http://www.ldschurchnews.com/articles/60087/From-the-First-Presidency.html
"
We have repeatedly warned of the risks inherent in participating in so-called "self-awareness" groups sponsored by commercial enterprises that promise heightened self-esteem, improved family relationships, and increased spirituality.
...
We warn that these programs are not in harmony with Church doctrine or gospel principles.
"

lmao! you're goddamn right!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/15/2010 06:21AM by Nick Humphrey.

1. Challenge religious and moral values. (As in send out missionaries to target and convert?)

2. Advocate confrontation with spouse or family members as a means of reaching one's potential. (Oh. You mean, "If you're not temple worthy, I want a divorce!")

3. Imitate sacred rites or ceremonies. (Like blood oaths, secret names, secret handshakes, etc. etc.)

4. Foster physical contact among participants. (Like annointing?)

5. Meet late into the evening or in the early-morning hours. (Or all day Sunday or every night of the week?)

6. Encourage open confession or disclosure of personal information normally discussed only in confidential settings. (Hmmm. . . can you say "worthiness interview?")

7. Cause a husband or wife to be paired with other partners. (So glad BY never did this!)

> 7. Cause a husband or wife to be paired with other partners. (So glad BY never did this!)

i remember them doing this on a handcart trek we had in washington. volunteer parents were paired with other members of the opposite sex to form a pretend family while we were on the trek.

they were all dentists and oral surgeons, it was in Central CAlifornia. They all went to the same group together just like they all bar b q ed together.

it was horrible. Teenagers everywhere, large families shattering-
RS was a nightmare. The hall was horrid the tension, conflict was so great.

There were only 35 couples in the small ward. It was very significant.

Do you think anyone else might be a cult? Do you think anyone anywhere might use mind control techniques or strategies and take advantage of people who are vulnerable?

I remembered this letter and I wanted to reply to it 4 years
ago. So here is my reply.

The letter warns against self-awareness groups. For LDS Inc. these WOULD be dangerous. For example...

Twinker Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 1. Challenge religious and moral values.

Stop letting Mormons walk all over you with their religious and moral values. Challenge their religion and moral values.

> 2. Advocate confrontation with spouse or family
> members as a means of reaching one's potential.

Confronting spouse or family because their Mormonism is keeping you from your potential.

> 3. Imitate sacred rites or ceremonies.

Find spiritual experiences outside of their super boring ones.

> 4. Foster physical contact among participants.

Hugging might lead to sexual contact.

> 5. Meet late into the evening or in the
> early-morning hours.

I know early Mormons did this so why is this so dangerous?

> 6. Encourage open confession or disclosure of
> personal information normally discussed only in
> confidential settings.

Normally, only discussed with a complete Mormon stranger as opposed to non-Mormon strangers.

> 7. Cause a husband or wife to be paired with other
> partners.

Oh, but it was okay for Joseph Smith?

Mormons becoming self-aware is very dangerous because they wouldn't think of themselves as just participants in a "plan of salvation" and might see a bigger picture world.

Also, there are no confidential settings in Mormonism. Just temporary isolation with a church authority to reduce your sense of control.

Once it's out, it's headlined in several meetings and spread to dozens of people within a week.

The Mormon practice of the weaponization of confidentiality.

Church opinion aside on this matter.

I've had friends who got involved with such groups. Kick me if you need to but keep in mind that some of these groups are cults in their own right, they do break up families and being locked into a weekend group where you are being screamed at repeatedly over your self confessed faults and sins have caused mental breakdowns of people and definite break ups in relationships.

Just saying folks.

Always be aware,even outisde of the LDS church.

Wouldn't this warning include aligning yourself with (and certainly paying big bucks to) a "life coach"?

TBM DIL has recently and melodramatically bombarded us all with the inspirational story of AZ Cardinal player Deuce Lutui (LDS) and his commitment to be The Best Offensive Lineman In The NFL (see TBOLITNFL). Totally due of course, to his life coach...who is also LDS, natch.

This includes the Democratic Party...

