Recovery Board
: RfM
Recovery from Mormonism (RfM) discussion forum.
The Mormon Church’s relationship to cases of alleged pedophilia by LDS Boy Scout leaders is coming to light in the wake of a massive court-ordered release of documents known as the BSA's led “perversion files” dating back to 1953--evidence, which indicates a systematic and wide-ranging cover-up on the part of Boy Scout national headquarters.
Some of the details involve the Mormon Church.
_____
--Examples of Cases Found in the BSA’s Pedophilic “Perversion Files” Relating to the Mormon Church
*from the “Capital Gazette” in Maryland:
"An assistant scoutmaster in 1974 was accused of taking nude photographs of two boy scouts in [a Maryland-area] Arnold scout troop and later reportedly said he couldn't be held responsible because he was 'under the influence of the devil.'
“A month later, he was accused of harassing the troop at Sandy Point State Park. And though he was banned in Arnold from the scouts, he allegedly was allowed to be alone with them again five years later in Bedford, Pa. . . .
“. . . [T]he case file shows the scout master attempted to be a scout leader in several states after being banned in Arnold. He moved to Scottsdale, Ariz. and attempted in 1976 to apply as an adult leader there, but his attempts were refuted. In 1978, however, files indicate he was allowed alone with scouts in Pennsylvania. A letter from a scoutmaster there, dated May 1979, identifies him as a former scoutmaster of a troop sponsored by the Church of Latter Day Saints or Mormon Church in Bedford, Pa.”
(“Boy Scouts ‘perversion files’ include seven cases in Anne Arundel County, about 90 in Maryland,” by Alex Jackson, “Capital Gazette, Baltimore Washington Medical Center, 19 October 2012, at: http://www.capitalgazette.com/news/for_the_record/boy-scouts-perversion-files-include-seven-cases-in-anne-arundel/article_2c871efa-909c-5c83-b95b-13440c7e0b1a.html)
*from an Australian newspaper:
"’What these files represent is ... the pain and the anguish of thousands’ of scouts, said lawyer Paul Mones, while presenting details of the files at a press conference in [Oregon].
“Mones said the files ‘demonstrate the depth and breadth of the BSA's vast knowledge about the threats to scouts by scoutmasters and adult leaders who used their authority . . . to sexually molest generations of boys".’
“The lawyers highlighted a 2010 court case, in which an assistant scoutmaster in a Mormon Church-sponsored troop sexually molested a boy in the 1980s.”
(“US Boy Scout 'perversion files' released,” by Michael Thurston, “The Australian,” 19 October 2012, at: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/breaking-news/us-boy-scout-perversion-files-released/story-fn3dxix6-1226498994916)
_____
--Possible Legal Consquences Facing the Mormon Church
*from a “Forbes” analysis:
“Nobody likes seeing an institution like the Boy Scouts dragged into litigation. Especially over something as disturbing as child sexual abuse. But the very public data dump of “perversion files” that an Oregon judge authorized yesterday does represent one positive attribute of the U.S. legal system: It forces large institutions to rethink how they deal with problems that can affect thousands of individual victims.
“The value of these lawsuits is really not directed to any particular jury verdict or outcome,” said Timothy Lytton, a professor at Albany Law School . . . . ‘These lawsuits tend to frame the issue as an institutional problem, and not a personal problem involving a couple of bad apples.
“The lawyer who forced the public release of the Boy Scouts files probably won’t win too many popularity contests. Kelly Clark won a $20 million verdict against the Scouts on behalf of six plaintiffs in 2010, and his website lists other areas of practice that include ‘Mormon abuse’ . . . .
(“Boy Scout Case, Hate It Or Not, Shows Social Value Of Litigation,” by Daniel “Forbes,” at: http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielfisher/2012/10/19/boy-scout-case-hate-it-or-not shows-social-value-of-litigation/isher, “Forbes,” 10=9 October 2012)
_____
--How the Mormon Church May Have Tried to Shield Itself from Liability
*from LDS columnist Joanna Brookes, writing for “Religious Dispatches”
“[The] release of previously confidential files on child sexual abuse perpetrators maintained by the Boy Scouts of America from 1959 to 1985 are raising new questions about the relationship between the LDS Church and the BSA. Since 1918, the Church has partnered with the BSA, hosting scout troops in most of its United States congregations. . . .
