I'm an admissions officer for a state university - I was appalled when I heard young people were being told from the pulpit at GC that they could receive 2 year admission deferments...maybe this is true in Utard but not the Midwest. After making it the whole weekend without hearing any audio of conference, my peace was lost this morning when I checked my messages at work.

The first thing I heard after a pleasant weekends was Relief Society voice. A woman was calling because one of her church leaders had told her that her son could receive a 2 year deferment to serve a mission. I called her back and let her know that this is not the case at out university - admission can only be deferred for a semester, otherwise the student will just be encouraged to reapply when they are ready to begin school. She was outraged that I would accuse her leader of lying! Not at all, it's just not how it works at a lot of state schools. She actually told me that she knew what her leader said is true...in the most polite way I could think of, I had to explain that my stack of applications for students wanting to start school each semester takes over a month to get through and that her leader had given her less than accurate research. In her defense, she apologized for the misunderstanding and thanked me...I told my director about it just to be safe...he seemed less than pleased that this advice would be offered at an international broadcast and said he might write to LSD Inc to inform them of their error. God I hope he does...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2013 05:02PM by sparty.

I should clarify that this is how our university does things - there may be some schools that will grant a deferment for a longer period. Most schools that I know of will only grant such a deferment after reviewing a special circumstance application. While some state schools MIGHT consider a church mission an acceptable circumstance and grant the request, the application exists for students who are experiencing illness, family emergency, or something generally considered to be out of their control. My guess is that most perspective missionaries are going to be told to reapply in 2 years. The good news is that if they are good enouhg to be accepted once, we will probably accept them 2 years later (unless they were iffy to begin with)

Douchebags. I'm sure they have strong-armed the Utah universities to do so.

I am sure they have. What makes this tricky is that Nelson made a pretty broad statement that I know is going to lead a lot of families getting ready to send their kids on a mission to make decisions on incorrect info. The reality is that in some cases, a student could mess up their financial aid if they don't discuss this with their college of choice first.

I don't think they care about that, just get them on a mission, and the fallout isn't the GA's problem.

twojedis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Douchebags. I'm sure they have strong-armed the
> Utah universities to do so.


Yes, a $4 million donation to the UofU Law School goes a long way towards greasing the skids.

If they have all these members calling and making inquiries, beating down the admissions people, they think the demand will prove that this deferment is needed, because the Mission service is so special.

Don't think these leaders don't know what they're doing, they're using the members again to get leverage and expand their influence.

That's interesting, Sparty. Please keep us informed of any further developments.

The longest college deferment that I've heard of is a year. One was for an elite level athlete who was training for the Olympics. He won two medals. The deferment came from a private university.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2013 07:20PM by summer.

Its all about the Mormons

West Point (and I am assuming the other military academies) allow a cadet to go on a mission and keep their spot but only after he/she has attended 2 years. I wonder if they will keep it that way. I'm surprised it was even an option at all.

I'm fairly certain they will - Service Academies get the cream of the crop as far as applicant go...doubt they are going to change their admissions practices for the Morg. Colleges are a little more willing to work with a student with deferred admission if the student is experiencing circumstances out of their realm of control. A church mission is 100% voluntary, so I doubt too many missionaries will be granted extended deferment.

This isssue is so stupid, I can't figure out why that hillbilly Nelson would even bring it up. RMs would have no problem starting college after returning - students take time off between high school and college all the time. For any RM having a hard time gaining admission to a college, it is most likely an academic issue more than anything else. Some college admissions offices may be curious why there is a 2 year gap, but would be completely satisfied with the explanation of "church mission to ___" (any TBMs lurking, please don't give us any more info than that unless we ASK you for it! I don't care what church you go to and I don't want anyone to even be able to HINT that my decision on whether or not to let you in was influenced by your religious affiliation. This isn't BYU and that crape doesn't fly in grown up college). Nelson could have remained silent and wouldn't have hurt ANY potential missionary's chances of continuing their education.

All the more to get all Cult members to attend BYU. What, you're local university where you live won't give you a deferment??? Apply to BYU-- we'll give you one. Of course once we have you at BYU for 4 years after having spent 2 years on your mission straight out of high school, the goal is to that a person immersed in Mormon Culture and brainwashing every day for 6 years after you leave home, that you will be a life-long Cult member and tithe payer. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

When I got called up for military service the university said the deferment was only good for a year unless I wrote a special appeal.

It is pretty inaccurate info, in my opinion and semi-decent schools aren't going to bend for that. There is a lot of year to year competition for spots, they can't just hold on to them for some kid to be a door-to-door salesman for two years.