"We have repeatedly warned..." Sounds like they are talking to a bunch of naughty children. If they are so concerned,they could have handled it in a much better way. When are more mormons going to wake up and realize they are adults,not children?

She is also saying she is close to done with the church.

I wonder if they are loosing to many members over these groups? People start to look at themselves in a different way and realize that the church is intolerant and hypocritical.

from GBH:

"Making good men better

Our desire everywhere is to make bad men good and good men better. We teach, we train, we build, we educate, we promote opportunity for growth and development. We give hope to those without hope, and there is nothing greater you can give a man or a woman than hope. — From National Press Club address, March 8, 2000"

They don't want any competition.

A quote that comes directly from the Masons. A group that has been known to meet late into the night. Since most of their meetings don't start until around 7PM.

These self-help groups are not cheap so my guess is that more than a few times the church-cult has caught the short-end of the stick by way of members not being able to pay their tithing.

GBH's statement should read: we indoctrinate, we indoctrinate, we indoctrinate and indoctrinate some more rather than, "We teach, we train, we build, we educate...."

The "we educate" especially makes me laugh. How can anyone call what the church-cult does education?

A friend talked me into going to one of these several years ago. It was a full-blown mind-f**k. I walked out halfway through it. I support the Church's stance on this one.

An Experiencer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It was a full-blown mind-f**k.
> I walked out halfway through it. I support the
> Church's stance on this one.

I felt like my mind was being procreated with by prophets and I wanted to walk out half-way through but it would have embarrassed my family too much.

Just sayin'.

I wouldn't mind going to a self-awareness group that didn't act like LDS Inc. and fully discloses what they do.

"The only thing in your life that should keep you happy and fulfilled is the mormon church. Now keep handing over your money to us!!"

That's the way I read it.

I had my vt/friend/cousin start going to the impact trainings. It was crazy. I was going through major mental issues, ptsd,, etc, and she thought this would make me better. It took them a few years till they stopped doing it.

She did admit that they did par of the temle ceremony during it.


then, my lds therapist who I respect and who saved my life, started talking about Landmark. How he thinks it would be good for me as long as I was not suicidal at the time. He says it is not like impact training and it is like 6 months of therapy in a long weekend.

Of how many times people go to the meetings and will donate so that others can go, another words if your excuse is money, some anonymous donors will walk up and put your fee on the tabl. No shit, this is what he says happens.

I pretty much tink we he talks this shit that I am NOT paying for his time. I think he is on the way out of curch, never been hardcore. But he really believes in landmark.

I can barely physically sit through one session of therapy let alone a weekend I wouldhave to be all drugged up....and have a cath bag cause my bladder is all messed up.

I wish someone would go in and do a hidden camera a-la-temple ceremony

It's simply a mind-f*ck market share battle. Don't go there...stay with our mind-f*ck program instead!!

Exactly! You said it much better than i did! LOL!

http://www.culthelp.info/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1243&Itemid=12

See this French documentary on Landmark. There are English subtitles.

Thanks for posting the video. It was interesting to see the actual forum. I had a friend try to recruit me to a similiar program a few years ago, and I briefly considered it, until I researched about it more on the internet. It sounded fishy to me. I'm so glad I never went.

Interestly enough, that "friend" hasn't spoken to me since I said that he was in a cult. And, he's also completely dissappeard from Facebook when he used to be quite active.

Yea I have experienced people involved who go all in and anyone who doesn't drink the koolaid is off limits for contact.

http://www.motherjones.com/media/2009/07/landmark-42-hours-500-65-breakdowns


The Landmark Forum: 42 Hours, $500, 65 Breakdowns


My lost weekend with the trademark happy, bathroom-break hating, slightly spooky inheritors of est

Or maybe it was just pre-Est, I don't remember paying anything for it but maybe my friend paid.

About 10 minutes in, the speaker singled me out and said "How can you justify XXX?" I don't remember the rest. I said "I don't have to justify anything to you." I was escorted out.

What a relief. I probably had the wrong facial expression.