Recovery Board  : RfM
Recovery from Mormonism (RfM) discussion forum. 
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In
Posted by: axeldc ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 06:08AM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: snowball ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 09:30AM

Some of the comments are great. Esp. the one about winds from Kolob.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: justrob ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 11:52AM

I hate that everyone here just says "Oh it's the inversion" like it's magically not our fault.

You can see the crap in the air right? So the only reason you're upset is because we can't blow this crap past the mountains to the people farther east?

You do realize that even in the Summer we have crappy air quality now, right?

Sure, the inversion exacerbates the problem, but it is already a big problem even without it.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: saviorself ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 12:31PM

Utah's crappy air quality was a big factor in my choice to move to the east coast in 1998. I thought that breathing Utah air was detrimental to my health and I am very happy to have left that problem behind.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: justrob ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 12:34PM

I lived in LA from age 5 to 11
Then moved to Idaho
I moved to Utah at age 22, and immediately got sick all the time.

Granted, there are a lot of life changes associated with moving, so I cannot say that it is because of the Air Quality, but because I get sick so much more & worse in the winter, it seems a likely candidate to me.

I have started talking to my wife about moving. She is very against it, but she also dislikes the bad air.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: gannosu ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 12:39PM

I wrote to my TBM siblings who loved Romney and live up and down the SL Valley:

"Anyone in the SL Valley in favor of "Drill, baby, Drill" to get more cheap oil and gas to the public so they can put more cars on the road and drive more? How about another oil refinery in North SL or expanded facilities?"

I should have added, how about another coal fired power plant?

The major polluter is the car and trucks.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: justrob ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 01:15PM

While vehicles are a major problem, and definitely need to be addressed, I disagree with the semantic "major polluter"

Vehicles are definitely the #1 carbon emitter, which is a problem, but it is less of a problem for our lungs than other pollutants.

Coal releases more immediately harmful pollutants, many of which do not stay suspended in the air as easily as carbon, and turn into ground and water pollutants.

While air pollution is a huge problem, fresh water pollution is equally huge, and isn't improved near as much by reducing cars or their emissions as by limiting coal and other combustion, sedimentation, and leaching of poorly disposed pollutants.

#YesImAHippie

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: John_Lyle ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 06:00PM

Actually, "Drill, baby, drill" was Sarah Palin...

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: order66 ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 06:23PM

I just posted the lyrcis to "Sal Tlay Ka Siti". Probably won't pass their moderators, though. I had to remove the last couple paragraphs to make it fit.

My mama once told me of a place
With waterfalls and unicorns flying
Where there was no suffering, no pain
Where there was laughter instead of dying
I always thought she’d made it up
To comfort me in times of pain
But now I know that place is real
Now I know its name

Sal Tlay Ka Siti
Not just a story mama told
But a village in Ooh-Tah
Where the roofs are thatched with gold
If I could let myself believe
I know just where I’d be
Right on the next bus to paradise
Sal Tlay Ka Siti

I can imagine what it must be like
This perfect, happy place
I’ll bet the goat-meat there is plentiful
And they have vitamin injections by the case
The war-lords there are friendly
They help you cross the street
And there’s a Red Cross on every corner
With all the flour you can eat!

Sal Tlay Ka Siti
The most perfect place on Earth
Where flies don’t bite your eyeballs
And human life has worth
It isn’t a place of fairytales
Its as real as it can be
A land where evil doesn’t exist
Sal Tlay Ka Siti

And I’ll bet the people are open minded
And don’t care who you’ve been
And all I hope is that when I find it
I’m able to fit in
Will I fit in?

Sal Tlay Ka Siti
A land of hope and joy
And if I want to get there
I just have to follow that white boy

You were right, mama
You didn’t lie
The place is real
And I’m gonna fly!

I’m on way
Soon life won’t be so shitty
Now salvation has a name
Sal Tlay Ka Siti

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Don Bagley ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 06:28PM

We used to have poor air quality in the Sacramento region, but regulation of several different types, combined with improved auto emissions and a reduction of heavy industry has cleared the skies.

Utah, famously anti-regulatory and industry friendly, continues to choke on its own rhetoric and smog.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: formermollymormon ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 06:30PM

In Dallas/Fort Worth we have "ozone alert days". They mostly happen when it's pretty hot and there hasn't been rain for a while. The air quality can be bad for days. It makes some people feel awful and others not so much. I don't know if it's worse than the temperature inversions in Utah or not. I know I hated those when I lived in Utah. Both make me feel crappy.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: justrob ( )
Date: January 25, 2013 10:45AM

I think I'm extra-sensitive to the air. I'm not asthmatic-- I definitely feel for those people when the air is terrible.