I'm truly clueless since my kids are younger, but my oldest is on track for med school, says he wants to be a doctor, and I have no doubt he will do so. He's already top of his class, and a 7th grader acing freshman algebra and earning high school credit in middle school.

He has his sights set high, and this is already eating at me, him wanting to put off school for a mission.

Can anyone answer my question? I'd like to know, should he choose to put off school for a mission, and supposing he will be offered many scholarships, and he declines them, will he be able to reapply when he returns home, and still be entitled to any scholarship money?

I would be devastated to see him walk away from that financial advantage, in order to spend 10k on a mission. Ouch!

Depends on the scholarship. If the scholarship is from the SCHOOL, then he MAY be able to apply for it when he applies to college after his mission (not all scholarships are the same - make sure he researches all the requirements for scholarships he is considering applying for). Many times, private scholarships are a mixed bag of tricks. Some scholarships allow students to apply after taking a break from school, others will not.

This is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT though: for MOST scholarships, if he applies for the scholarship and then goes on a mission the scholarship will be lost. Always research each scholarship before applying (some may have deferment options), but most scholarships I know of are lost if they aren't used for the upcoming school year. Again, this MAY NOT be the case for the ones your son is exploring.

Just curious if your handle has anything to do with your university...if so we are just up the road from you at another university, and our admissions process is the same.

If he truly wants to be a doctor do NOT let him go on a mission.
He needs to keep going to school or he will lose his momentum.

Going on a mission will fvck with his head and by the time he returns he won't be able to get back to where he was.

I have seen this happen to several young men now,don't let it happen to your son.

I'm SO NOT in favor of anyone serving a mission, but just wanted to let you know that the majority of Mormon doctors who are friends of mine served missions.

Having said that, again, I DON'T WANT ANYONE TO GO ON A MISSION.

Vulture, Sparty is the expert here, but I can add my two cents. My pre-med TBM daughter finished high school a couple years ago and was awarded several very nice private scholarships that pay out 25% per year over a four year period. She HAD been planning on leaving on a mission this summer UNTIL she learned that she would lose all the remaining two years of scholarship money; it would not be deferred. Thank gawd she is practical enough to have made the wise decision to stay in school.

I work at a large community college in CA, and given the severity of the state budget crisis here in regards to higher education, I would be *extremely* surprised if either of our public university systems allowed departments for that reason. They have already put a moratorium on acceptances in some disciplines for students who would not need to defer.

Thank you everyone, for the information. It has confirmed my worst fear. I do not know how to accept the fact that my child is so brainwashed that he is likely to choose a mission over med school.

Making matter worse is that his father, my ex, is feeding his mind all the momron drivel and the kid is buying it. I cannot make this a war between "my way" & his dad's way or there is no chance for my son to go to school instead of a mission.

I have to tread carefully. I can already imagine my son's agony when it comes time to make this decision.

I hope like nothing I've ever hoped for before, that he is wise enough to realize that if he throws school money away, he may never see it again.

Although, stupid moron thinking says, "if you are obedient, it will all work out". Vomit.

Thanks again, all you experts. This mama needs all the guidance she can get.

For Utah schools it makes sense to allow deferments. If they didn't they wouldn't get fewer applications from TBM students and that could be bad. In addition allowing the deferments doesn't negatively effect a Utah school's enrollment because they are constantly cycling in and out. The only draw back for Utah schools is that it kills their graduation statistics.

Schools that aren't in Utah are entirely different ball game. There is literally zero benefit to having an across the board policy, especially on brand new students. For students that have already taken some course work a case by case review is probably the best route.

Regardless, Nelson is smart enough to know this and he was speaking out of his ass. This just serves as one more indication that he and his fellow co-conspirators are in on the fraud.

I also teach at the university level, although not in Utah currently.

Federal student aid budgets are getting slashed, as are university budgets thanks to the sequester. State aid is decreasing, too. Universities are constantly having to do more with less each year, even in Utah. With such trends happening, students and their parents would be foolish to assume that a prospecive missionary will be able to get a deferment, let alone a guarantee of financial aid when they return.
Even if those deferments exist now, things could (and probably will) change by the time the RMs try to get back into school.

Of course, there are lots of hard-core TBM parents living in the past who will shrug it off and just tell the new RMs to work and put themselves through school at the same time. With rising tuition, fees, books, and living expenses, such a notion is a fantasy, at least in most parts of the country. Even if a student attends the cheapest community colleges and state universities available, they'd have to be making the equivalent of a middle-class salary in order to pull off such a feat -- never mind the inherent difficulties of trying to juggle a full-time job and make satisfactory academic progress towards the desired degree.

