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Posted by: koriwhore ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 01:22PM

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10150483977309999&id=5281959998

How is it the NYT, like EVERY gd editor, FAILS miserably, at asking the most obvious question of Bushman?
And you think you are morally superior to gays, and their children when you sing this pervert sexual predator's praises why?
You lying sack of shit.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2017 01:38PM by koriwhore.

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Posted by: BYU Boner ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 01:35PM

Koriwhore, I don’t have Facebook, so I can’t see the link. But, D&C 132 is always my “I’m in a fuckin’ cult ‘Revelation.’” It took me a while to closely read what the actual text said (I used to skim read a lot); and once I found out about the real reason behind Horny Joe’s motivation, I was thoroughly disgusted at myself for not investigating Mormonism thoroughly before I joined. Hugs, Bro!

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Posted by: BYU Boner ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 01:35PM


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Posted by: Ih8church ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 01:42PM

John Taylor, (who later became lds prophet) personal account of Joseph Smith reaching around the door and firing his peppetbox pistol (brought to the jail by cyrus wheeler)into the mob shooting two men who later died.

My hell.. thats like finding out Jesus died in a sword fight and not on a cross.

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Posted by: BYU Boner ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 02:00PM

Thanks Buffalo!

LA’s news station, KNXT, broadcast a short clip on JS’s BD right after I had joined the Morg. They ended with a line, “Smith was a polygamist with 40 wives.” This was in the early 1970s so the information was out there. My nevermo Dad said, “well, how about that!” Like all newbies, I quickly brushed off any difficult info about the church because it had to be true.

The next sacrament meeting, a member of the bishopric mentioned the news report and said, “The world still doesn’t know what we’re about.” Everyone chuckled and went on with business as usual.

Now, more than 40 years later, I realized that pre-internet TBMs could easily ignore what scholars knew. Continual coverups no longer work in the Information Age. The best the Morg apologists can do is write nebulous responses and bury them (think of how the essays are buried on LDS.org) in hopes that folks do not investigate too deeply or actually read the apologies. Big bro-hugs to you, too, Buffalo! Bushman’s Boner.

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Posted by: mightybuffalo ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 04:30PM

You're welcome boner.

It amazes me how the church operates like a big sales company. They highlight the goods and positives (overly so, if I may add) and seek to smother the negative. Overselling your product is a great way to leave your buyers underwhelmed, especially when they pay 10% for...what exactly??

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Posted by: Lethbridge Reprobate ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 02:09PM

Nothing I ever heard about JS or BY surprised me.

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Posted by: MeM ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 02:11PM

For sure the seduction of young girls, the marrying other men's wives and the polygamy.
And yet, learning about multiple conflicting accounts of the first vision was also sickening as I had so much emotionally invested in the church approved version of that story.

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Posted by: anagrammy ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 02:27PM

The wives of Joseph smith site lays out the most revolting aspect of Joseph Smith's character - his unbridled lust and willingness to commit adultery and lie to his wife, his friends, really anyone. And if women refused his advances, he threatened them and followed through with calling them whores and destroying their characters.

That Joseph Smith schemed and bargained to get into the pants of the young daughters of his friends. And then hiding his pedophilia from his wife...just like Virgin Mary's pregnancy, right?

Using their belief in his prophetic calling, Smith wheedled and pleaded to be allowed to f*ck their teenagers, promising salvation for the entire family if he could just get his rocks off.

Age 17 - Sarah Whitney

https://professorpark.wordpress.com/2017/10/16/sarah-ann-whitney-blessing/

Age 14 - Helen Mar Kimball

http://www.wivesofjosephsmith.org/26-HelenMarKimball.htm


Starting with Fanny Alger, the maid he was caught banging in the barn (by Emma herself), Smith proved himself to be a serial adulterer in addition to the con man he already was (convicted).

These facts of history were just unbelievable to me at first. It just seems like such a big lie, it MUST be the enemies of the church propagating such drivel.....

