Hi all,

I thought I'd finally introduce myself after 2 years of reading behind the scenes.

I became LDS at age 14. I joined because my closest friend was getting baptized.

I am a 3rd generation Mexican-American, but my folks rarely spoke Spanish in the home, and only to each other. I grew up in Los Angeles in the 1970s in a very liberal and multi-cultural setting.

My Catholic folks were happy about my baptism. But mom was dismayed when someone came up to me afterwards and asked me if I would be attending the Spanish Branch. She thought it smacked of segregation. I attended the "English speaking" ward and made many friends there, although I remember no other Hispanics in attendance.

Fast forward to BYU.

I despised BYU and felt lost there. I think I was one of two Latinas ... lol. I made friends with my roommates and made a point to live off campus.

I remember distinctly my journalism teacher telling the class that men should earn more than women because they had to support a family. Although I made good marks in Journalism and my GE courses, I would routinely get low marks in religious classes. I hated the BOM and its ravings about dark and loathsome Lamanites.

I never had one date at BYU. I was a short chubby bookworm -- the direct opposite of some of the tall leggy blondes on campus. I remember being obliquely referred to as "a special Lamanite spirit" by one of my bishops. To this day, that type of dehumanizing terminology still makes my stomach turn. I remember losing my virginity in my senior year in my off campus apartment to a very caring non-member. It was the best day of my young life, lol!

BYU had its perks. I took advantage of every opportunity to escape. I spent 6 mos in a Study Abroad Program in Europe. I did a student internship on the East Coast. I hiked in the Tetons and saw Yellowstone.

After graduation I fell away and did not have the courage to send in my resignation until 6 years ago when I was 50 years old. I was afraid that someone would come knocking on my door -- 2 missionaries actually did knock. My husband shooed them away.

Through the years I dabbled through a smorgasbord of faiths, always searching and seeking "truth." But about 3 years ago I saw a Joseph Campbell special about mythology, culture and religion, and my world-view changed in an instant.

I no longer assign meaning to the metaphor of Mormonism. I don't attend any church at the moment. I am on the fence about future religious participation. At the moment organized religion holds little value.

What made me come out of lurking mode? It was Elisabeth Smart having the guts to speak up about sexual repression and guilt in the LDS faith. Although she is TBM, she went public. I stand in awe.

When I was at BYU, the ERA Amendment was the hot topic. Outspoken women were getting excommunicated right and left in Provo and SLC. Although I secretly was for the amendment, my roommate was outspoken and wrote in her church resignation. I was aghast and thought she was a flake. She had real courage, whereby I had no guts at all, sigh.

Although I think she re-joined, I recently found her through Facebook and am curious to ask her how she stands now. In my heart, I think she will be as open-minded about all faiths as she was in the past.

I'm glad you're here. Your story is interesting. For a very long time i've wondered how mormons that have been given the label of Lamanite feel about that. Especially since the DNA studies have come out.

My husband was once asked if he would prefer to go to a Spanish speaking ward. He doesn't speak a word of spanish. He's German, French, Dutch, American born. He looks hispanic. It's led to some pretty entertaining stories.

I like your screen name....

Hi.
I lurk too and don't usually have anything to say.

I didn't know Elizabeth Smart came out and said that about mormonism. Do you have a link?
It sounds like she's coming out of denial. It will be interesting to see if she takes it any further.

Bottom line is you are out. I married around same time and my wife felt exactly like you; powerless. However passing years somehow gives you courage and you change stuff for the better.
Good post.

Thanks for sharing your story! You have been through much that I never have, namely the racism that is alive and well in many of the members of the church. Hope you stick around, I bet you have a lot to add!

Thank you all so much for your warm welcome. I have read many introspective and stimulating posts on this forum and I am honored to be a part of it.

Joan, there are threads on this Forum about Elizabeth Smart as recently as two days ago. She blames LDS "abstinence-only" education for making her feel virtually "worthless" after she was raped by her captor -- like a "chewed piece of gum."

Here is a link to Huffington Post article. Are we allowed to link to other websites?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/07/elizabeth-smart-abstinence-only-education_n_3231073.html?utm_hp_ref=college&ir=College

Some of us find the courage later on, but this girl has a strong backbone and I wish her well in her marriage and future life. She is a great communicator.