“Today, a whopping 34% of Boy Scouts troops nationwide are co-sponsored by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. But sources who have scrutinized the BSA’s so-called ‘perversion files’ report that fewer than 2% of the cases documented therein are connected with Mormons. It is believed that LDS Church may have handled child abuse cases internally rather than reporting them to BSA officials.
“The LDS Church confronted patterns of child sexual abuse within its own ranks in the 1990s after several high-profile child sexual abuse cases resulted in multimillion dollar payouts to victims and their families. The Mormon Alliance, a grassroots Mormon organization that monitored abuse within the Church, published a study documenting negligence on the part of local members and leaders in addressing abuse—and even the excommunication of some victims and accusers. In 1995, the Church established stronger guidelines and new protocols for reporting abuse, including a 1-800 number for local clergy.”
(“Boy Scout ‘Perversion Files’ Raises Questions about Abuse in Mormon Contexts,” by Joanna Brooks, 19 October 2012, at: http://www.religiondispatches.org/dispatches/joannabrooks/6534/boy_scout_%22perversion_files%22_raises_questions_about_abuse_in_mormon_c)
**********
Batten down the hatches, Brethren.
The chickens are coming home to roost--and they're aiming for your wallets.
(related RfM thread: http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,677407)
**P.S.:
Lisa Davis--a solid and respected journalist who is a stickler for facts, a gifted writer and a former writer for the Phoenix, AZ, "New Times"--wrote a book entitled "The Sins of Brother Curtis: A Story of Betrayal, Conviction, and the Mormon Church" [New York, New York: Scribner, a divison of Simon & Schuster, Inc., 2011], 354 pp].
The LDS Church's defense of "Brother [Frank] Curtis"--a pedophilic LDS Scout leader who had been excommunicated and then, astoundingly enough, re-baptized, where he continued to have Mormon youth under his "care"--was disingenuous, disgusting and pure evil.
Lisa got in touch with me about the Curtis case, requesting background information on Mormon teachings and other matters. (For instance, we also talked about proper language and terminology she needed to use in her book, in order to have credibility with Mormon readers when speaking to Mormon history, doctrine and culture). (Lisa kindly noted my assistance under "Acknowledgements," p. 340; for an online version of the book, see: http://www.amazon.com/Sins-Brother-Curtis-Betrayal-Conviction/dp/1416591036#reader_1416591036).
When in the course of our discussions Lisa informed me that the Mormon Church had advanced the defense in behalf of Curtis that it (the Mormon Church) was doctrinally required to re-baptize Curtis once he had repented of his sins (Curtis was a convicted criminal with a history of sexual molestation of minors), I pointed out to her what I viewed as the relevant portions of Mormon doctrine which clearly applied to such an unwarranted defense.
I emphasized that as a response to the LDS legal/theological argument that re-baptism of repeat sexual offender Curtis somehow cleansed him of his past sins and that he had thus started over with a "clean slate," Lisa should review canonized Mormon doctrine on the matter, as found in D&C 82:7.
This particular "holy scripture" of Mormonism emphatically declares that a person--once forgiven of a sin but who then recommits the same sin--is subject to divine punishment for recommitting that sin, as well as becomes re-subjected to divine punishment for the sin in which he had previously engaged; for which he was originally forgiven; but which he then recommitted.
The pertinent D&C passage reads as follows:
“And now, verily I say unto you, I, the Lord, will not lay any asin to your charge; go your ways and sin no more; but unto that soul who sinneth shall the bformer sins return, saith the Lord your God.”
