Hey guys! I'm new here and this is my first post besides my painfully long bio.

Anyway, I have an TBM friend who I go to institute with, and she was looking in the library there for a book. She said "I want a book about the facts!" I asked her "what kind of facts?" and she said she didn't know. Anyway, the reason why I mention this is because I thought it would be a good opportunity to get some of the good facts to her. So, is there a book that would be in an LDS library that would have the material I want her to read?

This library has a lot of stuff. It had an RLDS D&C in it. I'm sure it will contain whatever you can suggest.

TSCC doesn't approve of facts. They only approve of "testimony building" literature so you will never find a TSCC approved book on facts. Sorry! Have her read this board if she wants some facts.

When I first started wanting to find out FACTS, I read a lot of things on RFM and other links, like Mormonthink, but I'm not sure if that was up in 2001, but there were other sites and Packham's site.

I found a lot of disturbing stuff that was totally contradictory to the things I'd been taught for 45 years. But most information on those links listed the source reference. I was living in Utah Valley at the time so I went to the Orem library and they had an extensive collection of old Mormon books. I would look up the things that I thought just couldn't possibly be true and was just some disgruntled exmormon making it up. Of course, every single time I was able to find the source, the quote was exact. So if you're in Utah, even though the newer books have been highly edited, you might be able to find the original material sources--right from the horse's (I mean ass's) mouth.

Mormonthink.com

If you mean 'official church approved' books, they tend to be 'here today, changed tomorrow' kinda literature. you only need to go back a couple of decades for a glaring example.......'Mormon Doctrine' by Bruce McConkie.
contrast and compare with the 'doctrine' on mormon.org

If you want to see church racism and sexism at it's most blatant, then the 'Journal of Discourses' is the book for you.
this proves just how much the church changes itself due to outside influence........like a chameleon which declares "I've only ever been this colour".
The JoD is available on-line

Great book that doesn't even mention mormonism. If you accept the facts about world history within it and still believe the BoM to be real history then you are a moron.

Brefots Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Great book that doesn't even mention mormonism. If
> you accept the facts about world history within it
> and still believe the BoM to be real history then
> you are a moron.

I love Jared Diamond...I acutally got to hear him " live" at California Lutheran University here in Ventura County, Calif.

A very liberal college...I was studying Cultural Geography at the time, so it was very revelant...

The PBS documentary on Dr.Diamond's work and this book was great... I rented from the public library...

that's what is sounds to be;

the Ministry of Truth must carefully consider which facts are Approved, which are Rejected.

But, read the books they do publish: Not Many FACTS to be found, but rather a re-hashing of last weeks laundry.

I completely second mormonthink.com!

The RLDS D&C prolly contains section 101 which was in the original D&C. Compare section 101 in the RLDS version which was original for LDS too and check it against D&C 132. Section 101 says marriage was to be one man to one woman and was to be done in public. 101 was replaced by 132. The two doctrines can't live in the same universe. God did a 180 on marriage.

"God did a 180 on marriage"

Give it 10-15 years and I bet he does a 180 on gay marriage too.

I haven't read it, but have heard that volume 7 of church history has some interesting things in it that most members don't know.

I would certainly suggest journal of discourses. Not an easy read, but some of the stuff the prophets say are pretty mind blowing.

Depending on your relationship, you could offer to help her. Ask her to give you one question and you will help her research it. Then you can find some references online that are in the Church history or Ensign, etc and go to the institute library and look it up for her. That way she will not feel you are giving her false info.

I was amazed when I started looking for the truth, that all the anti literature was just facts from the churches own history records that I had never heard of. Most TBMs are pretty ignorant of their own true history.

Rough Stone Rolling was written by a TBM and is sold at Deseret.

I don't understand how anyone can have a testimony after reading it.

Thats one interesting twist when you start to research Mormonism.

The first thing you discover is that the One TRUE church very seldom tells the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. The truth will set you free from the mormon church.

My dog is better at telling the truth.

I get my fax from Wikipedia

Reality has a decidedly anti-Mormon bent. Therefore books that contain facts tend to be anti-Mormon.

Such anti-Mormon books have titles like "Geology" or "Egyptology" or "archaeology" or "linguistics" or "History," etc.

Wikipedia has a ton of different articles on everything controversial. They are pretty unbiased. "Rough Stone Rolling" author is Mormon and probably included half of the shocking history of the church. He sugar coated everything but still confesses that it did happened.

and everything I read was written by true believing Mormons, like Hugh Nibley, H Donl Peterson, FARMS, Yorgasen, John Gee, and various apologists.

Once you sift those for bias, and just take the facts, those materials tell you pretty much everything you need to know: There is no archealogical evidence for the B of M, and the B of A is a fraud.

But I also recommend Jared Diamond's book, and I loved "Demon-Haunted World" by Sagan (about the scientific process vs. superstition). History of the church by BH Roberts is also pretty damning, but I just looked at Vol. 5.

I wish I would have started with Palmers "Insider's View of Mormon Origins . . ." (I think that's the name) early in my research, because it covered the important things. He was an institute teacher when he wrote it, I think, and it was originally sold at church bookstores. Not sure if it is now.

When you read the church books, like the ones from Deseret Book that are written by the apologists, there will be pages and pages of references. It just makes the sheeple feel good to see all those references so they know that it's "factual" stuff. Well, then I started following the references. This was a common scenario (the names are examples), The Nibley quote would reference a quote in a book by Sorenson. So I would pull that book and see if he said it or was quoting someone else. Surprise, Surprise, he was quoting Nibley. So they'd just quote each other and none of them had any backup to half the schit they wrote. But they know darn well no one's really going to look it up.

Were there a church-approved book of facts I suspect it would be a single copy of a loose-leaf three-ring binder with un-numbered pages kept in the first presidency's secret vault and only quoted in the Temple after a throat-slitting vow of secrecy.

Send your friend to BYU.edu online and have him/her read the Journal of Discourses. By the end of the reading, she will be deconverted.

My favorite part is where Bro Briggie says there are ppl living on the moon and the sun. Old joey said the same too.