Given that many classes "expire" after a certain number of years, a working student trying to put themselves through college could easily find themselves having to re-take expired courses or take more/different classes due to changing catalogs and requirements. Under these conditions, it could take 6-10 years to get that bachelor's degree. Given that RMs are already going to be 18-24 months behind all the students who didn't go on missions, they're going to be even less competitive on the job market when they have to take extra years to work and complete school.

(I know a number of people to whom this scenario has happened. It's not pretty).

The women will have it even worse; there's a nasty cultural model for them to drop out, have babies, and put hubby through. Most of them never go back (which is why Utah has the lowest rate of women completing college in the US).

Unfortunately, the trend nationally is for more and more entry-level jobs to require bachelor's degrees.

The last thing we need is GAs feeding false information to TBMs in order to reassure them that the gates of higher ed will swing open for them upon their victorious returns from the mission field. Plenty of students and their parents are going to get scr#wed over by naively believing.

From my experience and understanding of the highly competitive nature of the admissions process for many colleges on the east coast, this notion of being accepted while simultaneously being granted a 2 year deferment for what amounts to "I have other, more important things to do for that time" is utterly, hilariously laughable.

Seriously completely delusional.

Keey-riste. Only in the morridor is such a fubar approach to higher education seen as normal.

A friend who went to Yale said it was easier for military dudes to take off time from school than it was for him to get things organized to come back after a two-year mission.

Why apply if you know you are going on a mission? I understand that they just lowered the age limit but some of these stories happened in the past, so why did they apply to college if they knew they were going on a mission?

Well Great. Now I should probably find out if my sister thinks she's getting a deferment because her "leader" told her or because her school told her.

She's supposed to leave in May.

My friend going to Ohio State got a 2 year deferment. He even had a half ride scholarship and they still allowed him to take the two years off and keep the scholarship.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot, the vice president is lds...

I suppose it would've been a "big deal" to me if I had been rejected. But anytime I left BYU for either Fall or Winter semester I had to re-apply to get back in, even when I had just 4 GE classes to go for my BS degree. This happened to me 3 times.

1. My first time at BYU was for summer term before my last year of HS. Thus for my first Fall enrollment I had to re-apply and I was re-admitted.

2. My second time was after me taking off 2 years from college because I was keeping a promise I had made if had grown a foot or two. In my last year of work trying to convince people I had the world's most important message I processed my re-application to BYU and was re-admitted. In hindsight I should've done something else for those 2 years but alas I was a zombie for a megabucks corporation.

3. After a year of being in school post-mission I took Fall/Winter off to go work in Europe and I had 4 GE classes to go to get my BS. So I re-applied to BYU and was re-admitted.

This is an issue that stuck in my crawe when I was LDS. I told both my kids that they would NEVER give up scholarships awarded to go to college just to serve a stupid butt mission.

In my book, anything that interferes with a college education is so offensive, I can't type the words I want to here.

Nothing nothing should ever interfere with your scholarships and college education. Sure, there are a lot of LDS doctors and dentists...how many of them have rich parents that can afford to buy their married kids houses and help with the groceries? Many in my area BUT there are also many here in debt to their earballs with student loans. How many LDS claim bankruptcy? Let the LDS church put all those facts together and give an honest accounting of how people fare when putting their education on a back burner. Tell them that they may have to go to the Bahamas or some other island medical school that they can afford and because of the following paragraph.

With the rising cost of Universities and colleges, anyone who prolongs getting their degree is just certifying that they will owe more than had they gotten their degree right away. Plus there is STIFF competition from other countries in the US for certain medical programs. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I know, I have watched my daughter (who did make it) and others compete for spots in Nursing programs. It ain't easy and many are vying for these spots.

Are LDS college aged girls and boys up to snuff to handle this? Oh please, it's time for the Mormon world to get real. Unfortunately the only thing LDS is real about is using and abusing people for their own ends, no matter what label they stick on it, it's still abuse...

Tell him he can be a medical missionary later and be much more helpful to people! Keep giving him that direction.

Steve Young's brother who might have been even a better QB served a mission and never met his potential as a QB on his return because of a parasite he got on his mission, later became a doc.

I did comment on this at the time as I was outraged!
My son goes to what would be considered here in the UK a very good university ( proud mummy sorry - but he worked hard for it).
There is not way on this earth that he would have been granted a hold of place for 18-30 months. Maybe a year max, if what he was doing in that year was relevant to the degree he is taking.
I am passionate about education and this lack of flexibilty by the church angers me so much.
I know he could have gone on a mission, and then applied on return and would have gained a place somewhere,but I am willing to bet not where he is now if he had had up to 3 years out of learning.
I have felt guilty at times for him not going, but am slowly getting there.