As one critic observed of this official Mormon doctrine:
“According to LDS Scripture, true repentance is confessing sin and forsaking it or never returning to it again. As former [LDS] prophet Spencer Kimball has said, 'The forsaking of sin must be a permanent one. True repentance does not permit making the same mistake again.' If you repeat a sin, all of your 'former sins return.' Therefore, on the LDS view it is not enough to try your best. Rather, you must stop sinning. Period."
(Brett Kunkle, "The Impossible Gospel of Mormonism,” at: http://www.str.org/site/PageServer?pagename=PL_article_impossible_gospel_mormonism ; see also the LDS tract, published by the LDS Church [1984], entitled "Repentance Brings Forgiveness," where the Kimball statement appears, p. 7)
This pathetic and desperate attempt by the Mormon Church's hired guns to absolve persistent pedophile "Brother" Frank Curtis of legal, moral and religious responsiblity for his sins of sexual predation (since he had been rebaptized and therefore was supposedly immunized from accountablity) is fundamentally undercut by Mormon doctrine itself.
Not that that fact matters one whit to the Mormon Church.
Worse than that, the fact that the Mormon Church would even attempt a defense of this perennial pervert is absolutely despicable.
As one reviewer of Lisa's book observed:
"Mormon Church leaders knew that Frank Curtis had a habitual need to molest young boys, yet they continued to place him in positions where he had access to more victims."
(Don Lattin, book review, "'The Sins of Brother Curtis,' by Lisa Davis," Special to "The Chronicle" [San Francisco], 19 March 2011, at: http://www.sfgate.com/books/article/The-Sins-of-Brother-Curtis-by-Lisa-Davis-2388166.php)
Indeed, as another reviewer noted, Curtis had "even been excommunicated, then re-baptized and returned to the positions from which he preyed upon children."
("Child Molester + Mormons = Easy Prey," by Ken Munger, "Sacramento News & Review," 15 March 2011, at; http://www.newsreview.com/sacramento/bibliolatry/blogs/post?oid=1939245)
It amazes and sickens me the extent to which the Mormon Church ignores its own doctrine in order to protect its bank account (not to mention how it grotesquely ducks its obligation to broader matters of human decency in delivering up for moral and legal accountability those who horrendously victimize young children).
Such an approach is obviously too much to expect of the corrupt Mormon Cult.
Edited 22 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2012 07:49PM by steve benson.
Some of the details involve the Mormon Church.
_____
--Examples of Cases Found in the BSA’s Pedophilic “Perversion Files” Relating to the Mormon Church
*from the “Capital Gazette” in Maryland:
"An assistant scoutmaster in 1974 was accused of taking nude photographs of two boy scouts in [a Maryland-area] Arnold scout troop and later reportedly said he couldn't be held responsible because he was 'under the influence of the devil.'
“A month later, he was accused of harassing the troop at Sandy Point State Park. And though he was banned in Arnold from the scouts, he allegedly was allowed to be alone with them again five years later in Bedford, Pa. . . .
“. . . [T]he case file shows the scout master attempted to be a scout leader in several states after being banned in Arnold. He moved to Scottsdale, Ariz. and attempted in 1976 to apply as an adult leader there, but his attempts were refuted. In 1978, however, files indicate he was allowed alone with scouts in Pennsylvania. A letter from a scoutmaster there, dated May 1979, identifies him as a former scoutmaster of a troop sponsored by the Church of Latter Day Saints or Mormon Church in Bedford, Pa.”
(“Boy Scouts ‘perversion files’ include seven cases in Anne Arundel County, about 90 in Maryland,” by Alex Jackson, “Capital Gazette, Baltimore Washington Medical Center, 19 October 2012, at: http://www.capitalgazette.com/news/for_the_record/boy-scouts-perversion-files-include-seven-cases-in-anne-arundel/article_2c871efa-909c-5c83-b95b-13440c7e0b1a.html)
*from an Australian newspaper:
"’What these files represent is ... the pain and the anguish of thousands’ of scouts, said lawyer Paul Mones, while presenting details of the files at a press conference in [Oregon].
“Mones said the files ‘demonstrate the depth and breadth of the BSA's vast knowledge about the threats to scouts by scoutmasters and adult leaders who used their authority . . . to sexually molest generations of boys".’