When I finally saw the microfilm records with my own eyes thanks to Sandra and Jerald Tanner, I couldn't believe the truth. Part of it, of course, was that you just don't want to believe you could be so hoodwinked.

And then the horror of having to tell your children you have led them astray. What will they think of me ? Will they ever believe me again? What if they want to stay in the church?

I still remember the sick feeling in the pit of my stomach when I realized the church was a con. Nausea while removing my garments. And a long-lasting feeling of being stupid, a dupe.


Kathleen

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Posted by: presleynfactsrock ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 04:15PM

Sure is a challenge to pick out the "most" sickening revelations of ole sleazy Joey as they were entirely selfishly self-serving and efficiently arriving just when he needed them....you know, in the nick of time to allow him to get what he wanted.

Revelations that served his perverse sexual desires, revelations that left sincere believing people in tears and poverty after Joe had swindled them out of their life savings, property and their dreams, plus his carefully calculated "translations" with such hoaxes as the Book of Mormon and his tricks with the Egyptian manuscripts.

But, since I need to pick one out of the very many, I will pick his revolting revelations which shouted to young, naive girls that god had told him that if they didnt't marry HIM, THE SO-CALLED PROPHET, they and their families would not make it to the celestial kingdom.

This was beyond disgusting. Joey should have been locked up forever at these utterances of cruel bullying threats to young innocent people.

Can you imagine how terrifying it must have been for these girls? A man of 35, 36 in your face spitting out these things to you when you are only 16 or 17, and you are an indoctrinated member to boot?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/12/2017 04:27PM by presleynfactsrock.

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Posted by: dagny ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 04:17PM

The complete fraud of the Book of Abraham papyrus fiasco.
I mean, seriously!? He pulled that off?

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Posted by: summer ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 04:42PM

Joseph Smith threatened young, naïve girls. He had sexual relations with them and took away the possibility of dignified, public marriages for those girls when they reached the point of maturity. When the Nauvoo Expositor detailed his perfidy (to the horror of the wider community,) he ordered the destruction of its printing press. He took advantage of wards under his care. There is persuasive evidence that John Bennett acted as his abortionist.

http://mormonpolygamydocuments.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/JS1042.pdf

There was nothing moral nor decent about this man.

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Posted by: koriwhore ( )
Date: November 12, 2017 05:24PM

What makes me sick is current Mormons lying through their teeth to defend Joseph Smith and BY raping children and destroying their follower's lives by cuckolding them and raping their wives.

Hi Kori,
Thank you for your interest in chatting with a member of the Church. What would you like to talk about?
Now chatting with: Christie and ถาวรนิวัตน์
Christie 12:40 PM
hi how are you
Kori 12:41 PM
Hi,I am good. I just read a New York Times article about Joseph Smith that says he had 40 wives, 11 of whom were married to his followers.Is that true?
How do you explain that you're singing the praises of a guy who 'married' his follower's wives, which violates every law ever written governing marriage, including the law he said he got straight from God?
The Law of the Priesthood is still the Law of God, right?
It condemns that kind of behavior in no uncertain terms, as adultery. I don't want to sing the praises of an adulterer and I sure don't want my kids singing his praises either.
Not OK with me.

Christie 12:48 PM
i don't exactly know how many wives he had, but he did have more than one. back in the 1800s the Saints were poor and didn't have much. there was a point where there were more women the men. it was really hard for the women to provide for themselves but also for their children. and in order to get exalted and return with God, women needed to be sealed to a man. so a lot of the men who were married to their wife had to be sealed to multiple women so those other women could be exalted. i hope that makes sense. but also here is an article that could maybe help
https://www.lds.org/topics/plural-marriage-in-kirtland-and-nauvoo?lang=eng
plural marriage was a commandment of God at that time. But now we no longer practice it.

Kori 12:49 PM
They were married to worthy Members of the church who were missionaries for the church, when Joseph 'married' (made concubines out of) their wives. How does your explanation make sense, that there were not enough men?

