As a kid (non-mormon) I was taught the bible was the word of God and I learned at a young age that you just didn't question it. However I was disturbed by many of the teachings. I think this programming followed me when I became a mormon because I was afraid to simpre say "that is disgusting" or "that sounds like a plain lie", even when I felt uncomfotable with whatever it was.

Thanks you RfM I can finally say it.

The story of Abraham made no sense to me. Why couldn't God just protect them without Abraham having to lie. Why couldn't God just give Sarah a child at a younger age since he was going to give them a son anyway. Instead he made then suffer all those year. Why dragged Hagar (is that the name) into the whole thing and have a child abandoned by his father. Look at the mess it's created. All the wars that could have been avoided.

Why would a mother prefer one kid over another, even from the womb. Lie to her dying husband and pretty much be deceitful. Why would she become an accomplice? Why would God not warn Isaac of this deceit? If I'd been Esau I'd be mad.

Had I lived in the times of Jericoh I'd rebelled against God because I wouldn't have been able to kill complete families.

Wouldn't it had been better to let Laman and Lemuel fall off the barge tight unto a dish and disappear in the ocean so the Nephite would have been good. Wouldn't it had been better that two men died than a whole nation fell in disbelief, I mean that was the whole idea wit Laban, wasn't it.

If the men in the early church were just helping the widows, why did they need to sleep with them. It sounded to me like they were just taking advantage of the situation. True charity wouldn't have asked for anything in return, right?

And who was that who was going to be burned but was miraculous walking on the fire without being burned? Good for him, but the poor guards didn't need to die, they probably have families too. I found that just evil. Why were some people worthy of being saved while others were just labeled as evil.

Why would there be 10 plagues, why didn't God soften Pharao's heart sooner, even before killing of those young kids?

And why did people always had sons. Where were the daughters? Unless they were not important to be mentioned.

And the list goes on.

Where you also afraid to questions "the scriptures"?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/27/2013 06:16PM by deconverted2010.

I spent a lot of time and energy trying to justify the actions attributed to God's will in the Bible. It was exhausting.

I was afraid to question. It didn't really occur to me to question until much later. I only knew that "God" was one loose cannon. The Abraham story and the flood were disturbing to me as a child. "See how much he LOVES you?"

I remember all the excuses: "Oh, that was just the way it was at the time." "You see, Jesus fulfilled the law." WTF? He was supposed to be God and he felt the need to fulfill a bunch of crazy laws? Why didn't he come out and say, "I never told you do do all that crazy stuff."

I guess I got the idea that somehow it was OK for God to favor some and be cruel to others. For example, I think that might be why we hear people thanking God for saving their lives instead of chastising God for killing their neighbors when a tornado hits their hood.

Finally I had to admit that if God gets credit for everything, he also gets the blame. Justifying the Bible stories as having divine guidance can damage a person's common sense, IMO.

The excuses made it worse. I'd think but, wait a second, isn't God the same yesteday, today and forever? Isn't he unchangeable? At some point I decided to dismiss the OT altogether and concentrate on the NT. But there were so many contradictions. You know how much prayers I offered to 'receive wisdom' 'beforgiven for my questioning' and to 'find truth'.

Then with the mormon teachings the idea of the Abrahamic covenant came back, I justified all the temple rituals by thinking they were from the time of Abraham and therefore they didn't need to make sense. Just obey.

Realizing all the abrahamic religions come from that same guy kind of sealed it for me, all are man-made. And the bible is just the history and fables of those who conquered and wrote it at that time. After the initial fear and sadness, it becomes a relief to know.

Esau was an honest soul even if he was like a big old bumbling fella who meant well. Jacob was a liar, a sneak, and a thief. So God hates the guy who's trying and looooooooooooves the creep. Joseph Smith reminds me of Jacob.

I hated this story so much! I always felt so bad for Esau, so unfair. I hated the story about Jacob & Rachel even more. Poor Leah :( And don't even get me started on the story of the prodigal son.

Same here. And the part when Esau and Jacob meet again after many years confirms what Doxi said, Esau was the decent guy. Jacob was just afraid of what his brother would do, because he knew he was guilty.

Yes, Rachel and Leah. I thought everybody lost here, except for the lying greedy father who got all those years of labour for free. I disliked how the Institute manuals would try to justify the actions and say "he didn't lie because it was the custom of the time and it was implied that..", yeah whatever.