“The lawyers highlighted a 2010 court case, in which an assistant scoutmaster in a Mormon Church-sponsored troop sexually molested a boy in the 1980s.”
(“US Boy Scout 'perversion files' released,” by Michael Thurston, “The Australian,” 19 October 2012, at: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/breaking-news/us-boy-scout-perversion-files-released/story-fn3dxix6-1226498994916)
_____
--Possible Legal Consquences Facing the Mormon Church
*from a “Forbes” analysis:
“Nobody likes seeing an institution like the Boy Scouts dragged into litigation. Especially over something as disturbing as child sexual abuse. But the very public data dump of “perversion files” that an Oregon judge authorized yesterday does represent one positive attribute of the U.S. legal system: It forces large institutions to rethink how they deal with problems that can affect thousands of individual victims.
“The value of these lawsuits is really not directed to any particular jury verdict or outcome,” said Timothy Lytton, a professor at Albany Law School . . . . ‘These lawsuits tend to frame the issue as an institutional problem, and not a personal problem involving a couple of bad apples.
“The lawyer who forced the public release of the Boy Scouts files probably won’t win too many popularity contests. Kelly Clark won a $20 million verdict against the Scouts on behalf of six plaintiffs in 2010, and his website lists other areas of practice that include ‘Mormon abuse’ . . . .
(“Boy Scout Case, Hate It Or Not, Shows Social Value Of Litigation,” by Daniel “Forbes,” at: http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielfisher/2012/10/19/boy-scout-case-hate-it-or-not shows-social-value-of-litigation/isher, “Forbes,” 10=9 October 2012)
_____
--How the Mormon Church May Have Tried to Shield Itself from Liability
*from LDS columnist Joanna Brookes, writing for “Religious Dispatches”
“[The] release of previously confidential files on child sexual abuse perpetrators maintained by the Boy Scouts of America from 1959 to 1985 are raising new questions about the relationship between the LDS Church and the BSA. Since 1918, the Church has partnered with the BSA, hosting scout troops in most of its United States congregations. . . .
“Today, a whopping 34% of Boy Scouts troops nationwide are co-sponsored by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. But sources who have scrutinized the BSA’s so-called ‘perversion files’ report that fewer than 2% of the cases documented therein are connected with Mormons. It is believed that LDS Church may have handled child abuse cases internally rather than reporting them to BSA officials.
“The LDS Church confronted patterns of child sexual abuse within its own ranks in the 1990s after several high-profile child sexual abuse cases resulted in multimillion dollar payouts to victims and their families. The Mormon Alliance, a grassroots Mormon organization that monitored abuse within the Church, published a study documenting negligence on the part of local members and leaders in addressing abuse—and even the excommunication of some victims and accusers. In 1995, the Church established stronger guidelines and new protocols for reporting abuse, including a 1-800 number for local clergy.”
(“Boy Scout ‘Perversion Files’ Raises Questions about Abuse in Mormon Contexts,” by Joanna Brooks, 19 October 2012, at: http://www.religiondispatches.org/dispatches/joannabrooks/6534/boy_scout_%22perversion_files%22_raises_questions_about_abuse_in_mormon_c)
**********
Batten down the hatches, Brethren.
The chickens are coming home to roost--and they're aiming for your wallets.
(related RfM thread: http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,677407)
**P.S.:
Lisa Davis--a solid and respected journalist who is a stickler for facts, a gifted writer and a former writer for the Phoenix, AZ, "New Times"--wrote a book entitled "The Sins of Brother Curtis: A Story of Betrayal, Conviction, and the Mormon Church" [New York, New York: Scribner, a divison of Simon & Schuster, Inc., 2011], 354 pp].
The LDS Church's defense of "Brother [Frank] Curtis"--a pedophilic LDS Scout leader who had been excommunicated and then, astoundingly enough, re-baptized, where he continued to have Mormon youth under his "care"--was disingenuous, disgusting and pure evil.
