I read several others posts and wonder IF we are supposed to be 'recovering' from MORmONism Just who do we pray to? I have been told Heavenly Father is made up. So, WHO do we pray to? I know there are some here who still go to an LDS church. So, why are they even here?

Kinda riding the fence ain't it?

Like to bitch about the church, but still go to church? I want to know how in the hell to get on with my life outside the LDS life? How can I move on while reading several posters here who still PRAY for others and GO TO church, still? This does not compute in my brain.

Just tell me: WHO are you praying to and describe the entity you direct your energies toward? Please.

And thank you. :)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/15/2017 11:17PM by cutekitty.

Give me a f**king break !

I haven't been on here for over a month due to Dave the atheist's comment- "give me a fucking break".
I don't need anybody in cyberspace or real life talking to me in this fashion. I asked a genuine question and this is the response I get? I was so hurt, again, by church things and now this?

I DO appreciate everybody's response to my question. I read them today for the first time. I have missed being here, but I don't need anybody hurting my feelings. Dave's comment was the last thing I read, a month ago.

Thank you to everybody who answered my serious question. I don't pray anymore to anything. The mormon mess has left a huge void in my life.

I now know there is no 'Higher Power" in my ballpark. I have prayed for things and got nothing in return, for years. I always was a very genuine, thankful person in my prayers.

Now I talk to myself for encouragement.

I'm not excusing Dave's comment, and I agree that it was insulting and entirely non-helpful to answering your question.

However...

Lots of people are going to be insulting and entirely non-helpful in the world. In all sorts of situations. They don't know (or care!) what you need or don't need. If you withdraw from any situation where such people might say such things, you'll never go anywhere.

Don't let other people control what you do, is my hopeful suggestion. Whether they're helpful or not.

:)

Hi cutekitty,

You may be quick on the uptake - i.e., a ward change forcing your hand, genuinely re-examining religion, and not just Mormonism, determining that it is all nothing more than an artifact, and deciding to drop it as a guiding factor in your life, but cutekitty, there are no emotional shortcuts.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but your initial grasp of full-blown apostate was a bit quick. I think there are those whose shelves load up over the years, and it's more like a building weight which eventually becomes unbearable, and that muscles built in supporting that strain has prepared them, in ways, for the inevitable crash.

The way you described your awakening was very different from that - it's like you didn't feel any weight, little to no effort in propping up any shelf, then boom. In the space of a month or so, that shelf was constructed, overloaded, and crashed down. You quickly cleaned out the broken pieces and junk laying around, but your life is not the same as it was, and never will be. I think the realizations of all that entails may be beginning to settle in.

You miss your friends, your former community, even the shared language. I think you miss knowing all the things you used to know as a certainty. Your very bright mind is miles and miles ahead of your still broken heart, to which you refused to yield. I think that might be why DTA's comment hurt so much. You might have tried to view atheism as your "new community," but got slammed by one of those "members."

I grew up in your general area, and in so many ways, understood your POV and lightning-quick movement, the stiff upper lip. I enjoyed reading your references of things familiar to me, your tone of voice. (I am also an atheist.)

Not all understand the intent of that tone, something one learns by moving elsewhere. When I read your initial post here, I thought, "Wow. People will take that the wrong way." I left it alone, but a couple of days ago, I wondered what had happened to you, if you had had an accident, illness, or even, god forbid ;), you caved and went back to church.

I think I see now how maybe the pain has caught up with you, how the loss of all that was, bites at your heals. We are here, we will care. As to DTA's rough response, I ask that you consider your show of *not give a shit what anyone else thinks*. You projected an invulnerability to criticism, and if I recall correctly, even to the point of giving "both barrels" to a bishop. That was you, wasn't it? (I'm really not sure right now.)

Anyway, I think the sensitivity (no fault or blame) was lurking, waiting to be aired. It had to happen. I don't know that anyone as vested in LDS can escape so emotionally unscathed as what you were projecting. It is your turn to heal.

I could be totally wrong, but wanted to offer my best to you. I'm glad there was no accident or illness, and glad to see you back.

Take care of you. I missed you.

answers are going to come from all over the place!

I have placed my faith in the Bell Shaped Curve. There is ample evidence suggesting that it is a valid model of how things 'shake out' in the Real World.

The only thing is, it deals with individuals without knowing who the winners and losers are!

