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Posted by: DonnyOsmondMorg ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:06PM

I became disabled three years ago and receive under$1,500 a month to live on. Husband (agnostic and not an investigator like me) is a school teacher and has made it clear that his earned money WILL NEVER be tithed on, by any church. I agree. So do they expect me to tithe on my $1,450 a month? It's not taxed so I just want to be prepared if it comes up. If anything there are times WE could benefit from a few bags of groceries (like over the 3 month summer break with no hubby income).
Also, due to my disability, Hubby and I are in the process of declaring bankrupcy. Previously I had been a Psyotherapist, so the sudden loss of my income has devastated us. If I become an active member how do they look at my situation re: tithing ?

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Posted by: forbiddencokedrinker ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:10PM

The church wants you to tithe everything. They even pressure little kids into tithing their tooth fairy and birthday card money.

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Posted by: helamonster ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:11PM

Disability monies is considered insurance and as such are not "earned income" but rather indemnification for loss.

That won't stop some bishops from *asking* you to tithe on it, though, as they will call it "an increase", which is totally bogus even by the morg's own rules.

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Posted by: bingoe4 ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:14PM

If you won an item(a car, furniture,etc.) you would be expected to tithe on the value of that item. You are expected to tithe on all increase. Yes disability is up for grabs. Your husbands miney is his so hey wouldn't take it from you though I am sure they would try.

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Posted by: 48erhater ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:20PM

They even expect people to tithe on lottery winnings. Even though they frown on the lottery.

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Posted by: mindlight ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:17PM

I am disabled on SSD, over 55.

Absolutely the Bish wanted me to tithe on it. He did say I didn't have to tithe on my food stamps. Kinda felt like he felt he was giving me a break. I get around $850 a month.

/sighs

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Posted by: Mia ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:19PM

Most likely you will be pressured/guilted into paying tithing on you disability $.

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Posted by: ambivalent exmo ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:20PM

yes.
My mom is elderly & on disability +a small pension.
She can barely afford basic necessities.
And yet she must pay 10% of her disability/pension to maintain her temple recommend. We pitch in to buy her groceries every. single. month.
SHAME ON COJCOLDS.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/21/2012 09:21PM by ambivalent exmo.

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Posted by: DonnyOsmondMorg ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:23PM

What are you referring to "expected to tithe on all increase? Do you mean if my monthly check gets a federal increase of like $25 a month, I would be expected to tithe on THAT?? Really?? Lucky (so to speak) that no increase is expected in the foreseeable future. If they cut benefits down the road, do I get a rebate?(ha-ha).

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Posted by: DonnyOsmondMorg ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:34PM

Are you guys F****** KIDDING ME??? Tithe on $850 a month, and the Bish gave you a BREAK on the food stamps???!!! That's outrageous! Why won't the church HELP you with their Food Bank, or whatever it is??? How can you even exist on that income. I think I would stand up at Testimony Sunday and get up and talk about how people cant get a Temple Reccomend unless they tithe on DISABILITY! I bet most of them would be shocked! I AM!!

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Posted by: DonnyOsmondMorg ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:51PM

Do I run??? Yes, I am lonely, terrified of the future, and very depressed over loosing my 28yr career as a Licensed Psychotherapist. I have no place to go, no one who needs me, no one who would miss me if I fell off the earth tonight except Hubby. Husband cannot fill all the needs that I feel about loosing my lifelong dream as a Therapist. I wake up and fall asleep to a TV. If I do volunteer work I could loose my Disability, as volunteering means "you can work". Sister& Mom (in nursing home) are too far away for me to see more than twice a year. I have no idea what to do, but I've GOT to get out and meet people. Three years of staying in bed for 2-3 weeks can't continue. The Mormons do "love bomb", but what if you need a little love bombing if the alternate being isolated ,scared and lonely, even if I know all the bull... I need to belong somewhere, maybe that's why others stay, even if they know all the lies and bull..... I'm scared, lonley and ambivalent.

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Posted by: DonnyOsmondMorg ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:17PM

So far, in the ten or so weeks I have been an investigator no one has mentioned money at all, don't know when I go from investigator to member (I was baptized at 12, left at 14 when my Feminist Self could not swallow that women can't hold the priesthood but ALL boys/men get to!). Told I do not need to get rebaptized as My name is still on the records....and I'm 53 now but completely inactive since 1974! I think there membership #'s are pretty baloney if they've been counting me for the past 40 years!!
So no one has asked for money, and have decided not to pay a dime. If I get called to the Bishop (who hasn't so much as introduced himself to me in the ten weeks I've been attending), I
Will tell him I will tithe the $150.00 a month on my $1450.00 if The church will pay my electric bill each month around that amount(hey,it's HOT And HUMID in Florida!). Or I'm willing to get $150.00 in groceries that accommodate my husbands diabetic and cardiovascular special diet,and our vegetarian beliefs. If he won't meet me half way then I simply have to decline, as that $150 literally keeps our electricity on, no kidding!