Lisa got in touch with me about the Curtis case, requesting background information on Mormon teachings and other matters. (For instance, we also talked about proper language and terminology she needed to use in her book, in order to have credibility with Mormon readers when speaking to Mormon history, doctrine and culture). (Lisa kindly noted my assistance under "Acknowledgements," p. 340; for an online version of the book, see: http://www.amazon.com/Sins-Brother-Curtis-Betrayal-Conviction/dp/1416591036#reader_1416591036).
When in the course of our discussions Lisa informed me that the Mormon Church had advanced the defense in behalf of Curtis that it (the Mormon Church) was doctrinally required to re-baptize Curtis once he had repented of his sins (Curtis was a convicted criminal with a history of sexual molestation of minors), I pointed out to her what I viewed as the relevant portions of Mormon doctrine which clearly applied to such an unwarranted defense.
I emphasized that as a response to the LDS legal/theological argument that re-baptism of repeat sexual offender Curtis somehow cleansed him of his past sins and that he had thus started over with a "clean slate," Lisa should review canonized Mormon doctrine on the matter, as found in D&C 82:7.
This particular "holy scripture" of Mormonism emphatically declares that a person--once forgiven of a sin but who then recommits the same sin--is subject to divine punishment for recommitting that sin, as well as becomes re-subjected to divine punishment for the sin in which he had previously engaged; for which he was originally forgiven; but which he then recommitted.
The pertinent D&C passage reads as follows:
“And now, verily I say unto you, I, the Lord, will not lay any asin to your charge; go your ways and sin no more; but unto that soul who sinneth shall the bformer sins return, saith the Lord your God.”
As one critic observed of this official Mormon doctrine:
“According to LDS Scripture, true repentance is confessing sin and forsaking it or never returning to it again. As former [LDS] prophet Spencer Kimball has said, 'The forsaking of sin must be a permanent one. True repentance does not permit making the same mistake again.' If you repeat a sin, all of your 'former sins return.' Therefore, on the LDS view it is not enough to try your best. Rather, you must stop sinning. Period."
(Brett Kunkle, "The Impossible Gospel of Mormonism,” at: http://www.str.org/site/PageServer?pagename=PL_article_impossible_gospel_mormonism ; see also the LDS tract, published by the LDS Church [1984], entitled "Repentance Brings Forgiveness," where the Kimball statement appears, p. 7)
This pathetic and desperate attempt by the Mormon Church's hired guns to absolve persistent pedophile "Brother" Frank Curtis of legal, moral and religious responsiblity for his sins of sexual predation (since he had been rebaptized and therefore was supposedly immunized from accountablity) is fundamentally undercut by Mormon doctrine itself.
Not that that fact matters one whit to the Mormon Church.
Worse than that, the fact that the Mormon Church would even attempt a defense of this perennial pervert is absolutely despicable.
As one reviewer of Lisa's book observed:
"Mormon Church leaders knew that Frank Curtis had a habitual need to molest young boys, yet they continued to place him in positions where he had access to more victims."
(Don Lattin, book review, "'The Sins of Brother Curtis,' by Lisa Davis," Special to "The Chronicle" [San Francisco], 19 March 2011, at: http://www.sfgate.com/books/article/The-Sins-of-Brother-Curtis-by-Lisa-Davis-2388166.php)
Indeed, as another reviewer noted, Curtis had "even been excommunicated, then re-baptized and returned to the positions from which he preyed upon children."
("Child Molester + Mormons = Easy Prey," by Ken Munger, "Sacramento News & Review," 15 March 2011, at; http://www.newsreview.com/sacramento/bibliolatry/blogs/post?oid=1939245)
It amazes and sickens me the extent to which the Mormon Church ignores its own doctrine in order to protect its bank account (not to mention how it grotesquely ducks its obligation to broader matters of human decency in delivering up for moral and legal accountability those who horrendously victimize young children).
Such an approach is obviously too much to expect of the corrupt Mormon Cult.