Here's a 4 minute YouTube video demonstrating how the Bell Shaped Curve works. the model you see represents Real Life. On one side are horrible outcomes, with glorious outcomes at the other end. In the middle is where all the action is...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUSKTk9ENzg

Again, each little ball is a person and when the person begins the bouncy-bouncy journey from the top, the BSC doesn't know who you are and doesn't care a whit about you. It just works its BSC 'magic' and someone wins the lottery and someone else has a car fall out of an airplane on to his big toe.

The BSC is not offended by prayers, so that's a good thing...

Funny how things shake out.

A BSC worldview is incomplete without the Pareto Distribution:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_distribution

Each morning, after ablutions, I bow to Beauty Truth and Goodness.

I pray that I will see this Trinity during my day.

Human

*Meant to be threaded at the bottom of the page*

I just don't

You can pray to me or to allah or to Joe Pesci.
The results will be the same.

Thanks EOD. EOD has some real answers to stuff and seems real knowledgeable about such things so I think we should give it a whirl. I'll just end em "in the name of BSC, amen."

I don't actually pray, given that the BSC has no ears...

It's just a known distribution and I simply keep hoping to stay lucky, plus I keep looking up to see if any cars are falling towards me. Seems like a prudent thing to do.

Also, I try to avoid Darwin Award type activities.

I am a nevermo, so my response may not be exmormon-congruent, but here is my long-considered (since I was about nine years old) take...

Worldwide, the word "prayer" can mean:

1) Supplication (asking for something: good crops in the coming year...protection from danger for yourself or on behalf of others...the necessities, as well as the frivolities, of life...that your upcoming child or grandchild will be healthy, the birth process will go easily and well, and/or that the newborn infant will be a specific gender, or a deeply desired "kind" of child, such as business-minded or artistically-oriented...). "Supplication" also includes the many global religions where continued, conscious, connection with deceased ancestors is considered very important for both safety (protection from danger) reasons, as well as to request needed or desired favors for one's own self and for still-living family or group members, etc. "Supplication" prayer also includes prayers of thanks for answered prayers and other good things which have not specifically been asked for.

2) Obedience to the expectations of a specific culture or cultural conformity re: prayer...the religious culture you are a part of demands/expects that you will say specific, traditional, already-composed prayers (or do specific, more-inclusive rituals) at specific times or because of specific events: grace at mealtimes...at the rising or the setting of the sun...at the first appearance of the new moon...before you go to sleep at night...when you trip on a step or have survived an illness, or accident, or catastrophe (etc.).

3) "Connection"

This covers tremendous spiritual ground, from feeling connected to Nature (trees...a specific geographical area...or living creatures (birds, dolphins, primates, dogs, cats, etc.)...or "reality" of a kind which is personally experienced as a "single," unified, lifeform...

...or: unification with an overarching Reality, however conceptualized (Brahman..."God" (whether monistic or dualistic, "the Trinity," etc.)...Jesus Christ (etc.)

"Connection" is the spiritual territory of mystics, regardless of what tradition those mystics identify with: Christian (particularly Catholic; there have always been an abundance of Catholic mystics)...Jewish...Hindu...Buddhist...Muslim...an uncountable number of global tribal, or geographically-based, religions, as well as countless "individual" religions which are, by necessity, invented by those individuals who seek this kind of "connection," but who have no available resources to either learn from, or to experience through.

Once you are able to determine "why" you (as an individual) pray, or "what" you (as an individual) pray or pray for, you will then be able to look for alternatives which are able to meet YOUR (specific) needs in a non-LDS way.

One of the things I have discovered is that that mysticism (as well as, in general, the "All Is One" religions or philosophies) tends to be a kind of "common ground," and different mystical traditions can often be used as alternatives when alternatives are needed.

What I am specifically thinking of here (because I know both of these things fairly well) is that there is a great commonality between Jewish mysticism and Hindu mysticism---to the point where they can be used as practical, "hands-on" alternatives for each other. I know this may appear to make no sense, but it can make a great deal of sense to those who hit the "Jewish wall"---because the Jewish mystical tradition, while justly revered within Judaism, is extremely opaque, historically fairly inaccessible, and can also be somewhat "bare" when compared to the much more realized, far more accessible, and comparatively more ancient Hindu mystical traditions. (Buddhism is also, I have been told, an alternative which, on a practical basis, is more accessible to many people, particularly Jews.)

On this level, the religions which have sufficient mystical tradition, real world experience, and erudition are all, in truth, talking about "the same thing," and some mystical doors are significantly more accessible than others, especially on the level of individuals exploring their individual potentials.