Christie 12:49 PM
because the men died from war, sickness, etc.

Kori 12:51 PM
No. They were all living when Joseph married them. Like Henry Jacobs, who served 8 missions for the church, while Joseph and Brigham stayed behind with his wife and made babies with her. That's a massive abuse of power. and what you're saying is completely wrong.

Christie 12:51 PM
did it say that in the New York Times?

Kori 12:51 PM
It says that in "In SAcred Loneliness" by Todd Compton, Mormon scholar on the issue. Authority cited in LDS.org's white paper on the subject, "Plural Marriage in Kirtland and Nauvoo"
It's very well documented.
fact.
There's no excuse as far as I can tell.
It's as inexcusable as Harvy Weinstein abusing his power to sleep with young actresses.

Christie 12:54 PM
https://www.lds.org/topics/plural-marriage-in-kirtland-and-nauvoo?lang=eng I invite you to read this and hopefully you will understand better about why this came about

Kori 12:54 PM
Do you think Joseph and Brigahm were right or wrong to marry their follower's wives?

Christie 12:57 PM
I just know that this was a commandment from God back in the 1800s. They didn't want to practice it, but they had to. and it ended by President Woodruff in 1890

Kori 12:58 PM
Where did God command Joseph and Brigham to 'marry' their followers wives when he commanded them NOT to do that in the 10 commandments and the Law of the Priesthood, D&C 132:61-65?
There is and never was any law that permitted a man to 'marry
another man's wife.
NEVER in all of Civilized society.
Not even Muslims allow that practice and they still practice polygamy, the last vestige of Barbary.

Christie 1:00 PM
i don't know the answer to that. I don't know all the answers to every question

Kori 1:00 PM
I just asked if you thought it was right or wrong? YOu can't tell me what you think?
I think God was abundantly clear on this topic. Don't you?
I mean how would it be if you were married to the love of your life and Thomas S Monson called him on a Mission and took you as one of his wives, while your husband was away serving a mission?

That's exactly what JS and BY did to their followers and I think they were dead wrong and adulterous for doing so. That's what God would have said. Don't you think?
Maybe ask your supervisor?

Christie 1:07 PM
one second

Kori 1:11 PM
I'm just asking if you think they were right to 'marry' their followers wives? Yes or no?

Christie 1:12 PM
Your sources are probably most likely true but it needs to be read in the right context. We do know that God commanded them to practice the law of polygamy. It is important to understand that this was extremely hard for them. I'm not sure where the sources came from that say they abused that law. For most of the women, it was strictly just a marriage in the temple and they have sexual relations with them.

Kori 1:12 PM
Polygamy isn't the issue. This wasn't polygamy. It was polyandry.

Christie 1:13 PM
It was right because it was commanded by God. We are limited in our knowledge and don't understand all of the commandments God has given us. Concerning your point that there is no scriptural evidence, if you read Jacob 2:27, it says it very clearly.

Kori 1:13 PM
This was claiming their follower's wives as their own. That's illegal, according to EVERY law. They cuckolded their followers by stealing their wives and destryoing their lives.

Christie 1:15 PM
"Wherefore my bretheren, hear me and hearken to the word of the Lord: for there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none....(30) For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things."

Kori 1:15 PM
It says they shouldn't have more than one wife. Seems like they viloated that by taking their follwers wives.
They made concubines out of hteir followers wives.

Christie 1:16 PM
If you continue reading the scripture, in Verse 30 it clearly states unless otherwise directed by God.

Kori 1:15 PM
How is that 'right' in your opinion?

Christie 1:16 PM
That was not what they were doing. They were only doing what God commanded them to do for the Salvation of the people.

Kori 1:16 PM
You still have not told me where God commanded that?

Christie 1:16 PM
It is also stated in the Bible.

Kori 1:17 PM
God NEVER told a man to take another man's wife.