Edited 22 time(s). Last edit at 10/19/2012 07:49PM by steve benson.
steve benson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "An assistant scoutmaster in 1974 was accused of
> taking nude photographs of two boy scouts in
> Arnold scout troop and later reportedly said he
> couldn't be held responsible because he was
> “under the influence of the devil.”
Ah, the "devil made me do it" defense.
-------------------------------------------------------
> "An assistant scoutmaster in 1974 was accused of
> taking nude photographs of two boy scouts in
> Arnold scout troop and later reportedly said he
> couldn't be held responsible because he was
> “under the influence of the devil.”
Ah, the "devil made me do it" defense.
I recently read the Lisa Davis book, "The Sins of Brother Curtis". It was right after Hurricane Isaac hit and we were without power for several days, but I couldn't put the book down so I read late into the night with a flashlight. I was very impressed with her telling of a compelling story and complicated legal case. Definitely worth reading.
Steve, I'm not sure I understand what Joanna Brooks was saying. Can you explain? Only 2% of the cases involve Mormons? And that is because the Morg handled them internally? Does this mean even though the BSA records are released, we will NEVER know the full extent of the abuse perpetrated in LDS sponsored troups? And will the Morg now be bragging about the 2% number being so low in comparison to the 34% of troups being affiliated with the Morg? If I am correct in how I read this, I am double pissed. And what is up with them excommunicating the victims?
. . . the reason why that percentage is so low may be, she surmises, that additional cases of alleged Mormon Scout leader pedophilia were handled and settled internally by the Mormon Church.
Which, to me, sounds like code for the Mormon Church dealing with its Scout leader pedophilia issues behind the scenes--and not reporting them to law enforcement authorities (This has historically been the BSA's approach, as well, as an examination of its own "perversion files" indicates).
I am sure the Mormon Church, with the help of its faithful surrogates, is looking for any which-way to get out of being held accountable.
Edited 12 time(s). Last edit at 10/20/2012 06:58PM by steve benson.
Which, to me, sounds like code for the Mormon Church dealing with its Scout leader pedophilia issues behind the scenes--and not reporting them to law enforcement authorities (This has historically been the BSA's approach, as well, as an examination of its own "perversion files" indicates).
I am sure the Mormon Church, with the help of its faithful surrogates, is looking for any which-way to get out of being held accountable.
Edited 12 time(s). Last edit at 10/20/2012 06:58PM by steve benson.
3 names of men from UT that were in the files were mentioned on the news last night with one name expanded on with background information. One of the names is a guy that I am related to through marriage! I had heard years ago some gossip about him but it was swept under the rug and I forgot about it. Kind of shocking.
The more these "Secret Files" are analyzed, the fewer opportunities Mormons Inc. has of "keeping things quiet" and destroying childrens' lives.
>>It is believed that LDS Church may have handled child abuse cases internally rather than reporting them to BSA officials.<<
Ah, two levels of institution shielding -- the Scouts and the church, and we know which one priesthood leaders was more concerned about protecting.
Ah, two levels of institution shielding -- the Scouts and the church, and we know which one priesthood leaders was more concerned about protecting.
This is one case where the Mormon obsession for keeping records has come back to bite them.
T-Bone
T-Bone
Not that I'm fond of unjustified or inaccurate Nazi comparisons. But they had a similar issue with all the record keeping they did. It works both ways. Useful for the record-keepers but also for examiners after-the-fact.
Stray Mutt's observation is insightful - that there are two layers of secrecy in this situation.
Tragic for those affected by it. It's not just a bad event occurring on one occasion - it's something that never leaves a person their entire life. To me, it is like murder in that the survivor doesn't get to have the life they should or would have had if the assault had not happened. It is something that can overshadow the survivor always as well as their nuclear family, perhaps, and their own family, as many survivors of this type of assault become addicts or even abusers, so I have read.
An example here in Canada is the First Nations communities where children were taken by the govt from their parents' care (on "reservations") and put into residential schools (like boarding school), many run by the Catholic Church, and large numbers of the children were physically and sexually abused. They grew up to become alcoholic and/or abusive and now the second and third generations are speaking out about the effect on them of growing up with alcoholic parent/s and/or abuse, so that is three generations, at least, that have been affected by abuse perpetrated by Catholic priests and nuns, and others, back in the 50s.