(My sense is that this "group" would also include some tribal religions as well, particularly, in my understanding, the Hopi religion. From what I do know, which is not all that much, Hopi religion very likely belongs in this group of religions.)

In addition, and at least by the beginnings of the early twentieth century, there is now an established "history" of sorts that many of those who deal with theoretical physics/mathematics/astronomy (etc.), also (at some point in their professional lives or personal interests) enter into this group. In particular, it is fairly common for certain kinds of physicists to begin study of Sanskrit and some of the ancient Hindu texts at some point in their professional lives, as they reach certain levels of scientific understanding and want to continue their search for new personal insight as well as professional/personal growth.

In other words: When physicists or mathematicians (in particular) hit "the wall," the now-fairly-accepted "place to go" in order to get beyond that perceived inner blockage is to begin (or, for some, to continue) Sanskrit/Hindu studies.

If you identify what you, as an individual, "need" from prayer, it is then a great deal easier to identify and locate alternative resources which will fit with your unique individuality (as you exist, right now), and your own personal needs.



Edited 6 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2017 04:29AM by Tevai.

I used pray faithfully to the Mormon-created god, before I discovered that this unforgiving, mythical deity did not exist. I pray no more.

Today it was Mother Goddess. Sometimes I pray to myself, since prayer is just self talk anyway. Not so much Heavenly Father anymore. That dumb shit thought Mormonism was a fine idea.

I still say prayers.

The Lord's Prayer is one I use daily. Personal prayer and supplication is in addition to that.

At worship services we have prayer services with community prayers and liturgies. I love those because they're inspirational, uplifting, and speaks to the heart.

Prayer has helped me in my life deal with whatever's going on, including leaving Mormonism.

I've been blessed through prayers, noticeably. Have had my prayers answered. Maybe not the ones I'd have wanted, but they were the ones I needed at the time.

Some people use meditation as a form of prayer. I was never able to implement silent meditation into my daily routine by itself. But that's because prayer is what works for me.

My meditation time usually follows praying. That's been some of the most productive times I've gained insights that have helped to guide my life by and make major decisions.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/16/2017 03:38PM by Amyjo.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/16/2017 03:34PM by Amyjo.

Some people, despite leaving Mormonism, still believe in Jesus and/or God. Christianity was around long before Mormonism came along.

I don't pray often, but when I do, I address it to Heavenly Father and Earth Mother. I decided long ago that if the male energy is to be included in the deity, then so must to the female energy. I don't feel "less than."

I ask for help from deity in very dire circumstances. More often, I just gaze at nature and send up some thoughts of appreciation.

If I need some help for an occasional practical, everyday matter, I send a thought to my deceased mom or my spirt guide (whom I've seen in dreams, and suspect is my great-grandmother,) for help. IMO we have lots of help available from our loved ones on the other side.

Personally, I look back on prayer as one of many time-wasters that I abandoned when I gave up on religion.

Haven't there been clinical studies that resulted in the finding that when you have a goal in mind, getting a positive result is the same whether you prayed or not?


And then there's the issue of something bad happening, that you would have done anything to avoid... What do you say in your next prayer?

I think first I am praying to myself.

Mark Twain said you cannot pray a lie.

I think prayer is first and foremost an expression of our desires. Keep my family safe, help me to ....., let me remember......, save me from......

In some way I think it helps us focus.

I believe Benjamin Franklin said God helps those that help themselves.

Once we pray and are determined to accomplish something are we really relying on diety or are we focusing on the task?

Whether we direct our request to a father/mother figure, a nameless formless enity, the great and grand architect of the universe or the universe itself, we are self acknowledging a need and a desire for that need to be met and hope that something will lead us or help us meet that need.

I worship the church of St. Pretendies. It's an offshoot of the Frisbeetarians, we believe our soul floats up and lands on a roof.

I assume the role of God and talk to myself out loud. This adds objectivity and distance to my normal way of thinking as I problem solve or make a wish list for my future

I take everything out of the cupboards of my mind, dust them off, and put them back in a new order.

We are able to look at other people's problems objectively because we are not personally involved. When you talk to yourself out loud and refer to yourself as "you" rather than "I" or even call yourself by your name, you are approaching your thought pattern from a different angle; allowing yourself to see from the outside in, or under or over the problem. You see what is circling around the challenge, not just the impetus of the anxiety. Getting out of your rut aids self exploration.

