Don't get me wrong, there are things far worse that the church is responsible for than there views on coffee.

Drinking coffee being a sin has to be the stupidest though. How can anyone attempt to justify a moral highground based on not drinking coffee? It is beyond stupid. It was never a deal breaker regarding the church, and like I said there are far more important issues, but it is certainly a laughably stupid commandment.

Even before you go into the gold plates and other wacky stuff.

As a teenager in the UK in the early seventies, I and my friends were all somewhat taken aback when we learned that The Osmonds didn't drink tea or coffee BECAUSE THEIR RELIGION FORBADE IT.

I mean, fine, not everyone has to LIKE coffe or tea. That's a matter of personal taste. But to FORBID such useful and relatively harmless beverages?

WTF ?

Have a nice weekend everybody.

Tom in Paris
about to go outside where it's a lovely day and the peonies, honeysuckle and roses in my garden are all in full and fragrant bloom !

Yeah I'm not a big coffee drinker myself. I don't really like hot drinks at all.

However that is just my personal taste, nothing more. It is pretty crazy that the ruler of the Universe would care about something as meaningless.

It is super strange I agree. And unfortunate! Coffee is awesome! If it wasn't for the cup of coffee I had earlier I wouldn't be awake browsing exmo. I actually just had a similar realization of something downright stupid about the church.
I was reading my little brother's blog he is keeping while on his mission in Ghana. He recently posted about how there are these families he is working on converting but because marriages can be difficult to get legally recognized by the government they cannot be baptized. Here is a snippet of his post:

"Well for this week we had a bit of a struggle with some of our investigators. So, in order to understand it all, I have to explain a bit about how marriage works here in Ghana. First it's ridiculously difficult to get legally married in Ghana. The reason is because of the traditional marriage. The first step in the traditional marriage is called "the knocking." This is where the guy goes and "knocks" on the door of the girl’s family and offers like maybe a crate of soda or something and asks permission to like date the girl. If the girl and the parents both agree then the parents create a "list." of things to give to the family before they can be married. This is called the "bride price." Usually it's ridiculously expensive. The parents usually ask for a whole host of random items and it can take years to pay off. The problem is that most people will do the knocking and get the list and then move in together. So you all can probably see where this is going. People can be living together for 5 to 10 years and still have not paid the entire "price." Until the parents agree that the price is paid then they will say that they are married and now they are considered legally married. Well, we had two families investigating that we were planning on baptizing very soon but this week as we were teaching each family, they told us that they weren't legally married. One family had been living together for about 5 years the other about 10 years but because they don't have the money they haven't been able to actually get married. Well this causes a big problem for us because obviously we can't baptize them until they are keeping the commandments and as far as they are not married they're not keeping that commandment."

The only thing I could think as I was reading this was: THIS. IS. SO. STUPID. Basically they are too poor to be allowed to be considered righteous. That is about as far from Christlike as you can get...

Yep, pretty dumb as well. Glad I am out. It is all bullshit and it is bad for you as the late great George Carlin said about so many things.

Yes! Almost as dumb as the whole of idea of having to be baptized in the first place.

Ha ha no doubt!

O, the sin of it all!

http://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/58.26?lang=eng

For a church that prides itself in not "command[ing] in all things," it sure does a lot of it.

Fetal Deity Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.lds.org/scriptures/dc-testament/dc/58.2
> 6?lang=eng
>
> For a church that prides itself in not "command in
> all things," it sure does a lot of it.

I just read the verses in that link. WTF is a "feast of fat things"? It seems like such an odd thing to say. Could you dunk the fat things in your coffee?

Susan



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2012 05:16AM by escapee.

I agree. Every study shows coffee has health benefits. It is enjoyable and one of the pleasures of life for me. Some of the statements and claims by the church are just plain stupid

For some abstaining from coffee serves as a reminder of their value system. For example, I used to put a rubber band on my wrist to remind myself not to engage in oral sex on a first date.

It's blind obedience, pure and simple. The Mormon ban on tea is even sillier. A health code that bans tea? That right there is reason enough to reject Mormonism altogether.

I agree......Does anyone really believe God cares whether you have a cup of coffee or tea? The church leaders squawk about how it is a matter of obedience. To whom; for what purpose?

A cup of hot tea is beneficial for so many reasons......to calm nerves, relieve anxiety, for a cough or laryngitis or the flu or for symptoms of a cold, not to mention as an excellent source of antioxidants.

So what to drink instead.....sugary sodas, harmful diet drinks that contain chemicals, milk which is primarily to be consumed only until a child is weaned? Most juices conain sugar also. That just leaves water!

As for coffee they claim it is the caffeine.....well there is caffeine in chocolate. Then they say because hot drinks are harmful. Hot chocolate is hot but I guess that is okay. So is soup for that matter. The WoW simply mentions strong drink. Well, duh.....I do think that refers to alcohol. Besides when JS received the supposed revelation sodas, diet or otherwise were unknown at that time.

While I was on my way out (several years ago), I had a conversation with a friend about her use of tea. She was a TBM who'd been told that green tea might help her metabolism, faitgue, and other issues.

After she'd been drinking it for a few weeks, she'd dropped a couple pounds and felt a bit better. Then it occurred to her that she ought to discuss her tea-drinking with her bishop. He told her that green tea and white tea are forbidden by the WoW. She stopped drinking it.

Green tea is one of the healthiest beverages on the planet. Coffee has some health benefits, too. If the WoW really came from God, why the heck would he forbid people to consume things that are actively good for them, as a test of obedience?