Now we're starting to hear about abuse within the ranks of the Boy Scouts here in Canada. I hope that speaking out will help the victims of abuse who do it and others who have been affected but still have not disclosed the incidents. There is strength in numbers, indeed.
It is very disheartening and disillusioning to find out what has been occurring in all these apparently venerable institutions. The numbers of victims is shocking and appalling, as is the behaviour of the perpetrators. Absolutely unbelievable and appalling too is the rampant cover-ups that went on in the name of promoting the institution over protecting the vulnerable. Disgusting.
Stray Mutt's observation is insightful - that there are two layers of secrecy in this situation.
Tragic for those affected by it. It's not just a bad event occurring on one occasion - it's something that never leaves a person their entire life. To me, it is like murder in that the survivor doesn't get to have the life they should or would have had if the assault had not happened. It is something that can overshadow the survivor always as well as their nuclear family, perhaps, and their own family, as many survivors of this type of assault become addicts or even abusers, so I have read.
An example here in Canada is the First Nations communities where children were taken by the govt from their parents' care (on "reservations") and put into residential schools (like boarding school), many run by the Catholic Church, and large numbers of the children were physically and sexually abused. They grew up to become alcoholic and/or abusive and now the second and third generations are speaking out about the effect on them of growing up with alcoholic parent/s and/or abuse, so that is three generations, at least, that have been affected by abuse perpetrated by Catholic priests and nuns, and others, back in the 50s.
Now we're starting to hear about abuse within the ranks of the Boy Scouts here in Canada. I hope that speaking out will help the victims of abuse who do it and others who have been affected but still have not disclosed the incidents. There is strength in numbers, indeed.
It is very disheartening and disillusioning to find out what has been occurring in all these apparently venerable institutions. The numbers of victims is shocking and appalling, as is the behaviour of the perpetrators. Absolutely unbelievable and appalling too is the rampant cover-ups that went on in the name of promoting the institution over protecting the vulnerable. Disgusting.
So true!!! I was a teenager when we stopped to give somebody a ride. He hit me in the nose and smashed it pretty good. It was over a girl. I had no idea there was a problem, and thought we were friends. The guy who was driving knew what was going on, and had offered me a ride. Pretty f*#*ed up by anybody's standards.
Over a quarter of a century later, I still lock the doors in my car no matter where I'm at. In fact, my finger goes to the lock as soon as I open the driver door. I lock it so that as soon as the door is closed, the car is locked. And I keep the windows rolled up.
I can't say this is all bad. One time a guy with road rage jumped out of his car at a red light and tried to open my car door. It was already locked, but it happened so fast that I wouldn't have had time to lock it if it hadn't already been locked. I just waited for the light to turn green and traffic to start moving so I could drive away. He turned my driver side mirror back, and that's the worst thing that happened that day because of my constant vigilance.
They say one of the hallmarks of ptsd is hyper-vigilance. Between a few incidents like this and the violence in my home, I became very vigilant. I find it hard to sit in an office and work when people are walking around, especially behind me or just out of my peripheral vision.
The feeling of never really being safe is not fun. I remember in the 3 or 4 years after this happened, being a passenger and not knowing where we were going was a terrifying feeling. Taking a detour or going down a street I didn't recognize caused mini panic attacks.
So you are correct, you never really forgot it. And you're never really the same. The only thing I can say I'm grateful for is that it was a physical assault, and not sexual assault. It gives me much empathy for those who have survived other kinds of assault, though.
T-Bone
Over a quarter of a century later, I still lock the doors in my car no matter where I'm at. In fact, my finger goes to the lock as soon as I open the driver door. I lock it so that as soon as the door is closed, the car is locked. And I keep the windows rolled up.
