So I went up to Sundance with some TBM friends of mine last night. We were staying at his cabin afterwards, and on the drive back my friend decided he wanted to talk about crazy gospel stuff. He goes on to tell a story about Joseph Smith and Brigham Young were walking together one night, and Joe said, "If you knew, what I knew you'd kill me on the spot for blasphemy." Or something like that. Anyways, my friend goes on to talk about how his Dad thought that maybe Joseph Smith played the role as the Holy Ghost before he came to earth, and that is why the spirit is so strong when you share the first vision or talk about Joseph.

I offered the point of view that perhaps he made everything up, and that is why it would be blasphemy. My DW immediately started pinching me trying to get me to shut up. (My friends don't know that I no longer believe.) I offered the point that Joseph said a lot of weird things like people living on the moon and the sun. Now the funny thing is, this really got him troubled. He couldn't stop asking me about it, and wondered why God would allow Joseph to say such an absurd thing. My DW finally told me to tell him something to calm him down. I said maybe he wasn't speaking as a prophet when he said it. But I just thought the whole situation was pretty funny. I really wanted to throw out a couple more zingers, but I also really wanted to have fun in the bedroom that night as we were on a mini vacation.

Has anybody else heard that JS is the Holy Ghost? I thought this was pretty funny.

http://en.fairmormon.org/Joseph_Smith/Office_of_the_Holy_Ghost

Question
I have heard a few claims about certain Church leaders saying that Joseph Smith is the Holy Ghost (or "held the office of Holy Ghost"). Are there quotes or citations supporting or alluding to this somewhere?

Answer
It is true that some Mormons in the 19th century apparently believed that Joseph was the Holy Ghost incarnate [citation needed]. Some have also speculated that the Holy Ghost is a "calling" filled over the eons by various individuals, and that Joseph Smith took this position following his death [citation needed].

This is, of course, not a doctrine of the Church and was repudiated by leaders when it appeared. It is also contrary to LDS scripture.

Vern G. Swanson has written:

The most widespread is the belief that Smith was the Holy Ghost; or more correctly stated, that he represented the emanating spirit of the Father and the Son. This theory arose from several sources. In a 9 March 1841 discourse Joseph Smith apparently discussed three gods who covenanted to preside over this creation: "[An] Everlasting Covenant was made between three personages before the organization of this earth, and [it] relates to their dispensation of things to men on the earth." These three gods, some argue, were Father Adam for the beginning of the mortal world, Christ for the Meridian of Time, and Joseph Smith for the Dispensation of the Fullness of Times. Others have seen Doctrine and Covenants 135:3 as evidence for Smith being the Holy Ghost: "Joseph Smith, the Prophet and Seer of the Lord, has done more, save Jesus only, for the salvation of men in this world than any other man that ever lived in it." Accordingly, Christ did the most to save humanity and is the second member of the Godhead; therefore, Smith, who did second to the most, is the third member.

That such notions have circulated in the church since 1844 is made clear by comments from church leaders contradicting these views. In August 1845 Orson Pratt wrote to church members responding to rumors that Joseph Smith was the Holy Ghost incarnate: "Let no false doctrine proceed out of your mouth, such, for instance that the tabernacle of our martyred prophet and seer, or of any other person, was or is the especial tabernacle of the Holy Ghost, in a different sense from that considered in relation to his residence in other tabernacles. These are doctrines not revealed, and are neither believed nor sanctioned by the Twelve and should be rejected by every Saint."[1]

Doctrine and Covenants 130:21, a statement spoken by the Prophet Joseph Smith, makes clear, however, that during Joseph Smith's lifetime the Holy Ghost was a personage of spirit.

The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s; the Son also; but the Holy Ghost has not a body of flesh and bones, but is a personage of Spirit. Were it not so, the Holy Ghost could not dwell in us.

This canonized statement makes the concept that Joseph Smith was the Holy Ghost theologically impossible, since Joseph was clearly a mortal human being with a physical body, despite his description of the Holy Ghost as a spirit.

My mission president believed it. Once at Ricks College I had a friend who asked Elder Marion Hanks about it. He said he didn't know.

Mt personal belief is that he was the Horny Ghost.

the holy ghost is a spirit, how the heck can Joseph Smith be the holy ghost ??

Oh, I forgot, this is not supposed to be logical, or make sense, or even follow their own teachings.
Just throw out something and let people surmise, conclude, and make it up as they go along, forgetting what they believe in the first place.