Kori 1:17 PM
he alwas condemned it as adultery.

Christie 1:17 PM
Actually, He has. That was the common practice in Bible Times. Abraham and Jacob...so many other prophets because it was the will of God.

Kori 1:17 PM
the 10 Commandments specifically make that illegal according to God. Are you saying that some unwritten law supersedes the 10 Commandments?

Christie 1:18 PM
For the church to be restored, EVERY aspect of the church had to be restored. Even if it was just for a time.

Yes. That is exactly what I'm saying. God's current commandments ALWAYS will take precedent over His old commandments

Kori 1:18 PM
It was never God's commandment to marry another man's wife. Yes it happened, but it was not ordained by God or withing his law or any other law. It was always illegal, according to every law.

Christie 1:18 PM
Yes. it was ordained by God.

Kori 1:19 PM
Where is this law written, "Never mind the 10 Commandments that say not to lust after your neighbor's wife, feel free to 'marry your nieghbor's wife."?

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:20 PM
They didn't marry other men's wives. The women were all single or widows.

Christie 1:20 PM
It all comes down to your trust in God and whether you believe He has called these men as prophets. He commanded Jacob to marry Rachel and the other women. He commanded Abraham to marry multiple wives. Both for the purpose of their future generations

Kori 1:20 PM
\That's not true. The church even admits you're lying.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:21 PM
we aren't sure where you got your information from about marrying other men's wives, but that is not true.

Christie 1:21 PM
Can you show us your source?

Kori 1:21 PM
LDS.org. "Plural Marriage in Kirtland and Nauvoo"
Says he married other men's wives, between 12-14 of them. That's illegal. Always has been, always will be.
So you're saying, "at least he didn't have sex with them..." as if that justifies it. but Jacob 2:30 says that the only purpose for plural marraige was to 'raise up seed unto me" which means it was for sex, not just for eternity.

Christie 1:24 PM
It doesn't justify it? These men were doing everything they could to provide a stable environment for these women and children. Many of them were concerned that they wouldn't be sealed with their children and it was a security and peace for them to know that they were being taken care of.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:24 PM
In the article 'Plural Marriage and Families in Early Utah" it explains how polygamy was a challenge for them but... "They believed it was a commandment of God at that time and that obedience would bring great blessings to them and their posterity, both on earth and in the life to come." I have ancestors that had multiple wives, they all account of how hard it was and how they didnt want to do it.

Kori 1:29 PM
You still have not answered me, where is it written that God commanded his prophets to marry their follower's wives?

Christie 1:30 PM
The reason for the marriages between them and the women who were already married are not completely known. But they were just for eternity and not for time (on this earth). THey also could'eve been women who were previously married and had their husbands leave or pass away

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:30 PM
You can read about the commandment in D&C 132

Kori 1:31 PM
I've read D&C 132. It says 5 different ways, very clearly, that marrying another man's wife would be adultery. It condemns it. Clearly. Why are you lying about it?

Christie 1:31 PM
Then you know they said it must be done or "they shall be dammed." IF God gave them a commandment with that seriousness, who are they to go against God?

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:31 PM
Did you read the section heading at all???

Christie 1:32 PM
Kori do not accuse us of lying to you. We are doing our absolute best to find the answers for you.

Kori 1:32 PM
God didn't command them to marry their follower's wives. he commanded them NOT to do that. Just hte opposite of what you're saying. That's a lie.
You're both lying to defend adutlery. why?

Christie 1:32 PM
Have you even read the section??

Kori 1:32 PM
yes, over and over, its very clear about the qualifications for plural marraige.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:33 PM
Did you read Jacob 2:30?? They are to keep the commandment, unless God says otherwise, WHICH HE DID.

Christie 1:33 PM
And please do not accuse us of defending adultery. That is the complete opposite of what we are doing

Kori 1:33 PM
#1. The first wife had to give her permission. Emma never did.

Christie 1:33 PM
Yes she did.