Makes no sense!

The first thing I did when I decided I was leaving TSCC was to visit Starbucks. When I sipped the hot steamy deliciousness and felt the surge of caffeinated energy, I decided that coffee just had to be part of my new path towards enlightenment. As I sit here now with a cup of home-brewed java six years later, I realize what a good decision that was. Yummm....

I mentioned to my TBM husband about the health benefits of coffee when that study came out a few weeks ago. He couldn't believe it. He made up all kinds of excusses about it being a flawed study. I explained that no....these people were not smokers, overweight, etc. His wheels we spinning.

As for me, it took a while before I started drinking warm coffee. I had done the mild Mc Donald's frappachino. I then branched out to the Starbuck's blended coffee. I now drink warm coffee every morning. I wake up have two cups and start out with a clear brain and just enough energy to get me through the day to be a mom of 4 kids (including an infant). I feel like I do not have any more issues with ADD. Love it.

I think I'm going to go sin right now...maybe brew some of that Guatemalan sin this morning.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2012 10:26AM by waner.

It's not so bad that a religion proscribes something coffee or tea, but in Mormonism it becomes a barometer of someone's "worthines." Then over the years Mormons have cranked it up to turn it into real sin, trying to rationalize it by making tea and coffee equal with heroin and crack. It's insanely stupid.

And now we know that tea and coffee are actually good for you. Go figure. Now Jesus himself could come and appear to me on a flaming pie and tell me to quit drinking coffee, and I'd just tell him to go get stuffed.

Although no one knows for sure, legend has it that human use of coffee beans began in sixth-century Ethiopia, where a monk observed his goat herd frolicking with unusual energy (even for goats) after they ate some berries on a bush. The curious monk ate some, then took more berries back to his monastery, where monks consumed them in order to remain alert during nocturnal worship services.

After that, Muslims began to brew the beans, creating the "wine of Islam" that gave them the stamina for all-night devotionals. They brought coffee to Europe sometime before the 1600s. Later, revolutionaries in France and the American colonies discussed politics and hatched plans in coffeehouses, including Boston's Green Dragon, which Daniel Webster named the "center of the Revolution."

How ironic that coffee has been linked both with religious worship and intellectual and political rebellion throughout its history. Although I doubt JS was aware of its history, there's no doubt coffee fosters both incendiary thinking and energy to do something about it.

A dangerous beverage, indeed. ;)

The sad part is that prez Monson could say tomorrow "no chocolate" or "no meat" and the members would no longer eat it. Without questioning.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2012 10:55AM by suckafoo.

suckafoo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The sad part is that prez Monson could say
> tomorrow "no chocolate" or "no meat" and the
> members would no longer eat it. Without
> questioning.

+1

The Word of Wisdom isn't about health. It's a test of obedience to the dictates of church leaders - the only never changing doctrine of Mormonism.

The prohibition against hot drinks came, along with the rest of the WoW, from the "Cold Water Army". It was an early temperance movement that was very active in New England and Midwest while Smith was alive.

The proponents thought that humans should only drink cold water. Alcohol was obviously bad, but hot drinks also created bad vapors in the stomach and sickened people. They were also against tobacco and eating too much meat.

There were many chapters of the group in the area of the Mormons, and people with last names you'd recognize.

Smith borrowed, he didn't invent. And this time he borrowed from a theory that just wasn't true.

Fascinating stuff, Heresy! Thank you. :)

I'd love to read more about it. Suggestions?

http://entreated.blogspot.com/2009_01_01_archive.html
Scroll down at the bottom.

Most religions have prohibitions that don't make sense. They're just there as a test of faith, as something to separate the believers from outsiders, or as something left over from more ignorant times.

Mormonism tries to elevate every sin to the same level of seriousness, right up there next to murder. That's what makes it crazy.

It's about obedience. Nothing else. It's a law of obedience that is required for membership.
Seems silly to me now, but it was a test of faith at the time.

I had a serious light bulb moment right before I sent in my resignation. I was grocery shopping, smelling fresh ground coffee and abruptly stopped mid sniff and said to myself "Why the hell could God care less about what I choose to drink? Coffee is from the earth, it hurts nobody!" I put some of that brew into my cart and now enjoy it again every day! Damn...the obedience thing had me fooled for a while. I'd rather be a good person and drink my coffee.

I read this post earlier and decided to give my 3 year old son some iced tea in front of my parents to see what they had to say. First off the doctor recommended my son switch to tea and cut back on juice and milk. You should have seen the look in my parents eyes when I handed it to him. Priceless. My mom finally spoke up and said "you actually give him tea?!" I went on to say how it has health benefits and its much better than the root beer and sprite and even kool aid they drink all they time. They were still shocked and my dad says, "the lord commanded we don't drink it so he must know of something in it that we dont." They just go along obeying and don't think to research tea or coffee or all the other crazy things that they are suppose to follow.

That is a scary mindset. Reminds me of how often my parents would brush any questions I had about the church by saying "The Lord knows more than we do."

I guess it comes down to whether you want to believe in superstition, and base your morality and life on a crackpot from the early 1800's, and the Gang of 15, or if you want to be an individual and think for yourself.

If there is a God, he is pretty messed up to care about things as meaningless as someone drinking coffee or tea. Also Joseph Smith and many early Mormons drank alcohol and used tobacco. Thanks to "modern revelation" it was ok for them, but not for current mormons.