I've been trying to find more information on this belief too. I read that some of Joe's wives wrote in their journals that he had told them he was the Holy Ghost.

The belief could be one that he was trying out on a few of the insiders before making it more widely known, like he did with polygamy. On page 91 of Todd Compton's "In Sacred Loneliness" there is a quote from a letter written shortly after Joe's death that refers to "our god Joseph." Also after he died, some of his wives said that he had begun to teach reincarnation.

This would make sense from the standpoint of how his manic ego was developing. Just before his death he ran for president and had himself crowned king. What would be left except becoming a living god, like a Roman emperor?

Yeah, he was probably working on Julius Caesar, reincarnated, as the next doctrine to try and float with the gullible.

I'll bow my head and say amen to that.

I'm not sure who was called to serve as the Great Pumpkin.

Is this something Smith took from Islam? Islam teaches that Mohammed is the second comforter foretold by Christ and others...in essence Mohammed is the HG.

on. HE said he would be "a Mohammed to this generation" or something like that.

Good grief. No, I've never heard of that one before, and I thought I knew all the weird stuff.

There's no limit to that man's ego, if he ever hinted at such a thing. He strikes me as a total narcissistic personality.

It seems anything and everything is possible with those who choose the religion fantasy. And why not?! If the improbable, the impossible, the illogical, and the unthinkable can happen any day now simply because some man said some god said it will happen, then why not believe that JS is the holy Ghost?! It's not any more convoluted than, say, a family taking a cruise during a heavy rainstorm with a bunch of the neighborhood animals an age or so ago.

Sadly, when I was young and dumb, I listened to and believed the religion nonsense in general and the mormon nonsense specifically. Happily, I became educated and understood, for myself, how harmful it is to believe in and to preach delusional concepts.

JS is the holy ghost? No, he is the godhead...the real three in one deal! I'm sure there are documents hidden somewhere in the secret vault that only need to be discovered by a faithful BYU histohack to verify this. I testify this is true, because the holy ghost bore witness to me it is so.

Glad2B Out, though I wish I would have walked away earlier than I did.

How can he be the Holy Ghost when he taught that the Holy Ghost was simply the power that unites HF & Jesus? I am sure he loved people thinking he was one of the members of the godhead!

HA! Yeah, that's all hilarious. He's about as bad as that Jesus guy, always claiming to be God. People like that should be killed.

he was most assuredly the holy ghoul

the exhumation of alvin was a pretty wild idea for family home evening you gotta admit

the smith home was host to a legion of demons

halloween must have been a hoot

Joseph Smith was full of himself and this Holy Ghost "idea" of his just goes to show how out of control his narcissism was.

Joseph being the Holy Ghost is something that polygamist sects
bandy about and argue over.

Is that why paintings of the Holy Ghost always show a blurry guy, so we can't tell it's Joseph Smith?

You want to mess with a Mormons mind?

Tell them the God head is made up of the Father....the Sun and the Holy Ghost

But what if the holy Ghost was really Heavenly Mother

That would make sense as to "GodHead" to a Mormon and the family thing...lol

That's new to me.. But I have heard repeatedly that JS is somehow elevated personage in Heaven to the point that we'll each have to meet him and be judged by him. Lots of old religions seem to have elevated their sages and prophets to some god-like status in the afterlife...

We talked about this on my mission in the 80's. He did make the statement that he would be killed for blasphemy if he said who he really was. I think it is in the book, Teachings of the Prophet JS. Anyway, as all good mormons know, the HG needs to get a body just like everyone else so it doesn't take too much to connect the dots.


"I don't think it ought to be blasphemy, just saying Jehovah. Look, all I said to my wife was, that bit of halibut was good enough for Jehovah."

Only if the Holy Ghost is an ill-tempered, adulterous, illiterate, convicted criminal with a penchant for pedophilia and dishonoring the trust of those he had power over.

I think the HOly Ghost should demonstrate good character. But then, Mormons might say that God the Father chose a ghost of low character to show the other ghosts that their sins did not disqualify them to come to the earth and collect women and power.


Kathleen Waters

Some people (like my seminary teacher) speculate that he was a bold descendant of Jesus... Which, if you're a Christian, is probably even more blasphemous

Sorry typo *blood

The only thing holey about JS was his streaked undies.