Welcome! I remember going to a BYU variety show back in the day. The "Lamanite Generation" was performing. As a nevermo, I was perplexed at the time. What's a Lamanite? I wondered. It was a long time before I got an answer to my question. BYU seemed like a world apart from my own college campus.

Thanks for sharing your story. As you discovered, Mormonism has little to offer those that don't conform to their ideal and does a good job of making them feel marginalized--in terms of racism, the Mormon church is one of the worst around.

I've also listened to Joseph Campbell before; I really like his explanations in "The Power of Myth."

Welcome out of the "lurking closet."

: )

I enjoyed reading your story. :) welcome

Welcome aboard. I also lurked for almost two years before posting and for the most past I do read more of what I post.

From the beginning of my church time I felt that the Spanish wards seemed to segregate people. I live in the Toronto, Canada, area where you have pretty much every nationaility, however, we only have Spanish and Chinese wards. There is no Russian or German ward for example.

It seems you left the church relatiely young, you may think you were not courageous enough then but you were certainly smart to leave. I am a convert and it took me over 20 years to figure out the real truth. I look back and see the doubts, the red flags, the cog-dis and all the signs that should have made me wake up, but they didn't. <sigh>.

I am free now and much more informed.

Bienvenida.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/14/2013 04:25PM by deconverted2010.

From one latina to another...great to see you here!

I've been very lucky. I experienced blatant discrimination for being Hispanic just once, and it occurred when I was a little girl, as I walked to school one morning. A grumpy old man, who was washing a storefront window, snarled something racial and it made me jump. He looked very hung-over at the time.

The discrimination I felt at church was really very subtle. In fact, I think that many church members who are generally polite and loving people within the confines of their LDS society, would be horrified to think they were even remotely discriminatory by viewing me as their "special Lamanite spirit." I suppose it all boils down to "intent."

One of my college teachers, who I consider a mentor and friend, told me that he felt that Lamanites would probably progressively become light-skinned by marrying into non-Lamanite families. Back in the day, I suppose that would be viewed as progressive thought. LOL.

Of course, this was 2 decades before the internet and DNA studies. Today there should be no excuse for such Lam-basting.

I was only active for 7 years -- much of it during my teens. My permissive family viewed Church as an occasional Sunday and Holiday foray into spirituality. They encouraged me to read any book I pleased, watch any movie, including films with mild sexual or violent content, and explore religion to my heart's content. Not much guilt there.

Because I was not raised in the Church, I left LDS culture relatively unscathed and with some good memories of youth campouts, dances, MIA, and seminary. Somehow, I sensed that that marrying into a strict LDS family, residing in Utah permanently, or going through the temple (Scary!) was not to be in my future.

I feel that it is probably a lot more painful and traumatizing for those of you born inside the Church, who must grapple with detaching yourself from family tradition, local cultural expectations, and a God who may (or may not) frown on such behavior.

I think the discrimination you feel, because you dare to question, is much more palpable than any I pain I have experienced as a brown sister in Christ.

All in all, the people in the church were good to me. Some were quite clueless, but they were never malicious.

Unlike you, my family converted from Catholism to Mormonism when I was about 2.5. My sister was born the day after they were baptized. We were raised in the Houston suburbs where my mom and dad held all kinds of positions. My dad became bishop and then the Spanish Branch leader all totaling to about 12 yrs. I went nuts when I went to a TX university because of the strict upbringing I had had and only reactivated a couple of times for a very short time after that. I could never get a settled feeling about the church and could never understand why. This board helped me out a lot with what kind of resources were available to debunk the so called truth.

Glad you're here!!

Dear dit,

Are your parents still active Mormons, and if so, were they disappointed when you left the fold? It must have been quite hard on you, as a child and young adult of an LDS bishop. I surmise that you and your family were held to a higher standard.

Did your dad ever raise any concerns or questions about the Lamanite theory? If he did, he must have felt very conflicted about being a bishop and having nagging doubts about the BOM.

I can relate to your unsettled feelings. At first, it's a vague undercurrent, but then the truth surfaces. What was the catalyst that caused you to leave?

My wife is a lamanite. My great grandmother was a full crow Indian. I didn't find this out until I was almost 20 years old and it answered a lot of questions I always had about my dark complexion. Apparently, it was an embarassing family secret for the mormons I grew up with.

