I've heard they do better than public school teachers. I once home taught a seminary teacher and he wouldn't tell me how much they make but he said they did better than public school teachers. They also get a deal with housing. If they can't sell their house when transferred, I think the church will buy it...just like a big corporate employer would.
the bishop when we left the church in the ranches lived down the street, then he moved to the rich part and became a member of SP. Asshole, he would not help us when we had excessive medical bills and were on the verge of losing our house.
That was just one thing, I should write about it someday but it all still pisses me off so much, and right now I can't deal with anything else.
I don't know how much they actually make, but I do have an old friend from high school who is now married to a seminary teacher. She's only about 27, and I think he's a few years older than she is. They have three children, and she's a stay at home mom. They own a very nice looking, averaged sized home and seem to do perfectly well with just his income.
Our bishop is a seminary teacher and plays the poor card to the cngregation all the time. He drives an old truck around and constantly wears his old faded white shirts. In fact we see him alot of places out side of church and he's wearing a faded white shirt. I don't recall him wearing any other color of shirt. I think he enjoys the pity people give him for choosing to be a poor seminary teacher. I think it's a perception he likes to portray regardless of how much he makes.
Yes, people with claw and kiss-up to get these jobs. A lot of it is who you know and who you are related to. I would venture to guess that salary depends on the same whims.
I know two paid seminary teachers. One taught on an Indian reservation, and was supposedly poor, yet he had 9 children, and medical care for all of them, boats and sports vehicles, and toys. Who knows.
The other lived in this neighborhood. He was vague, but he blabbed too much, too. He said that a friend at the COB loaned him the money to build his house. He and his well-dressed wife drove fancy cars. I guess they retired him, and he started a business which failed, and his house went into foreclosure. I guess the retirement plan ain't so good.
Anyone know if early morning seminary teachers are paid? This of course is the norm outside of the Morridor. Most of these teachers teach only an early morning class and are not teaching released-time students all day long.
PtLoma Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Anyone know if early morning seminary teachers are > paid? This of course is the norm outside of the > Morridor. Most of these teachers teach only an > early morning class and are not teaching > released-time students all day long.
No, they are not paid. I think they still might get a token "donut" budget but it isn't very much. They are called through the Stake now based on a recommendation from bishops in the Stake, I believe. The goal is to get them to do a 3yr committment probably because of the high turnover of teachers in the past.
No wonder they seem to have such a tough time recruiting them. Since many of the teachers here seem to be women, I don't see how any woman with kids at home could do it (leave home at c.6 am to start a 6:30 am class...sometimes earlier, depending on the start time of the local high school). Must be mostly empty nesters, though I could see men with kids at home doing it, with the wife still at home to supervise the kids.
Several years ago, I knew an early morning seminary teacher whose "donut" was $50/month. It was not intended as pay, but as a small acknowledgment of the unpleasantly early morning hour of the calling.
It's more than the "volunteer" meetinghouse cleaners are getting these days.
No, early morning seminary teachers are not paid. In this area they used to get a mileage allowance of about 48 cents/km, which was about the same as businesses giver their employees. Then someone decided it was too much and one year it was cut in half to abotu 24 cents, the idea is that it was to cover only gasoline expenses and not the normal tear and wear of the car like the full allowance did. This really bothered me.
As for other allowances, I believe the budget is around $2 per student per semiary year, yeap, we never got more tha $50 or $60 for supplies/treats for the year. Everything else came from the teacher's pockets.
I have a brother and a brother-in-law that are both long term CES employees. I've done taxes for the BIL, so I have a little bit of an inside scoop. They definitely do better public school teachers, but nowhere near 100k. My brother has been in for over 20 years, has a masters and PHD (paid for by the church) and teaches institute at the U. He does well, but not in six figures. I'm not sure how the previous poster's uncle is managing that figure remaining a seminar teacher. Perhaps he is living in a high cost area like N. California.
Seminar teachers are compensated differently depending on where they live, how much education they have and how long they have been teaching. Neither my brother or BIL are highly compensated. However, they have great benefits and they get their post-secondary education paid for.
When I did my BIL's taxes his first year as a seminary teacher 10 years ago he was making $38,000 per year. This was in Idaho and is substantially more than a first year teacher would make. But as you can see, he's not rolling in it. He still isn't. My brother either.
Both have wives that stay at home, but both have wives that are master budgeters. Both families live modestly but comfortably.
As a nevermo, I know about the high school kids having seminary in the mornings, but from reading the above these teachers are obviously something different.
Who do they teach? When? Where? Are they only in UT, or are they nationwide?
Outside heavily LDS areas, Mormon kids generally do early morning seminary, as you mentioned.
In areas with large numbers of LDS, the church buys land adjacent to high schools and builds "seminary buildings". The church owns and maintains the land the seminary sits on. In fact, sometimes the church buys land ahead of time, and then sells land for a school to the school district, keeping a parcel for the seminary building next door.
"Release time" means that students can be released from school for one period per day, for religious instruction, as long as the school doesn't promote or pay for it. This is the law throughout the USA (any religious group willing to make the investment may do it), but it's mainly Mormons who use the provision.
