I definitely experienced shunning post-exit.

However, I think it was more a case of their not knowing what to say around me anymore, so staying away was less awkward, not intended maliciously.

Maybe I am wrong about this. Just my view

YIPEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

Couldn't stand those self-righteous b*stids anyway.

Neither can I! I'm glad I was not baptized! I would regret it and it is hard to leave a cult!

Harder than you will ever know.

When I, DH & children left we experienced shunning as well. I think some may have been avoiding in a not malicious way but we had others who shunned us to cause harm and make a point. This was especially the case with our TBM family members. We would be invited to family events and then be glared at, avoided, ignored. We were invited to BIL's wedding last minute. We were also disinvited to many family dinners, birthdays & holiday events. We received many terrible emails from family.

We had ward members who wouldn't talk to us anymore. Would see us at the grocery store, flip their cart around and walk the other way. I could go on & on. It hurt...just like it was intended to. And due to their behavior we no longer have relationships with any of them, which turned out to be a really good thing.

I think that part of this was the way we left. We were a very active family from a large LDS family. We came across information that led us to not believing anymore. And it was very sudden. We were holding callings that we had to leave, our children were active in primary & activities. We had to tell our families right away because we all live close to each other. The news spread quickly. 5 years later we still experience it but it doesn't hurt as bad anymore. Its actually funny at times.

i am so sorry to hear that!

what did you come across that got you out so suddenly?

I was following the election when Romney was running. I was reading the comments on a news article. Somebody commented on the Book of Abraham...which I new nothing about, so I googled it. I think I first ended up at wikipedia and after reading that within minutes I knew it was all false. That led to other reading and it just all started to unravel. It was like a snowball that just kept growing and growing out of control.

me too. BofA did it for a lot of us.

Funny, the church probably saw Romney candidacy as a positive thing, but it led you out! :)

BofA is the weirdest book known to man and a total mindf#ck.

Oh looks like you are off to outer darkness! Yep that is what they do, even the missionaries said I guess you don't want blessings after all and just want to go to the spirit world! Because I found out the truth! Love is all gone when you don't want to be part of these snakes anymore!

I got it from the missionaries! And they said we are sorry you are struggling and we are sorry you feel that way! Wow more like we don't care how we hurt you we are only here to get numbers into our cult so we can marry a returned missionary!

Candice, you are a nice person, to give the "shunners" the benefit of the doubt, and the rest of us need to do this more often.

Not ALL Mormons like to punish and inflict pain on apostates. For example, some of my female cousins used to have very close relationships with me, but our separation happened when I got divorced, and had to concentrate on working to support my children. We just didn't have much in common, anymore. At first, they liked to call me, and complain about their husbands--maybe because I was divorced, and they hoped I would take their side, against their husbands? Spending those hours on the phone, listening to (petty) marital problems depressed me. My children needed me to listen to THEIR problems and ideas. My family actually wanted to HAVE FUN with me, in my free time.

Working full time, I simply had less time to spend with arts and crafts, sewing, cooking, going out to lunch with the girls, game-night. None of my former Mormon friends are interested in business, science, sports, and the environment, as my work colleagues are. Since the Mormon church ruled out all the different kinds good, enjoyable music, and allows only Mormon-written stuff, I no longer have music in common.

Music and children were my strongest common bonds with the Mormons. The cult became more authoritarian, over the years, and I stopped thinking that Mormons were great parents. When some of the adults began abusing my children--that was it! I left. Part of the shunning is due to differences in parenting style. My children appreciated honesty, and they didn't sneak around, and they refused to do anything immoral (except ski out of bounds and pull a few pranks, here and there).

When I got divorced, I was automatically no longer included in the couples social activities. I never took that personally--it was just awkward, that's all.

When I got divorced, I fell down to a lower economic level. I couldn't afford to go to the Shakespeare Festival in Cedar City, and I gave up my season tickets to the symphony and opera (and the friends I used to go with). I couldn't afford to give dinner parties and barbecues, anymore. We had to sell our cabin, and I lost touch with all the neighbors there.

So much of the Mormons' social world is church-oriented, that it is normal to be excluded from all of that. Nothing personal. I wouldn't want to go to the church things, anyway.

It's true that I have only a handful of Mormon friends, including within my extended family. It wasn't all because of blatant, overly mean shunning, but a lot of it was.

"Shunning" is as you described. It isn't just having people not notice you, for forget about you--it is downright mean-ness.