But when the air is bad, I stop breathing at night and wake up and have to cough out nasty things to clear my air passage.

It really scares me: to the point where I've started talking to DW about moving. She is FROM the place we live, and all of her family is here, and she does not want to leave... but if one of our kids had a blocked throat like I get and died, I would never forgive myself for not getting the H out of this place.

I do have a good job here, and I don't dislike the area... but my kids are 4 & 2 and I don't want to permanently damage their lungs capacity (which can lead to a premature metabolism slow-down), or induce asthma, or any other health problem.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: lostinutah ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 11:31PM

I was going to attend the U of Utah until I went up there and couldn't find the right exit because the pollution was so bad I couldn't read the freeway signs. I finally made it up to the U. and tried to look down on the city but it wasn't there, so I turned around and went home. Screw that idea I decided. Had a headache the whole time I was there (a few hours).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/24/2013 11:32PM by lostinutah.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: lostinutah ( )
Date: January 24, 2013 11:38PM

http://www.wunderground.com/blog/JeffMasters/article.html

Dangerous air pollution in Utah
The most dangerous weather in the U.S. this week is occurring in the valleys of northern Utah, where clear skies, light winds, and a strong temperature inversion have combined to create a dangerous 6-day long air pollution episode. (A temperature inversion occurs when air temperature increases with altitude, acting as a stable lid preventing atmospheric mixing; inversions are common in mountain valleys when high pressure dominates.) It's been unusually cold during most of January in Northeast Utah, with Salt Lake City on track to have its 3rd coldest January on record. The cold weather has caused people to use their wood burning stoves more than usual, resulting in high emissions of smoke. More than 100 Utah doctors delivered a petition to state lawmakers on Wednesday, demanding that authorities immediately lower highway speed limits, curb industrial activity and make mass transit free for the rest of winter. "We're in a public-health emergency for much of the winter," said Brian Moench, an anesthesiologist and president of Utah Physicians for a Healthy Environment. He estimated that poor air quality contributes to 1,000 to 2,000 premature deaths each year along Utah's Wasatch Front.


Figure 2. View of a smoggy Salt Lake City taken at 2 pm MST January 23, 2013. Webcam image courtesy of University of Utah/TimeScience.

Winds have remained below 6 mph for six straight days in Northern Utah, allowing fine Particulate Matter less than 2.5 microns in diameter (also called PM 2.5) to build up to unhealthful levels. PM 2.5, also known as particle pollution, is a complex mixture of extremely small dust and soot particles that lodge in the lungs and cause large increases in hospital admissions and excess mortality during severe air pollution episodes like this one. The federal standard for PM 2.5 is 35 micrograms per cubic meter, averaged over 24 hours. In Salt Lake City, fine particle air pollution has been above the federal standard for six consecutive days, with a peak value of 91 micrograms per cubic meter on January 19. In nearby Provo, Utah, the pollution has been much worse, with 24-hour average PM 2.5 levels more than triple the federal standard on Thursday morning, at 131 micrograms per cubic meter. If the PM 2.5 levels go above 150 micrograms per cubic meter, this will be in the "Very Unhealthy" category as defined by EPA. At this pollution level, the entire population is likely to be affected, and health warnings of emergency conditions are issued. Compounding the air pollution woes in Provo are high levels of nitrogen dioxide gas, which peaked at 98 ppb on Tuesday, just below the 100 ppb federal standard. Light winds and a strong temperature inversion will continue today, and freezing rain fell over much of the Salt Lake City area this morning, turning the roads into skating rinks, resulting in dozens of traffic accidents. Fortunately, the forecast for Provo calls for snow and rain this weekend due to a low pressure system, and the rain and winds associated with this low should be able to reduce air pollution levels significantly.

Options: ReplyQuote
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In


Screen Name: 
Your Email (optional): 
Subject: 
Spam prevention:
Please, enter the code that you see below in the input field. This is for blocking bots that try to post this form automatically.
 ********   **      **  ********  **          *******  
 **     **  **  **  **  **        **    **   **     ** 
 **     **  **  **  **  **        **    **   **     ** 
 **     **  **  **  **  ******    **    **    ******** 
 **     **  **  **  **  **        *********         ** 
 **     **  **  **  **  **              **   **     ** 
 ********    ***  ***   ********        **    *******