Utah's high school graduation requirements are watered down to reflect that students in seminary have a "hole" in their schedule each day that does not earn academic credit. Seminary helps Utah reduce its education spending because the seminary kids are in classes only five instead of six hours per day; i.e., the LDS church lets them reduce their teacher salaries and building budgets by about 1/6, since the church is "educating" the children one hour per day.
So if you are in Seminary in high school, you might have chemistry 1st period, english 2nd period, and seminary (a hole in your academic schedule) for 3rd period.
PtLoma Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > So if you are in Seminary in high school, you > might have chemistry 1st period, english 2nd > period, and seminary (a hole in your academic > schedule) for 3rd period.
Reading this, I keep thinking that Utah kids have 5/6 the academic education before college that other kids do. And given that BYU gives a significant amount of credit for Institute and other forms of religious instruction, they probably have 5/6 the college education of everyone else, too.
I remember reading on this board that some Utah school districts are instituting special high school diplomas that require more academic coursework. This of course comes into conflict with release time for seminary.
Some info here. It's basically LDS theology. They generally rotate through the four standard works, year to year. Often they have Scripture Chase contests, and other activities.
I nev saw this the first time around...I wasn't active on the board back in december.
My dad was a seminary teacher on the wasatch front up until I was a teen. We were debt-free but lived in an old house in the poorest ward in the stake. Drove a car as old as I was. I grew up watching a lot of younger seminary teachers get themselves is lot of debt trying to keep up with their peers in other professions.
The church pays slightly better then the public school system, but there are no real raises unless someone becomes the principal of a seminary, or continues their education, doing so out of their own pocket.
When my dad became an Institute Director, the church payed for us to move, he got a bump in salary, and adjustment for cost of living in a very expensive area. He also gets a car that he uses, same as the missionaries. They upgrade it every four years or so, so that he can make a good impression. By Utah standards, he makes a decent amount, but not for the major metropolitan area they now live in. Middle class neighborhood, much less fancy then other members in the ward.
The disparity seems to be between the payment of those who teach just an hour of early morning seminary versus those who actually are employed by the CEs and teach full-time.
Before I became a rapant apostate, they wanted to pay me $50.00 per month but it came with strings attached .. I could only teach from the appropriate resource materials and I was not permitted to answer and "difficult questions " --FIRST FBI CLUE-FOR CULT !
I tried to login to share this message but was unable to.
I taught seminary and institute full time for 27 years. I'll explain it as best as I can.
When I left CES and the church in 2002, my base salary was $62,500. I had 27 years of full time employment and a Ph.D. The number of years of service and the level of education provide extra bumps in pay. Cost of living increases are available for those living in areas where the cost of living is higher (usually based on real estate prices). In the 1970s, it was tough to make ends meet. I always qualified for food stamps, though that it was sinful to think about.
I had full time health benefits and paid lower than normal prices for term life insurance.
I supervised about 30 Early Morning and Home Study Teachers while teaching Institute. I received $150 for this assignment in addition to my base salary. The teachers I suprevised were switched from a stipend of about $30-$50 per month to travel reimbursement only. Most teachers did not want to take it. I tried without any success to tell them that they needed to take it. They wanted Lard!
During the 1980s the church ed system institute a plan called summer employment. It was supposed to be optional. Employees could choose to work in the summer months up to 8 weeks and earn extra cash, by improving curriculum etc. That was discontinued after I left and now the teachers work on a Professional Staff (Exempt) basis. They work during the summer on assignments that CES assigns or decide together are worthwhile. It provides 3 months of extra income, because the teachers are now on a 12 month contract.
If a full time teacher wants to increase his/her base salary they may obtain graduate degrees. I was reimbursed some of the costs of my education, in exchange for at least 5 years more employment in CES after I got the degree.
There is a retirement package that included a pension at 2/3 of the average of the highest 5? 3? years of employment. And there are retirement savings programs, matched by 3% church money.
I can't think of anything else now. However when I left CES and took a job as a professional staff member at a small college in Idaho. My base salary was considerably smaller, but my net income was nearly the same. One reason is that savings from paying tithing. The other was because health benefits were so much better for the higher education staff than in CES. And in a few short years I was making a lot more in public higher education in terms of net and gross income.
Let me know if you need any more information. I'll try to get it from the dusty vaults of memory, that I haven't visited in a long while. :)
In areas where release time is not available, Early Morning Seminary and Home Study (do the work on your own - like homework - and meet once a week) is the option.
All Early Morning classes do not start at the same time. I taught EM classes that began at 7:30, and other times, depending on when the local high school begins their class schedule.
Teachers are called or appointed (different wards and stakes do it differently), those teachers are offered a reimbursement for mileage.
They have been losing a large number of the youth for as long as I have been a member (1970 - convert).
And can you blame the kids? Look at the awful mind-numbing indoctrination they have to endure, as well as the regular, invasive interviews beginning at age 12.
My kids were embarrassed to be identified as Mormons, and I don't blame them. Thank gawd that 4 out of 5 of them left the church before their mom and I did.