This is a little off subject and I'm sure you didn't mean this in a hurtful way but some people are awkward from disabilty or just more introverted by nature and its not there fault and even if it may be uncomfortable to be around them everyone shunning and staying away from them because they feel uncomfortable around them is very harmful to that person. Its the same thing as shunning someone if they didnt feel comfortable around that person anymore because they suddenly went blind or got diagnosed with cancer.

I realize you werent even talking about yourself you were talking about mormons and im not trying to tell anyone off im just simply trying to educate people on the matter. Im sure most people arent trying to be cruel they just dont understand whats going on in that persons life. Its just a matter that is close to my heart because I have known a few people who are awkward who have been shunned horribly and its had a terribly negative affect in there lives. Its not a matter that is well understood in our society at all and like I said not trying to lecture anyone just trying to spread awareness

Thanks for this post. Assigning intent behind actions is perilous. Saying shunning is 100% malicious is misguided. People act the way they do for multiple and changing reasons. Some of these actions are inexcusable no matter what, but others may be misinterpreted.

I'm guilty of some level of shunning to Mormons and my Mormon family. It's not malicious. I have some social anxiety and bipolar II. Uncomfortable, forced interactions are terrifying and exhausting. I didn't respond to missionary farewell parties. I don't attend family reunions where I know it'll be a steady diet of all things Mormon. I hope people forgive me.

Thanks for a different perspective.

Introverts might not mind shunning. I sure didn’t mind when my ex gave me the silent treatment. Peace at last.

It’s academic for me. When I left, I left everything. New friends, new environment, new everything. So, shunning wasn’t a thing. It didn’t matter if people in my old life thought I was dirt.

Good for you, babylon. Glass is half-full, my friend. I'm in the same boat, brother. Peace. -edz

But did you move out of town to get away?

Oh, it's malicious.
Absolutely, intentionally, demonstrably.

It's a "tough love" kind of idea, taken to extremes.
And it's behavior that's *taught* in all cults, including mormonism.

The idea behind it is simple:

You have chosen to behave in ways the group doesn't approve of. They tried coercing you back into acceptable group behavior, and it didn't work.
So they're punishing you. They're intentionally removing your social and family support systems (that's what shunning is). In the hope that you won't find any other support system, you'll get desperate and lonely, and you'll come running back to the cult -- where you'll do anything they ask to get your support system back.

Let's not pretend this is just simple awkwardness. It's intentional and malicious, and it's planned.

If it works to get you back, it's a win for them (in their minds).
If it doesn't work to get you back, they keep the rest of the cult from your "bad influence," and it's a win for them (in their minds).

So as far as they're concerned, there's no downside. They "win" either way. Never mind the destruction of families, the pain it causes, the lives it devastates -- all that matters is the continuation of the cult. Either with you or without your "bad influence."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/26/2017 09:33AM by ificouldhietokolob.

I agree with ificouldhietokolob: it's too generous to attribute shunning to awkwardness. Within the past 6 months, there have been several unexpected deaths in "the ward". We've been shunned by all of the deceased's families, but my husband and I wanted to show sympathy. We sent flowers/plants to each family and never received a thank you back or any acknowledgement that the flowers were received, except for one family and the mother added in her note: "we miss your family so much; please come back!" We didn't do this with the intention of being thanked, but it would have courteous to hear something back. I am done trying to be nice to these jerks.

Reminds of the times when I was left alone at parties and people I grew up with just looked at me or spoke to me with a haughty demeanor.

It was a helluva"Party" :)

After my TBM-wife divorced me, I was shunned. We had one TBM couple that were good friends and never pushed mormonism on me but after the divorce, she called me up and said, "I don't think you should date for a year." Try to imagine my response. Anyway, her husband told his wife,"Its none of our business, the marriage is over." He called me a week later and said they had a huge fight over ME dating. He said, you got divorced and I slept on the couch....