There are studies that support this although I haven't found anything definitive or conclusive. However, it works for me. I always tend to shake my head when talking to myself and have a very absorbed expression when I do it so if any one catches sight of me they think I'm "out of my mind," which is not that far off. Haha.

Put one of those blue tooth things in your ear and everyone will just assume you're on the phone.

Hahah. That's brilliant. I actually have a broken one so game on!

I read something about this! The article said referring to one's self in the third person lowered anxiety. "Dorothy is unhappy she ate 13 truffles. Alas."

The way I see it is God delivered me from a cult.

I give thanks to him for giving me the insight and wisdom to see that for myself.

He brought me out of the cult not to drop me. But to lift me up and keep my focus on him instead of cult idols and false teachings.

The church mixes up Joseph Smith worship with God worship. He's on "a pedestal next to God and Jesus Christ" in heaven, according to Mormon teachings. Now that I know that's all hooey, no god fearing person would worship a pagan idol - and Joseph Smith is a self-made god. He wanted people to worship him. God was an afterthought in his religion, but a ruse he used to deceive many.

As an Atheist I don't pray to anyone.

Seriously.

I handle my own life.

It's turning out so well.

Thanks Soft Machine.

I pray to God, which, to me is synonymous with 'good', Mother Nature, Tao and Logos and short for "God Particle" which isn't exactly a particle, more of a field that creates, permeates and animates first, the ghost particles, then the larger things from the building blocks of EVERYthing, imbuing it with genius, so much so that not even a single snowflake escapes its creative design.

so I talk to my parents, who both died 9 years ago. I don't pray. I just talk to them, usually when I'm driving or mowing the lawn or something where my mind is unoccupied in terms of I don't have doctors talking in my ears. I knew my parents. If there is a God, I don't remember knowing him and with all his children, where did I fit in? Besides, he gave me the name of Lucy.

When I walked away from the church, I was already inactive, but thought I'd eventually go back. My boyfriend even made the stupid assumption that some day when I'm close to death, I might decide to go back. I told him to shoot me before allowing me to do that. I'll never go back. I never give it a second thought. Now I just live my life. It is so much better out here.

Pray to nobody, praying is a ritual of control and submission and you have to deprogram this in my opinion. Or if you really have to pray, pray to yourself and save your own @ss or pray to a friend that you trust that has passed on which i have done. I decided i will not pray to someone that has never repaired me so the choice is obvious. F#ck even a guy like me could help you more than an invisible jesus. If you are waiting on a jesus for help you will only get made fun of by jesus followers in my experience. So pray to cutekitty, you took a shower this morning and brushed your teeth, it is you that is doing these things not jesus. The end. This month is a spit in the face for us. Celebrate a guy that doesn't do anything. Thanks for letting me rant. Praying only reduces your mentallity in my opinion. Deprogramming jesus with counseling is harder than deprogramming mormonism in my opinion. They are both intertwined bullsh#t. Those that religion hop after leaving mormonism have not recovered in my opinion. They are still programming their mind in the new religion which they will have to get counseling for later on. Letting religion go is part of growing up. You can't be a child forever and i am done being made fun of by jesus lovers. They know nothing specific about the guy, they don't know sh#t about him. Ok i am done ranting, f#ck december and f#ck that fantasy bulllsh#t. The end.

Badassadam1 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> F#ck even a guy like me could help you more than
> an invisible jesus.

Well, Bro, to be honest you both help me. I look to Jesus for my spirituality, to you for earthiness, bad language, friendship, and loud laughter.

So, you know, if you now tell me to go fuck my self, I'd reply, "You know that's anatomically impossible, and as i'm a guy, if it feels good I'd give it a try!"

As for you, wanker, please accept my sincere hope that your neck surgery will go well. Nothing would make me happier in January to get a post from the fuckin' Badass that says, "Folks, I'm feeling real good, the worst is over!"

I hope you know that my love and friendship for you is not based on religion. I care about you because your posts touch my heart. Your recent posts talk about healing and understanding your own self worth. That, Bro, is taking your own future by the balls and moving forward. I'm glad you're posting.

Here's a BIG virtual Bro hug to the Badass!