Philosophy: Questions that may never be answered.

Religion: Answers that must never be questioned.


https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151616253550155&set=a.496176595154.294030.8798180154&type=1&theater

Lol

There is very little good in the Bible. I came to realize that by the time I was 16 years old. I may have stopped believing much earlier, but I had hope that there was some good use for a lot of stuff. The OT is misunderstood, mistranslated, & misused by so-called "Christians". If you want to study the OT, go talk to a rabbi. As for the NT, it's an example of how someone's life (if Jesus did live as just a man), as well as regular stories, can be turned into extreme fantastical fabrications.

deconverted2010 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> If the men in the early church were just helping
> the widows, why did they need to sleep with them.
> It sounded to me like they were just taking
> advantage of the situation. True charity wouldn't
> have asked for anything in return, right?

Right, widows, LOL

How it REALLY worked is exemplified by my Grandmother's story.

She was coerced into an arranged "marriage" (it's in quotes
because it was not really a legal marriage) at age 17 with an
already married man who was 34--twice her age.

She tells in her life story how she had to work her whole life
for her support and that of her children.

So she was a teenager, not a "widow," and he DIDN'T support
her but he did have kids by her. "taking advantage of the
situation?" Ya think?

The widows and polygamy is what the well-intentioned but poorly-informed missionaries tokld me. Reading about stories like your grandmother's reveals how evil and self-serving those tyrants-turned-prophets were.

Someone asked on another thread, what made mormonism take, it's just occured to me that maybe it was the women who believed it or were stuck in it. They were the ones who produced the kids, supported them, taught them and kept them mormon. They were the ones who kept the men believing they were in heaven already.

Yep. Yep.

Reading the entire Old Testament on my mission was a real eye opener.

For a time I rationalized this in two ways:
1) I figured that anything before about king david was highly inaccurate. It was word of mouth myth that was written down many years later.

2) I decided that these people didn't necessarily represent god's will.

Even so - it ALWAYS bothered me. That's just how I tried to hold on to belief despite it not adding up.

Keep in mind that the Bible is not all prescriptive - what we should do. Rather a lot of the OT is simply descriptive. Look at all the train wrecks involving polygamy. I message I got was don't do it - not do it!

Agreed. In many cases they are telling stories of what is said to have happened,not advocating the behavior.

These stories probably started out as entertainment told around the fire. They were salacious and cruel (like soap operas). "Tales from the Crypt" can be entertaining, but would make for lousy source material for ethical training. "Batman" on the other hand . . .hmmmm.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/27/2013 09:50PM by crom.

I'm doing work for 2 separate Bible Thumpers.
One even has a Jeezus sign on the front lawn.

They really think I want to listen to their Bible babble while I work on their homes.

Oh yes, the OT. Never liked it. And when I wondered why all of these things, I was always told about what happened in the OT that it was because God's people was so hardheaded in those days.

I'm afraid I never was an old testament fan either. God seemed like a real mean mo$%er-%^cker. The stories sounded like myths, like the story of Job. I mean fire comes down from heaven and wipes out his family while they are having a picnic? Swell guy that God. Wiping out the Caananites, all of them, men, women, and children. Was that really necessary? The attempted sacrifice of Isaac by Abe seemed like child abuse. Of course the treatment of women was legendary in it's horrificness. The whole book is bull-$%it. I read it cover to cover one time and that was good enough.

And really, Leviticus and Deuteronomy, why do we need all that information on wave and heave offerings and basins for the blood and such? I mean, really......



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/28/2013 12:16PM by elciz.

"basins for the blood" reference please... I don't know what you're talking about.

I always wondered about the audacity that David had to cut off 200 guys foreskins, even cutting just one is sick but 200. I imagine him at 186 thinking yay, I only have to cut 14 more dicks....

Same for Sampson killing 1000 people WITH THE JAWBONE OF AN ASS? How big is that? 2 feet max? Tough jawbone. And imagine Sampson being able to get that close to them to kill them with a jawbone. What were they defending themselves with...leaves?

But my favorite is Solomon.
Think of what it would be rated if they did a reality show of his daily life with those 1000 or so wives and concubines. XXXXXXX? Even if he only boinked each girl once a year he'd have to do about 3 a day. Plus, I doubt he'd have limited himself to that.