I was invited to go to a gathering at the insistence of a woman who said everyone wanted to see me because they hadn't in awhile (I've been out of the church for years). Well, I got there and she was really nice to me, everyone else maybe made eye contact with me once, a couple of them said "hi" (yes, just hi) and then went back to what they were doing. No one really had anything to say to me, I don't think anyone else had really cared or wanted me there at all from the get-go. It became awkward for me fast when I realized that no one was going to make any effort to speak to me except her, and she was also busy part of the time playing with a new grandkid, so I spent most of my time at a table by myself while everyone else carried on. No one ever asked me how I'd been doing or tried to include me.
I felt really uncomfortable and knew I wasn't wanted there.
I'm sure the people there would say "we didn't leave her out, we said hi" because as long as you say "hi" with a straight face and then turn around and resume your conversations with your real friends, it doesn't count as shunning. And that if I'd wanted to be included, I should've found a way to interject myself into their conversations. :/

TBMs don't know what to say or do. They're a little envious but also frightened and feel it's their responsibility to pressure exmos back to church. They think if they cold shoulder someone, it might make them want to return to regain favor. They also want to let the exmo know that they have lost respect by leaving. Shunning is the other side of a coin. If shunning doesn't bring someone back, mormons tend to try love bombing. They often alternate back and forth between fake love and shunning for years.

Been shunned. Do not care. There are 6 or 7 billion people on earth. Morons are a drop in the bucket. Live. Laugh. Love. Be the kool person you are and enjoy your freedom!

I am a kool person i never realized this but it might be true it might be true haha, no wonder i never fit in with the cult ;).

I didn't pay much attention to Mormons after that, so I'm not sure what they might have done.

(You can see it really affected me a lot - NOT!!!)

One of the times was pretty funny. I had a couple who were my HTs. I had known her for a long time as we had VT together years before. I told the bishop I no longer wanted HTs. I saw the couple when they were out walking one day and waved at them as I drove by. The husband started to wave at me and his wife grabbed his arm and pulled it down.

BUT shunning happens while still active mormon. I haven't made this statement for a while. I was treated better in mormonism while with my gay husband who happened to be cheating than I ever was at any other time. He knows how to play the mormon social game. He lives here now and the mormons fall all over themselves to talk to him. People just tend to like him. I grew up in a family where my dad wasn't all that active and my mother was shy and not very social. We were NOT treated as mormon royalty, although we came from mormon royalty. I didn't realize that I qualified as mormon royalty until I came to this website.

Mormons are very cruel to those who don't completely fit into their idea of who you should be.

When I saw that my husband would be leaving me, I went inactive so my kids would not be treated as second class. I never wanted them to be treated like I was as a child.

Your HT's wife's behavior was utterly reprehensible as a kind gesture is free. When I left the church I was treated miserably
It was , perhaps, one of the rudest awakenings. I had no idea the degree of venom and meanness that could exist in the hearts of these people. I still can't believe how naive and fooled I was all these years

My TBM daughter is home from her job in Alaska for a few months and when she comes, she brings the TBMs back into my life and their attitude of being better than I am and more qualified to be her mother. I miss her and want to see her, but once she gets home, I think, "Be careful what you wish for." She is staying with her despicable aunt who she hardly knows, who told me years ago she is lesbian, but now denies it (in a 10 page single-spaced, typed letter no less), but she is TBM, so my daughter is safe staying there. Then she will be moving in with the TBMs 2 doors down from me until after Christmas.

Isn't it lovely?!?!?

You have had several devastating experiences over the years and when the meanness and cruel behavior seems to never end I found that there comes a time when I had to be proactive and know that l had to do something for myself or lose every shred of self respect that I had left. I became very proficient at blocking phone numbers and cutting some people out of my life completely.

When a person leaves the church it is similar to a mother hen rejecting her chick and all the hens help her peck it to death.
Terrible as it sounds they take joy in your pain and some even get an adrenaline rush because the church gives tacit as well as vocal approval for the dispicable behavior of shunning and worse.

Insulate yourself from these idiots and be as unavailable as you can. It takes more energy to run away from something than to run towards something.
Lose yourself in something you love and your daughter will return and find you. Mine did.

That is my plan. I have been friendly with the family 2 doors down. He was a prior bishop (though they were inactive when they moved here). I'm no longer going to interact with them. I'm going to be busy where my daughter is concerned. I already am, so I don't have to work on it. She's gone to Alaska at least half the year, this year 8 months, so I have plenty to do without making up things to do. IN fact, yesterday, I went shopping and she was here when I got home. She had texted me (I didn't have my phone) and said she'd only be here a short time so if I wanted to see her. She stayed a lot longer than she planned. My ex's sisters I've cut off in the past year. I'm sick of them posting things the church says about gays and I've called them on it.

I'm not a very social person anyway, so it isn't a big deal to me to cut people out of my life.

I posted something about what my daughter told her dad on the way home from the airport the other day about her experience in the temple. They talked about things she should NOT have been talking to him about. She went through the temple a few days before she took off for Alaska the 1st of March. I couldn't quit smiling last night hearing how she felt about the temple.