Don't look to me for anything boner i am far from 100% in all areas. I kind of feel like myself maybe partly. But other than that if there is a god, i am the pissed off old friend that nobody knows or talks about haha. That is seriously how it feels. You know those fathers in life that miss the entire life of their son and then try to make up for it it later in life when the kid is 29 but it's like waaay to late for the father to do anything to make up for the missed time. That's how me and god are if there even is one. Any help i needed was needed when i was a kid, any help now is like hitting a dead fish. This is what i have been facing, i either get totally normalized and acclaimated in life again or i got locked up again. I have to feel like a real person again after decades of not being one. Hell i don't even know if i have ever been my real self besides when i was a kid. I still feel controlled by religion and my parents even with non-stop therapy and living by myself for 3 and a half years. It's f#cking nuts. Sir david the bard said it is almost impossible to completely deprogram and he said you never fully recover, it's like a rape. But i saw a couple of mormons i once knew in the mall today i waved but they ignored me of course. They are so f#cking weird, i had no clue just how weird they were until i got out for a while. No wonder i never fit in, i may have been normal the entire f#cking time at church and i was just surrounded by weirdos. The celestial kingdom will be filled with do-do birds with fake smiles is what i learned today, and they will all shun each other. Anyways, go f#ck yourself haha jk, this is jesus month so i am pissed, hate jesus month no offense boner, i got locked up a couple years ago on christmas so its a personal month for me. This is why i am so vigilant with my health as much as i can be trying to become a 'normal' human that can't be locked up again. I get very angry this month. Some that suffer agree with me, we should not celebrate that guy year after year, its a big insult to the badass whether he exists or not. I really don't want to go under the knife again, it sucks big time, but acupuncture is helping in the meantime, the guy isn't charging me, he is definitely on the same page with helping the badass get back to top form as soon as possible. No f#cking around and no distractions i did acupuncture twice this week and i never do that. It will be a battle to get through this winter for sure. I might have a friend move in with me to save on rent he just moved here from nevada so works for me i said haha. We are bringing in all the supports right now, feels like its the 2 minute drill in the fourth quarter of a football game, only wish the body could fix any problem it has but it can not, it definitely can't fix everything by itself. If i bitch i am sorry as long as i get to the goal i don't really care.

I pray/meditate to God and ask for things. The God I am asking is pure intelligent energy ----- whatever that means.

My prayers/meditation requests are answered by 'spirit guides'. I have a number of them but the one I am most familiar with is one that appears to be 6' tall and has blond curly hair. We were suppose to be either close brothers or friends in a past incarnation.

Does he give me everything I ask for ----- not yet. I don't know the 'rules' other than trial and error and find out what I get responses to.

He is really good at protecting me from danger. I also get 'answers to questions' through dreams. I am not sure who (possibly spirit guides, soul, subconscious)is answering those but the dreams are super cool but have limits what I get a response to.

Thus far I have not been given specific answers to 'define God' (infers humans cannot comprehend), also, to questions about the stock market. It appears some things we just have to make decisions for our self. However, the 'dreams' when I can remember them give me more insight than just a no or yes answer.

I can't believe nobody has nominated the Flying Spaghetti Monster yet. Come on people, this is not good work.


Tactus Membro Spacelliformi.

In a dark and painful moment I talked to the universe. I asked for change.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2017 02:27AM by donbagley.

As a convert, I noticed that Mormonism taught very little about God and the personality of Jesus Christ as I learned in other churches. I had that to fall back on that most BICs don’t have.

I’m with Amyjo that it was with God’s help that I got outta mormonism.

Kathleen, If God got you out of Mormonism, who do you blame for getting you into it?

My ex-husband.

Actually, I blame myself for the whole thing. But, I had help getting out.

God always gets the credit but never the blame.

Oh he gets plenty of blame too.

kathleen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> I’m with Amyjo that it was with God’s help
> that I got outta mormonism.

____________________________________________

I was 'born and raised Mormon' but count me in that a number of 'spiritual' experience got me out also.

I wish my mom could have seen the light like you did, kathleen.

She was a convert who went to her grave believing that silly nonsense. Even after she'd stopped attending for many years after marrying my stepdad because she didn't feel worthy enough to set foot back inside a ward meeting house owing to her resumed tobacco habit.

Imagine never feeling good enough to go to church because she was a smoker. And yet that is how the Mormons made her feel. So she stopped going.

She couldn't give up tobacco (I tried to get her to, but she was too addicted to be able to quit.) And likewise she believed in Mormonism after having been raised a Methodist in Utah. She'd been a devout Methodist too lol. Was president of Methodist youth for the state of Utah while she was in high school.

Only converted in her 20's after she married my father. He was BIC. And was able to at least believe in the parts of Mormonism he could accept. While he rejected the parts of Mormonism he just couldn't. My stepmom was the same as my dad. They shared that in common.