Kori 1:33 PM
#2. They had to be virgins. Obviously married women were not virgins.
#3. They had to be vowed to no other man. Obviously married women were not marraige material.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:33 PM
Were are you finding these "rules"?

Christie 1:33 PM
She didn't want to but she did because she knew it was a commandment of God. Can you please state the verses where each of these are mentioned?

Kori 1:34 PM
#4. They had to be 'given' to the man. Obviously they were not given to Joseph and Brigham if they were already 'given' to their only REAL husbands.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:34 PM
They were married before, meaning they were widowed.

Kori 1:34 PM
The Law of the Priesthood, D&C 132:61
No, their husbands were all living and continued living with them AFTER they were (pretend) "Married" to Joseph and Brigham. Quit lying.

Christie 1:35 PM
Well of course it says it in section 132!! That is the section where the prophet was given revelation to end the law of polygamy.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:36 PM
WE ARE NOT LYING. We doing our best to ask your questions. Not to argue. Please stoop accusing us.

Kori 1:36 PM
#5. They had to be with no other man once they entered into plural marriage. They all continued living iwth their only REAL husband, after Joseph and Brigham pretended to "Marry' them since there is now law permitting a man to marry a woman who is already married.

Christie 1:36 PM
Those rules that you are stating are from when polygamy is abolished- what we follow now...so of course those are true.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:36 PM
Have you tried praying and asking God yourself??

Christie 1:36 PM
Bottom line is that nothing we say is going to change your testimony and faith in God's prophets. This is something you need to pray about and study for yourself. Our job isn't to convince you to stay in the church. We invite others to strengthen their faith in Christ. But only you can do that.

Kori 1:36 PM
If you're saying just the oppsoite of the truth, that is a lie.
Why do you keep saying the oppostie of what is true? If you're not a liar?

Christie 1:37 PM
Kori do you believe this is the true church?

Kori 1:38 PM
What's that got to do with whether sexual exploitation of their followers was right or wrong?

Christie 1:38 PM
Everything.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:38 PM
If you have a firm testimony, you wouldn't be doubting your faith like you are now.

Kori 1:38 PM
Nothing. The truth is independent of what I believe.

Christie 1:38 PM
If you believe that these men were truly prophets of God, this wouldn't be an issue.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:38 PM
Kori, do you believe that Joseph Smith saw God the Father and Jesus Christ?

Kori 1:39 PM
I'm not doubting my faith in God, just my faith in men who ruined their followers lives by claiming their wives as their own, when that violates EVERY law ever written, including the 10 Commandments and the Law of the Priesthood.

Christie 1:39 PM
So you still believe in God. Do you believe that He calls prophets?

Kori 1:40 PM
Yes I believe in God. I belive in the God who said not to have sex with your neighbor's wife. Not the one who said just the opposite.

Christie 1:40 PM
You didn't answer our question.

Kori 1:41 PM
I said yes. That's an answer. You still have not answered my question. Where did God say to marry your followers wives?
Nowhere.
You lied about that too.
he said just the opposite.
Which version, the original version, where he said he saw, "The Lord"? Singular? or the official 4th version, written 18 years after the fact, under duress, after heavy editing?

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:43 PM
Let go of your pride and sincerely ask God your questions. It's not a matter of who is right, it's a matter of what is right. Open your heart and ask God.

Kori 1:43 PM
I know what God said.
He was abundantly clear about having sex with your neighbor's wife.

Christie 1:43 PM
If you don't have a testimony of that then why is it bothering you to learn about polygamy?

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:43 PM
"If you lack wisdom ask God..."

Christie 1:44 PM
Kori we can't answer your questions. No matter what we tell you, you will fight against it. We are not here to satisfy your demands.

Kori 1:44 PM
Why would I need to ask him in Prayer? When he was already perfectly clear about what he thought of that practice in the Bible.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:44 PM
Clearly, you're not accepting our answers, so ask God. He's the only one that will give you the answer you are seeking for.