Shout out to ya, cousin, distant as that relationship might be!

More to the point, reading is fundamental!

*snort*

Bruce A Holt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Shout out to ya, cousin, distant as that
> relationship might be!
>
> More to the point, reading is fundamental!
>
> *snort*


Ain't no shame in shumming when it comes to my favorite kinfolks.

Amen!


Did I say that out loud?

Shunning sure beats love bombing.

I don't know about that, even pretend attention was pretty awesome compared to no attention at least for the badass.

Had a former bishop who twice refused to shake my hand after I resigned my membership. He is a bit of a pit-bull in defense of the church. He got into some strife with Ed Decker over "The God Makers" film when Decker attempted to show it in the local theater. Apparently he takes the shunning/fellowship thing quite literally.

One person came up to me and said they were sorry I was being shunned. I just told her really I hadn't noticed, I was shunning all of you

Xactly.

For the win!

I don't think I was important enough to be shunned. I was a single mother when it came to attending church matters. My kids have life long disabilities. I quietly faded out. Even the love bombing has been pathetic (thank GOD!).

A dear friend of mine was raised in an old order Mennonite family where shunning was and still is practiced. We are both of the opinion shunning is pure unmitigated evil.

Shunning is abuse.

There's a difference between deliberate, nasty shunning and normal awkwardness. The shunners are people we know, and we know them well enough to understand their motives. Many of us were encouraged to shun others, when we were Mormons. My mother used to give us kids the "silent treatment" for many days, when we displeased her. It was abusive. She didn't feed us or help us in any way, and we were just little children. Not only was this "un-loving", it was sending us the message that we were "nothing." She didn't even make eye contact with us.

Shunning is usually accompanied by gossip and slander. It extends to our children and our friends. My best friend quit the Mormon book club, when she was the nasty side of these women, when they shunned me and other former "friends" who left the cult. Often, we aren't met with just a blank stare, but snarly, snarky facial expression. The other day, one Mormon neighbor's face was so twisted-up, that I laughed out loud! She looked so evil, on Halloween, without the witch costume and makeup.

Yes, we know "shunning" from "social awkwardness," all right.

What you went through hurts my heart. The silent treatment, maliciously administered, is abusive indeed.

Birds of a a feather flock together and when you leave the church or become inactive you no longer have anything in common with former friends. Its not necessarily shunning but a case of not running in the same circles anymore. When a person stops drinking alcohol or taking drugs you do lose so called friends because you no longer do the same things. True friendship is where people genuinely like you for you and not what you have in common.Ever notice that when some people have financial problems and can no longer keep up with the rich crowd they are dropped like a hot potato? I have always been a good friend but I have found myself being dropped for someone supposedly more exciting or of perceived higher status even though my husband and I do well but we do not flaunt but are low key. I know a lady that 20 years ago was flying high and was hanging around with so called high flyers who dropped her when she lost money and job and became a divorcee. She had no time for me during those high flying years and it is interesting to see the tables turned and she is now living on very little money and even her son has dropped her because she can no longer give him money or material possessions. People are self serving and there are very few true friends out there.Society is very shallow and if peole have shunned you it is because you are no longer of any use to them.

Shunning 75%, friendliness 25% over 36 years. When I left, the shunning continued. No difference. I had been accused of being intelligent. That bothered a lot of people because I was never afraid to seek and speak the truth as I see it. With my natural curiosity that runs very deep, people didn’t like being questioned. They wanted to live securely in their assumptions without checking them. I think people were silently suffering from the abuse and misuse they got, too. Cult was highly co-dependent, full of mind games, power struggles, toxic group cliques, self-righteousness and overwhelming pressure to be perfect. People shut down for self preservation. Instead of walking in the light of happiness, some folks choose to wall that off. It was a mess. To me it was opposite the fruits of the Spirit. Hence the cult's claim they bestow the gift of the Spirit on those newly baptized was just a fantasy.

Concur with Hie. The shunning was intentional rituals of maliciousness. I suffered immensely because of it. It wasn't just the shunning but the added verbal and psychological abuse when the phonies actually included me in their activities. They were nasty consistently. The Bishops and RS president contributed to the gossip wheel. Confidences were violated. It created such a hostile, toxic environment that aided my leaving. I wonder if underneath it all, I suffered from Battered Women's Syndrome with the emotional and psychological torture? The final straw was the church's admission that JS had 40 wives. My shelf collapsed. I stand all amazed at the weight of that shelf and my Herculan efforts to hold it up for 36 years.

