City Creek Center |
| Date: | Apr 28 15:11 |
| Author: | OnceMore |
| So, City Creek Center will cost a few billion, give or take a billion or more. Close enough. That's as accurate as anything else TSCC puts out. |
Related Topics
The original article: Mormon403. The Mormon Mall - City Creek to cost over $4 Billion dollars.
The following sections are updates as of August 2010.
A.) Expensive Feature: The name sake of the project is the City Creek that runs down City Creek Canyon to the Jordan River. In 1909 the creek was placed in an underground conduit down North Temple Street from outside of Memory Grove to west of the State Fairpark where the water exits into the Jordan River. The Mormon church decided that a water feature was necessary for the City Creek Project. And only “true” City Creek Water will fit the bill. So the water features in the project will have water pumped up to the feature, run along an artificial “creek” and into a water pond where fish and other aquatic creatures and plants will be on display. Mormon403a
B.) The cost of the project is now estimated to approach $4 Billion Dollars. This is the most expensive mall in the US. Mormon403b [This data of $4 billion is unconfirmed, but believed to be reliable based on past experience from trusted Mormon insiders. The Mormon Church does not open its books for public scrutiny - not even to its members.]
C.) The world's tallest building, Burj Khalifa, completed in 2009 in Dubai cost only $1.5 billion. Mormon403c
D.) LDS welfare stats for 2009 are now available and demonstrate that the mall is far more important than helping those in need. Mormon403d
E.) Condo prices at City Creek slashed 50% due to the economy. Mormon403e
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Recovery from Mormonism - The Mormon Church www.exmormon.org |