Kori 1:44 PM
I just asked a question. You're here to answer questions. And you refuse to answer my simple question, where is your claim written? Back it up.
Where did God say to marry your neighbor's wife and make babies with her?

Christie 1:45 PM
He knows everything. We don't and you don't. We have been called by a prophet to share what we do know but if it isn't enough for you, then we are sorry. All we can say is God does.

Kori 1:46 PM
You said God commanded JS and BY to marry their followers wives. I just asked where is that written? Simple question. Not a question for God.

Christie 1:46 PM
We said that they were commanded to practice the law of polygamy as instructed by God.
Why isn't it a question for God?
Christie 1:47 PM

Kori 1:47 PM
Polyandry is not polygamy. I never asked about polygamy. I asked about Polyandry, marrying other men's wives. Totally different topic.
You're defelecting.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:48 PM
Well then your answer is simple. They didn't practice Polyandry, they practiced polygamy.

Christie 1:48 PM
Of course we are. We are telling you we don't have an answer that will satisfy you.

Kori 1:48 PM
What? They marreid otther men's wives. That's polyandry, not polygamy. Why are you lying again?

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:48 PM
It was just widowed women. we've told you a few times, did you not get those messages?

Christie 1:49 PM
What reason would we have to lie? We believe this with every fiber of our being. We are saying what we know to be true.

Kori 1:49 PM
That's a lie. It wasn't just widdowed women. LIke I said, they were all married to their real husbands, who were alive and well and often serving missions for the church.
Why do you keep repeating the same lie when even your own church admits it's true they married their followers wives?

Christie 1:50 PM
Kori we will say it agian: We do not have the answer for you.
So you lie?
When you don't have an answer?
Don't lie about it, when we both know the church admits he really did 'marry' his followers wives. to me that's reprehensible and disqualifies Joseph as a Prophet in my opinion.

Christie 1:52 PM
The church can say anything about it but nothing will shake our faith that Jesus is the Christ, that this is His church restored back on the earth today, that Joseph Smith and Brigham Young and every prophet since then was and is called of God. We are sorry that you have allowed this to shake your faith and beliefs but it has not done the same for us. We are sorry to have led you on in this conversation- we should've told you right of the bat that nothing we say will change your mind.

ถาวรนิวัตน์ 1:53 PM
We've shared scriptures with you, we've shared what we know, but you continue to fight it. You are only going to find an answer by asking God. We hope you can receive your answer. we will pray for you. Have a great day, Kori.

The chat session has ended.

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Posted by: mightybuffalo ( )
Date: November 13, 2017 01:45AM

Koriwhore I love it when you post these. Very entertaining stuff. Keep it coming PLZ

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Posted by: valkyriequeen ( )
Date: November 13, 2017 10:15AM

I like Koriwhore's posts too. It just amazes me how brainwashed these people are; they aren't capable of giving a straight answer to a straight forward question. They don't get it that D&C 132 was made up by JS so that he could bitch-slap Emma into her place. I'll bet all of these young people would even defend the MMM because they are so ingrained in this stuff.

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Posted by: koriwhore ( )
Date: November 14, 2017 04:23PM

Every missionary I've met lately who I've asked this question has lied through their teeth by claiming God commanded Joseph and Brigham to cuckold their followers by raping their wives and teenage daughters.
I was a missionary, but I never would have stooped to the level missionaries do EVERY GD time I ask them, "So you sing the praises of a man who cuckolded his followers by pretend 'marrying' their wives after sending them off on missions overseas why?"
Whenever I see missionaries these days I just think, "lying sacks of shit!" because I know they are.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXW-CHtD07g&t=45s

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Posted by: kathleen ( )
Date: November 13, 2017 12:58PM

For some reason, I never praised Joseph Smith like the other Smith-ers.

But, I was pretty startled to learn about his imaginary friend--that flaming-sword angel.

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