I suppose this makes my son a Nephite-Lamanite?

Dear Albinolamanite,

Your screen moniker is terrific! That's fascinating about your grandmother's ancestry and how you found out about your heritage at such a late age.

One never knows about complexion, really. I remember attending a pow-wow and one tribe had many blond hair blue-eyed members. Not sure if it was through intermarriage, or if there are really indigenous tribes out there with natural traits.

Welcome aboard!....Glad to have you here!

Ron Burr

Interesting story senioritalaminita. I hope it's not to late to respond. The people in LDS culture do have some shortcomings. I would probably feel like an outsider too at BYzoo and I am a Mormon. Imagine growing up in SLC UT knowing absolutely nothing about any other faith but the Mormon faith. That's me. Imagine that you grow up in a home where the whole family is active and all go on missions, marry in the temple, all except for me. I had preconceived notions about what I would do after high school. I would marry my boyfriend when he comes home from his mission then I would figure out the rest. That's it. Instead I graduated from U of U. I didn't marry till I was 36. Had my first child at 39, my second at 40 then I was done. I don't live in UT. I'm not married to a Mormon. I have more knowledge and experience about other faiths. I am still Mormon but I have a better appreciation for my roots and my core beliefs than I did. When I met and married my husband I hadn't been to church for roughly ten years so it wasn't a priority for me to get married in the temple. I know people have bad experiences coming into the LDS Church. It wouldn't be a great feeling to be only one of two Hispanics on campus. We innately seek out our own kind. I think the bishop refering to you as a "special lamanite spirit" sounds like a misguided attempt to make you feel some inclusion. What can I say? He tried. The passage in the BOM that speaks of the Lamanites becoming a "dark skinned and loathsome people" as a result of wickedness can't be dealt with effectively. It's just there for everyone to interpret. And much to much time is spent dealing with it. Surprisingly,it is African American members who've been the most effective at explaining this more than anyone else.
I wonder why we couldn't just leave certain wording out. Couldn't we justI guess you have to think out of the box. After-all, it was the Lamanites that inherited the land in the end.

Welcome Braincloud!

As an active mormon, I hope you feel welcome here, though you'd be considered an outsider.


"I wonder why we couldn't just leave certain wording out."

Questions and questioning are very welcome here. You are expected though, to make a good faith (hah! I made a pun) effort to find the answers, at least in your heart/mind/bosom.

Having said that, you are now compelled to explore why the Book of Mormon "couldn't just leave certain wording out." Because God isn't an adequate answer, even to you, else you wouldn't have written that.

You may have to read about the process of the interpretation. Not just on LDS.org. Reading glowing words on a rock in a hat would be reading, not interpreting. Why is that considered so amazing? Any child could do it. Why isn't the process honestly in most church publications? Why is it hidden from the average member until very recently?

Then, you have to explore why dark skin was a curse? Could it have had anything to do with a prophet who was a man of his times? Was Brigham Young a racist? Why was the priesthood ban, a doctrine, overturned by vote of the Q12? What was happening in the secular world at that very time? Did divine guidance fail?

Then you have to ask about when else God led the church in the wrong direction and look at not one, but two manifestos ending polygamy? And what about that Mark Hofmann guy? Why didn't the lord save 2 lives and give someone the spirit of discernment, before 2 apostates exposed the whole fraudulent affair?

I could go on. The fact is, you came to a place ex-mormons come to heal, and asked a question. You need to explore both why you're here, and why you're questioning.

When you feel uncomfortable, and you will, we'll be here to help you understand what you're finding, and the emotions you're feeling.

Good luck, and you're strong enough to accept the answers you find, once you start looking.

I hadn't read your story before, SenoritaLamanita, so I'm glad this got resurrected.

Did you ever have it whispered about you that you must be sinning, because you were getting darker? Like around August or September?

Now that I know I'm actually of Asian extraction, I don't feel so badly about loving sushi. But I'd be lying if I didn't say I'm still looking for a Mexican-Japanese restaurant, serving Mexican Rolls: raw fished surrounded by Spanish rice, wrapped in a very thin strip of corn tortilla. With a choice of Sapporo or Corona beer...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2016 03:33PM by elderolddog.