(OUT OF HABIT) -

I recently prayed for Healing of my family:

I guess god didn't care or wasn't listening (Helping someone find their keys, I surmise), because I've been hoping - wishing - praying for that about 17 years...

O, btw, apparently the LDS Church isn't caring about that either, they don't recognize or acknowledge my former wifes Hatred or Lies... They're officially sanctioned by the Lord's only True Church!

I had a neat experience with prayer following a strange dream I had about my daughter.

My son called me twelve hours later that same day to tell me about the strange dream he'd just had waking up on the other side of the world in a completely different timezone. He had nearly the exact same dream I'd had earlier.

So what did I do with whatever message that was intended for us?

I prayed about it fervently. My daughter is my Prodigal Child who has given me great cause for concern.

No sooner had I finished saying my prayer when I opened the bible to whatever page I could find. And there it was: Jesus healing the woman who touched the hem of his garment. And in the same paragraph he raised the daughter from the dead.

No sooner had I read that when I had a peace and a calm wash over me that he was in control and everything was going to be alright.

It's answers like that to my prayers that keep me praying for direction and guidance in my life, and the lives of my loved ones.

As messed up as the church is, with its dirty cult tricks and underhanded control tactics, it did get one thing right. If you want to find God, look within. That’s what prayer is. God is inside every living thing.

It’s one big network, harking back to our fungal days as mycelial networks. We left that behind 650 million years ago to become animals. Then we moved to the trees, then to the plains of Africa. Big-brained talking apes who can still bow our heads and connect to the immaterial oneness of existence that we’ve always been.

God is nature, not some Old Testiment asshole or New Testament hippie.

I try to commune with my dead grandparents from time to time. Basically just asking how they're doing and channeling their energy through the memories I have of them. They were genuinely good people who valued the right things in life. "Pray" to whatever inspires you to be your best self in the moment.

Prayers are you talking to yourself about what you want or need, and hoping something/somebody else will take care of them for you.

If they get you to think through what you want/need, and act to take care of those things yourself, then they're useful.

If not...they're not. :)

Reluctantly, I have given up the belief that there is a power that can "have my back" when I need the support.

I can't force myself to pray to someone who isn't there. It's like leaving a message on a phone where nobody ever picks up and really answers.

It's like shouldering the responsibility yourself, because there isn't anybody else to turn to. It's scary, it's sad, and it's hard. But once you admit that there IS NOT a higher power in your corner, you can deal with it.

My ex-in-laws lived in New York City. I remember my MIL, one of the sweetest ladies I ever knew, talking about a Don Somebody or other. If there was an injustice in the building, like several seniors who paid their rent on time, had made multiple complaints about the A/C not being fixed during the scorching summertimes, these seniors would go, in a delegation, to see Don So-and-So. Their trust in him was absolute. And he delivered. It wasn't like in The Godfather, where they had to "do a favor" in return.

He looked out for his people. Now, THERE was a "higher power" that you could trust. He had muscle, he delivered on his promises. Kind of makes you re-think the system.

One way to ask the question might be, "If an exmo still feels they want to pray, who would they be likely to pray to.

That shows a little more understanding of the diversity on this board.

But I don't think there's a good reason to use insults or bad language just because someone wants to pray and others don't.

Try not to be upset about it. Certain comments show more about the speaker than the person they're addressing.

Thank you, Cheryl. I wear my feelings on my sleeve these days and was really upset. I need to grow a spine and move on. I love RfM and the banter that goes on here.

I was shocked to read another posters' take on two prominent, popular posters here, who still go to an LDS church! I was confused as to why they were here and not recovering from MORmONism? Riding the fence as I see it.

Everyone here has had their own journey out of the church. I'm sure it can be confusing to see that many here are still attending, active members of their wards. That doesn't mean that they aren't "recovering". It's just that their life is taking a different path than yours.

There is no need to judge them as "Riding the fence". You simply don't know what's going on in their life, and that's OK. There are a lot of reasons why people who know the truth about the church might still attend, from family, social connection, sometimes even a persons job might require it. Some are just starting to question and are looking for support and answers. They too can often need the support and relief that posting here can provide. Yes, even if they are still attending.

I wouldn't think it's so bad, certainly not as bad as the foul language in an earlier reply.

I don't pray. What I do is keep my mind visualizing the future and how I want it to be. As time passes, I keep that vision and take steps to achieve it however fast or slow, and at some point I do achieve it.

I miss George Carlin.

HH =)