Just got home from Relief Society. Teacher told the story about the wife of Thomas B. Marsh and the dispute she had with another women over milk strippings. According to the story, the dispute was eventually taken to JS. Then--the teacher stated that Thomas B. Marsh left the Church over this incident and his leaving prompted Governor Boggs to sign the infamous extermination order.

How does anyone get from a dispute between two women to Governor Boggs issuing an extermination order? Talk about shoving the blame onto women!! I even felt some guilt for a few seconds! %#@%*!

If this is true, why would Thomas Marsh value milk strippings over the very gospel of God?

Cat fight! Seriously, messed up logic.

ROTF LMFAO

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,42220,42220#msg-42220

Years later, in 1864, George A. Smith claimed in a sermon that Marsh had left the church because of a dispute between his wife and other Mormon women over a milk cow. Although this tale has made its way into Mormon folklore, Smith’s statements are not supported by any contemporary evidence.[3]

Here's a TBM thoughts on the Marsh story and the RFM board--same old, same old--is this an apologist?



kittywaymo
April 23, 2007 at 12:55 am

Have you ever looked at the RFM board? If these poor folks aren’t bitter, offended,some even hateful and angry, who on earth is?

In regards to Marsh, my husband, a descendant of Joseph has journals describing what happened. There is a lot more to this story, and because of hearsay, gossip etc. etc. (I refer to human nature in general, although RFM has a great rumor mill going) stories turn into “tall tales” etc..brother Marsh along with many other key brethren came back (including Martin Harris! who gave plenty of revenue etc. and felt very wronged yet never denied his testimony(ies).) to the Church, these men, like many faithful members today, are well-educated original thinkers, not brain-washed neophites as dissaffected members will have you think…

Forgive the stereotyping, but in my 20 years of writing and studying anti-mormon culture, I am amazed at the “blindness” and one-sidediness if you will, of this particular group of folks.

We are all just human beings doing the best we can, trying to find happiness etc. Blaming the Church for one’s mistakes, divorce, unhappiness, addictions etc. is a “cop-out” as we say in NY, and like Elder Bednar said, we are responsible for our own feelings and reactions. I left judiasm and I don’t picket and fight with the Orthodox Jews over issues that I’m not happy with or abuses that went on (my dad was a Rabbi, the same problems exist in that religion as in all humankind communities of offensive behavior)… why is it so important to rehash the same old tired anti-mormon stories? So a group of men, calling themselves Danites existed or didn’t exist, the point is the Church doesn’t go around trying to kill people that bad mouth it.. if that were the case we wouldn’t be “blessed” with Lonnie Pursiful and the Street Preachers Association dangling garments from a stick and screaming that mormon women are harlots at General Conference…

Well, I get emotional, that’s what happens when you’re DNA is Greek and Jewish, just ask Tom Murphy, who has yet to get his Phd in a non-DNA field, anthropology…

BEst wishes,

Kittywaymo (shelah:)

kittywaymo would be an embarrassment to the synagogue. If she wants to study anti-mos, she has had five years to correct the misspellings she employs; "neophites dissaffected"? Crack a dictionary.

neophite nephite? ha ha ha ha

ROTF LMFAO...

I haven't had a good laugh like this in a long, long time...LOL LOL LOL

You basically said there was a lot more to the story. Indeed there was. There were a lot better reasons to leave the church than "milk strippings". Do you care to elaborate on what those reasons were?

I find it interesting, that your post focused on discrediting the "exmo community" as if we are a cohesive bunch who all are afflicted with negativity and blaming tendencies. That's called ad hominem, or personally attacking the other side, instead of discussing the issue, which was Thomas B. Marsh.

Do you REALLY think anyone would walk away from eternal salvation over some milk fat?

The church has a habit of making people who leave out to be bitter and disgruntled. I personally have family members who I very clearly explained my doctrinal reason for leaving to. And then they later accused me of leaving because I was mad. It's like members are purposely ignoring WHY people leave. I think it's a defensive mechanism. Perhaps that's easier than allowing themselves to examine the real reasons.

The lady referred to is engaging in a version of speaking in tongues I've identified as "Reformed Nibleyese."

George Smith is to blame because he's the one who made the story up.

It's imaginary -- like most "Faith Promoting Lies" going around today.

Right. The "milk strippings" story is entirely fabricated, and is engineered to make it seem like Marsh left the church over simple and silly offence. He actually left when he could not support looting and burning by Mormons when they attempted to take over Daviess Co. and drive non-Mormons out of their "God-given" land.

More on Marsh: http://mormonthink.com/glossary/thomas-marsh.htm

My memory my be incorrect but I believe G.A.Smith stated in his 1860's talk that the milk strippings incident demonstrated an "attitude" that would later lead to his apostacy. That statement is probably true because it showed an attitude in which he would use his brain to determine if something is right or not and would call out others on bad decisions. When he saw the Danites leaving Far West and coming back from Galatin with wagons full of pilferred goods, he used his head and left his fellow saints who were making very bad decisions. Did his attitude lead to his apostacy - Yes, did his apostacy have an impact on the extermination order - Yes, was his attitude wrong - No. If more members held the leadership accountable for their decisions, TSCC would be a much better organization. By the way, others who left for the same reason but soon after came back were William Phelps and Orson Hyde and they both gave depositions that influenced Bogg's decision on issuing the extermination order.

I have read a few accounts that said that JS came onto Marsh's wife and this story was made up to dismiss them as petty people.

Maybe it was all a big misunderstanding...maybe what JA smith mean was that Mrs. Marsh's big milk strippings brought all the boys to the yard.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/25/2013 07:25PM by kori.

The question in my mind was "what the hell is milk stripping?" Used my friend Google and found out it consists of removing the last of the milk from a dairy animal.

So how would the animosity between humans result?

Nobody would risk their eternal salvation on a bunch of milk. Only someone close enough to Joseph Smith to know it was all made up crap would do that. Sounds like a testimony of one of Joe's friends, testifying Joe is a fraud.

I can't believe the Mormons are still wringing their hands about some Communist dispute that happened almost 200 years ago.

lol yeah that's right!

Don't even mention the Symonds Rider matter.

I can't believe they are still telling this old rag at church.
This is the best example they can come up with?
It just shows that Mormons really don't ever forgive anyone. Even 200 years after their dead and gone the Mormons will still be telling this story as an example.

If you know the truth about the story, what it really is, is a fine example of how Mormons turn on people who don't do as they're told by the Mormons. Nothing pisses mormons off more than a member who is capable of thinking for themselves, and then does it.

There are thousands of examples they could use of people who left the church because they were angry. All they need to do is have a chat with an ex member who was sexually assaulted, only to have the church bend over backwards to cover it up.

Thanks ya'll for posting--great discussion, great observations and I know a lot more!!!

<Blaming the Church for one’s mistakes, divorce, unhappiness, addictions etc>

WOW! that explains everything, I thought it was someone offended you

addictions? is that an excuse for a masturbation thread?

Mistakes? yes, WE blame the church for all it's mistakes

Divorce? yes WE blame the church for all the divorces caused by the church

Unhappiness? Yes the church is directly responsible for all the unhappiness it inflicts