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Posted by: ambivalent exmo ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:33PM

RUN.

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Posted by: DonnyOsmondMorg ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:34PM

Well, being an investigator I've never tithed on the money when I first earned it. But I have decided (thanks to all of you), that I will refuse to mention my husbands income at all. My hubby was out of work last year for medical reasons, that is also a big part of needing bankrupcy. Do you mean to tell me that even going thru a bankrupcy, what are you expected to tithe on? I'm going to say I have no idea what my husband earns, hey I'm a feminist...I kept my maiden name when we got married 35 years ago, we don't wear wedding rings - don't believe in it, never had kids, both hubby and I hate them...always have....can't explain why, we just have no interest or tolerance for them.
So what can they possibly get from me?

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Posted by: justrob ( )
Date: August 22, 2012 12:30AM

I always paid tithng on everything... including scholarships & my Pel Grant (yes, the money the government gives you because you are too poor to afford college... yeah I gave them 10% of that).

So, if you really believe it- sure, go all in. Have faith. Cross your fingers. But it didn't work for my great grandparents, nor my grand parents, nor my parents.

In fact, I'm the first one in my family for generations to be finacially stable... & I did that after leaving the church (& obviously not paying tithing anymore).

I didn't starve as a child, but we ate mostly beans & rice, & often we went to bed hungry. There was always *something* to eat, but often not enough of it... and 10% would have gone a long way.

We never took any Fast Offering money from the church.
& we gave them countless hours of service (my parents, sisters, & wife still do).

So, if you are trying to make ends meet, DO NOT PY TITHING.
It is reckless.
You might be ok, and then all the mormons can point to it as a miracle (as my family constantly does)... but the truth is you were just 10% worse off than you would have been otherwise.

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Posted by: Glo ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:36PM

They are selling you Salvation in the Hereafter for your cash in the present.

Don't you get it? It's a scam.
That's the modus operandi of cults.

No mainstream church operates this way.

Shut your doors to them before they totally brainwash you into believing their spiel.

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Posted by: inmoland ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:25PM

This thread from a few days ago might enlighten you:

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,601608,601716#msg-601716

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Posted by: Glo ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:31PM

RUN if you are an investigator!!
You are dealing with a cult which masquerades as a family church.

Mormonism wants your money, your free work and any kids you can breed for them.

You are being love-bombed because they found some opening to worm themselves into your life.
Is it loneliness, fear of the future, your disability?

Although Mormons are often nice on the local level, realize that the "church" will not help you.

In fact, as a convert you will always be a second class citizen in Mormonism - although that doesnot stop the from taking your money and any service you can give them.

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Posted by: frankie ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:35PM

the church wants kid's tooth fairy money. they are greedy bastards and need the money to pay for tommy's $100,000 audi. of course they will want your money. if your are an investigator, it is good that you are investigating the mormon church. next time they talk to you, tell them you are investigating the church and don't wanna wear green aprons and have masonic symbols on you underwear. they will have a heart attack!!!!

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Posted by: exrldsgirl ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:35PM

Wow, I think it's horrible that they try to get people to pay tithing on disability. I don't think of it as "increase." As a previous poster mentioned, it's money you're getting for a loss, not really income.

After reading this board for a few months, I would say that the LDS church's insistence on tithing is one of the things I dislike most about it. The church I grew up in (RLDS) defined "increase" as what you had left over after basic living expenses (rent/mortgate, insurance, taxes, groceries, car payment, student loans, clothing, utilities, etc.) If there was nothing left after that, then you didn't have to pay any tithing. And it was up to you to determine how much you "owed," and nothing happened if you paid less or didn't pay at all.

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Posted by: Serendiptiyhappens ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:38PM

Yes, you have to tithe it... Then, you can beg the church for assistance. And when they give you the assistance, you must use it as a faith promoting story of how blessed you are to be a member of the church.

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Posted by: mindlight ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:43PM

If the Bish had told me the church would provide food, I maybe, might of possibly tithed.
I could not go on faith when it comes to my money. I am very thrifty. I did buy some Facebook stock so maybe I don't make great descisions... lol ... but it was my choice.
After coming to this board, I know I am not unique.

It is a scam. I don't need the socialization that much. Bah.
I will take Facebook over the church anyday if I want to lose my money.

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Posted by: forbiddencokedrinker ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:46PM

How about you just tell them no, and never give them any more tithing, on any money, ever again.

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Posted by: Docia ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:55PM

Your disability money comes from YOUR contributions over the years of working. It's a deduction, like FICO, or state taxes. As such, you've already tithed on those paychecks and to now have to pay tithing on your disability, would mean that you'd paid tithing TWICE on the same monies.