Shunning appears to be a way of maintaining group cohesion when the group as a whole is frightened of outsiders. You are either in or out, and if you have rejected the group, you are to be feared and avoided.

I had a neighbor who shunned me for more than a decade (she was overly friendly at first, until she switched off like a light switch at a miniscule offense. I hadn't returned her phone call in a timely manner.) As time wore on, it became increasingly evident that she suffered from serious mental illness. She was a hoarder who couldn't hold a job for more than a few years. She finally lost her home to foreclosure. The buyer bought it at auction and found a disaster awaiting him when he first entered it. Everything had to be torn out.

So now I associate shunning with mental illness. There is something profoundly wrong and weird about it.

I have to admit I was raised different. My family didn't shun. I'm proud to say that when I worked amongst a group of nonmormons (and mormons), the nonmormons said, "Colleen is different." No wonder I'm with one of those people now as my boyfriend.

So the people my daughter is staying with are mentally ill? And my daughter is? I'm laughing as I type that. I don't take it as an insult. I completely get it.

I'm just saying that's my own association based on my own personal experience. Once I realized that my former neighbor is mentally ill, her shunning made sense in a way.

I still think that shunning is fear-based. Those who shun are afraid of us. We represent a threat to them.

People are too complicated and multi-faceted to be labeled as completely mentally ill or completely sane.

Part of their personality is growth-stunted, or sick. It's the Love part of their soul that is ill. Unbelievable2 describes the sick group. These Mormons--and probably most of us--have been brainwashed into this type of thinking and behavior. After all, what fruits would you expect out of a religion that teaches that "unconditional love is anti-Christ", to quote Russel M. Nelson.

And we once thought "Mormonism is the best way to raise children."

Yes, Virginia, there are people in the world who take pleasure from hurting others!

Is someone going to tell these people that shunning is the opposite of what Jesus would do? Maybe, do we need to stand up to them, and fight back?

Is there a solution?

Is there a way we can respond to shunning, that would make it less painful for us?

Can Cl2, and I, and my best friend who's racist GA-wannabe son is treating her like dirt (after she helped put him through medical school and bought him a new house), teach the shunners common respect and kindness? As parents, we try to set a good example, but the Mormons have usurped the role of parent, and the role of teacher, and the role of an example. I feel like our loved ones have been taken from us! Because of fear, ignorance, victimization in a money-grabbing hoax cult--some of our family members, ones we used to hold dear to our heart, treat us with distain.

Can we cure this sick, toxic hatred that the Mormons are perpetually dumping on us? We resigned years ago, but I'm still on this board, because the Mormons are still poisoning me.

Can we make it stop?

First, I didn't have many mormon friends...despite being active all my live until age 44. I just didn't want to be friends with any of them (all they can talk about is church.) So I didn't mind no contact when I left.

Second, I think most don't know what to say when you leave. I make a point of acknowledging them, waving, saying "hello!" just in case it makes them uncomfortable. I want them to know that I'm happy.

Third, if anyone is going to shun someone, it's going to be me shunning them. This bunch of losers, wow, they should be happy for every friend that they have. But I don't shun. Now, I don't entertain them or want to hang out in my free time, nooooo, but I don't shun them. I already excluded them from my life outside of church, what else is there? I just say "hi" with a big grin and think about their sorry lives.

You mean they were ignoring or avoiding you because (you were changing and they weren't?) they were trying to be [normal?] gentle, kind, thoughtful, considerate?

We learn a lot about others when they treat us 'differently' for no reason, or simply because we or they no longer attend the same preaching.

Shun back if you have to.shit

In Mormonism it is something different, you must understand. It is preached from the unsaintly trumpet on high that members can't/ should not associate with formons, or former mormons (who might have the truth and not want or care to keep it to themselves).

You got out. Iow, they don't see you anymore. You are 'dead to them'. You simply don't exist or matter any more or you're not there, because you're not there, toiling with [them] the saints.

You are envied.
Being ignored.
Feels wired.

Its unnatural, unpopular, uncool, (unavoidable?), unappreciated, unhealthy and unsustainable.

Don't take it.

M@t

I was never shunned. One of my neighbors is a mormon and she

always waves and we talk at times. Its the same when ever I see

one of my mormons lady friends...

I think maybe its because I live in California instead of utah.