I can't say this is all bad. One time a guy with road rage jumped out of his car at a red light and tried to open my car door. It was already locked, but it happened so fast that I wouldn't have had time to lock it if it hadn't already been locked. I just waited for the light to turn green and traffic to start moving so I could drive away. He turned my driver side mirror back, and that's the worst thing that happened that day because of my constant vigilance.
They say one of the hallmarks of ptsd is hyper-vigilance. Between a few incidents like this and the violence in my home, I became very vigilant. I find it hard to sit in an office and work when people are walking around, especially behind me or just out of my peripheral vision.
The feeling of never really being safe is not fun. I remember in the 3 or 4 years after this happened, being a passenger and not knowing where we were going was a terrifying feeling. Taking a detour or going down a street I didn't recognize caused mini panic attacks.
So you are correct, you never really forgot it. And you're never really the same. The only thing I can say I'm grateful for is that it was a physical assault, and not sexual assault. It gives me much empathy for those who have survived other kinds of assault, though.
T-Bone
How many were Bishops who had 11yo boys alone in a room asking them worthiness questions for the Assholic Priesthood?
It's the coverup that gets you, not the crime. They look like bigger sleazebags for hiding the bad apples. It makes it look like you approve.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/20/2012 03:38PM by Stray Mutt.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/20/2012 03:38PM by Stray Mutt.
So true. The cover-up ends up bringing those hiding the crime some serious ruin.
Penn State
Catholic Church
Martha Stewart
Pres. Clinton
Just to name a few.
Penn State
Catholic Church
Martha Stewart
Pres. Clinton
Just to name a few.
Part of it may be self-selection. Outside TSCC, a pedophile may try to become a scout leader. Inside TSCC, they call whoever they hate the most :-) so there's more of a random selection. It's a thought anyway.
We have been hearing about this for years because the church feels it is perfectly ok to assign the "lesser" males to work with boys in scouts instead of teaching classes when they have testimony problems.
What gets me is they don't learn from experience. SCOUTS DIE WHEN DISINTERESTED LEADERS TAKE THEM INTO WILDERNESS DANGER.
And scouts get molested when pedophiles are protected.
It's perfectly clear that the church cares more about its image than it does the innocence of its member's children.
I do believe Jesus said awful things would happen to any adults who hurt "these little ones." I hope he was right and now would be a good time, God, if you are listening....
Anagrammy
What gets me is they don't learn from experience. SCOUTS DIE WHEN DISINTERESTED LEADERS TAKE THEM INTO WILDERNESS DANGER.
And scouts get molested when pedophiles are protected.
It's perfectly clear that the church cares more about its image than it does the innocence of its member's children.
I do believe Jesus said awful things would happen to any adults who hurt "these little ones." I hope he was right and now would be a good time, God, if you are listening....
Anagrammy
A big problem with the BSA is that it did not shift to the new paradigm of freeing the wymyns, which the rest of country seems to have adjusted.
moving out of the '50's model with the nucular family and dad doing his 40 out of house, and mom pulling the June Cleaver, that model of scouting thrived in mid America up till we freed the wymyns.
Ward could take off a weekend a month (or pool those karma credits with the other dads -- so maybe three/four times a year) and do some father son bonding on the gubment dime.
but once the wymyns liberated themselves, then it was a parity game June and Ward had equal rights to access to the kids during weekends.
Unfortunately, BSA never recognized the new paradigm. and it continues to suffer. and the ole boys running scouting from the trenches have to do a hell of lot more, with a hell of lot less parents. So people of a certain ilk will fill the vacuum.
moving out of the '50's model with the nucular family and dad doing his 40 out of house, and mom pulling the June Cleaver, that model of scouting thrived in mid America up till we freed the wymyns.
Ward could take off a weekend a month (or pool those karma credits with the other dads -- so maybe three/four times a year) and do some father son bonding on the gubment dime.
but once the wymyns liberated themselves, then it was a parity game June and Ward had equal rights to access to the kids during weekends.
Unfortunately, BSA never recognized the new paradigm. and it continues to suffer. and the ole boys running scouting from the trenches have to do a hell of lot more, with a hell of lot less parents. So people of a certain ilk will fill the vacuum.