Double-dipping is considered fraud in some States, but that seems to be what TSSC wants you to do.

My hubby has been the only one working in our household. I SHOULD be on disability, but the Government figures that by the time I fight to get it, I'll be dead, so they still won't have to pay. We NEVER tithed on my hub's check...we used that money for his coffee and cigarettes.LOL

My bishop refused to allow us to go to the Bishop's storehouse after about 6 months. "Your husband works, we can't help you anymore." I never went to another SM.

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Posted by: exrldsgirl ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:01PM


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Posted by: justrob ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 09:58PM

You just can't predict what they will ask you to tithe on... but you can always push it up the food chain.

If a Bish tells you to tithe it, take it to the Stake. If they say the same, take it to the Regional Authorities.

The LDS church hates bad PR. All it takes is a little whining, and the policy may get changed "from on high"

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Posted by: mysticma ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:03PM

My very smart mother left the church over the argument of tithing when she retired.

After she retired the Bishop called her in his office and said she had stopped paying "enough" tithing. My mom asked "What on earth do you mean, Bishop?" He stated that since she took her retirement her tithing money had dropped a lot!!! She said of course it had. Now she was only getting her pension from her husband who had passed (and she paid her tithes on that) and her social security money, and she wasn't about to pay tithes on that because she paid tithes on that money when she got her full pay check and paid tithes on a "full" paycheck. So the social security money had already been tithed on.

The Bishop did not like that thinking at all. In his mind, and the cults thinking if you receive money to live off of you must give 10% of it to the cult, even if it has already been tithed on previously.

My lovely, smart, beautiful, fun loving, spiritual mom never went back to the mormon church and had fun taking her grandchildren on trips for the rest of her earthly life.

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Posted by: Lostmypassword ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:13PM

The jerks would want you to tithe on your change at the grocery store.

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Posted by: Brethren,adieu ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:46PM

You don't owe the church a single F*king dime. Donations to churches are voluntary. If you don't want to tithe, then don't. But you have been warned. The church will try to take whatever it can from you.

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Posted by: skeptic ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:46PM

The following is in the Handbook, and is the only official statement on tithing.


“What is a proper tithe? “For your guidance in this matter, please be advised that we have uniformly replied that the simplest statement we know of is that statement of the Lord himself that the members of the Church should pay one-tenth of all their INTEREST annually, which is understood to mean income. NO ONE IS JUSTIFIED IN MAKING ANY OTHER STATEMENT THAN THIS. We feel that every member of the Church should be ENTITLED TO MAKE HIS OWN DECISION as to what he thinks he owes the Lord, and to make payment accordingly.” (Letter from the First Presidency, dated March 19, 1970). (The caps are in the Handbook, I did not add them)

I used to carry a copy of this around in my Quad (back in the day), and would pull it out anytime some teacher or priesthood leader would push for 10% on Gross Income, or that disability or welfare "income" should be tithed. And then I would ask when was the last time that anyone there had paid tithing on the gain on the sale of their house (I know of no one anywhere who has done that).

Do not let any bishop try to force you to overpay. The only proper question that they can ask is "Are you paying a full tithing?" Your answer is "YES"..... period. If he makes moves against your TR, go to the SP.

I have. The SP grudgingly supported it. And then the SP told me that I probably would never hold a position of responsibility in the church.... I told him that I considered that a Win-Win.

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Posted by: justrob ( )
Date: August 22, 2012 12:19AM

My grandparents gave my parents their house a couple years ago.
My parents have started a "payment plan" for paying tithing on that gift.

I kid you not. They are paying tithing on the value of the home they received as a gift from 2 people who were kind enough to know that my parents would never be able to afford a home.

...to bad they didn't realize my parents can't even afford a "free home"

It makes me ill.
I love my parents, & I just hope that they get a sense of validation out of what they are doing, because that's the best I can hope for at this point.

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Posted by: dk ( )
Date: August 21, 2012 10:55PM

I agree it's a scam. Pay the lds church money and then go and beg for help. If you want to belong to a church, investigate other churches. Look and see what other help is available in your area.

Disability isn't considered income, so technically you could use your income tax form as proof of income. But why should you have to play games with the Morg? I had a bishop that told a student to pay 10% on a student loan. Pay 10% on a debt. Only the mormons could think like that.

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Posted by: Ragnar ( )
Date: August 22, 2012 03:15AM

Why give them anything? If you like attending their 'church' just go. If the bishop asks for money, tell him "I'll do what I can" and ignore it.

Why give your money to a corporation that is only interested in increasing its income stream and profits? You're under no obligation to do so.

You need the money more than they do, and you can put your money to better use than they can. They've done nothing to deserve your money.

Don't give them anything. Ever.

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