It's not "the world" that wants you to accept homosexuals. It's not "the world" who wants you to accept dark-skinned people. It's not "the world" who wants you to stop treating females as your own private property to cast them into whatever mold you see fit. It's God who wants these things. It's God who has spoken to the rest of humanity, and they listened. Get off your high horse. Stop thinking that you know God better than the rest of us. Shut up and listen.

Uh, I don't think so...

how come what god wants is exactly what YOU want ?

Thats how it always works so i am told.

In the beginning God created man in his own image and man, being the gracious creature he is, returned the favor. (Multiple authors have been given credit for variations on the quote)

Great post, slskipper!

(Atheists need to re-read your post, and substitute "God" for the words "conscience" or "sense of humanity" or dare I write it: "Love.")

Dallin is a polygamist, in his heart, and also according to the eternal laws of his cult.

Why? Conscience, sense of humanity and love are all distinctly different concepts from one another and not interchangeable with each other much less the concept of "God," whatever that means.

Atheists need do no such thing. Next you are going to tell us that we need to re-read the buy bull because it doesn't say what it says. It says what you say it says.

Isn't it odd that "god" took so long to figure out that all human beings have merit, no matter what color skin they have?

I mean, it's almost like humans took a long time to overcome tribalism and figure that out on their own, without any "god" telling them anything.

How about that.

gaslighting at its best (worst?)

Yes, Oaks and his speech are crap, when I read some parts of it in the Tribune I thought "when people would stop using "God" to justify the BS they think or do?"

luckylucas Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I thought "when people would stop using "God" to justify the BS
> they think or do?"


Bingo!!

What did the asshole say

The apostle, a former Utah Supreme Court justice and second in the line of succession to lead the LDS Church, conceded that “the actions of those who try to follow God’s plan of salvation can cause misunderstanding or even conflict with family members or friends who do not believe its principles.”
“Such conflict is always so,” he added. “ … But whatever the cause of conflict with those who do not understand or believe God’s plan, those who do are always commanded to choose the Lord’s way instead of the world’s way.”
Oaks lamented the “rapid and increasing public acceptance of cohabitation without marriage and same-sex marriage.” He also bemoaned the rising number of young people who are born to parents who are not legally married, pointing to the proclamation statement that children “are entitled to birth within the bonds of matrimony, and to be reared by a father and a mother who honor marital vows with complete fidelity.

http://www.sltrib.com/religion/local/2017/09/30/mormon-general-conference-resumes-for-the-first-time-monson-will-not-be-attending-any-sessions/

Wow!

Oh well, when you're rich enough, you don't have to worry about getting in trouble for drawing a line in the sand...you just move the sand.

And

"Even as we must live with the marriage laws and other traditions of a declining world, those who strive for exaltation must make personal choices in family life according to the Lord's way whenever that differs from the world's way,".

Whenever I hear things like "traditions of a declining world" I think to myself "doomsday cult".

When I hear that we live in a declining world, I think that thinking that a world that in general is fighting against segregation, misogyny, poverty, and all kind of discrimination is a declining world is just sick and stupid.

Oh, he meant "declining membership world"

luckylucas Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> He also bemoaned the rising
> number of young people who are born to parents who
> are not legally married, pointing to the
> proclamation statement that children “are
> entitled to birth within the bonds of matrimony,
> and to be reared by a father and a mother who
> honor marital vows with complete fidelity.

Does he mean like my grandmother and grandfather who had
children but were not legally married? My grandmother was a
polygamous wife (coerced at 17 into an illegal relationship by
the Mormons to an already-married 34-year-old man who didn't
want to marry a second wife in the first place. He was told by
the High Council that it was his "duty" to start "living the
principle."

Oh, and he was never around so basically my grandmother was a
single-mom who had to work to support herself and her kids--
religious version of a "booty call."

Is this what Dallin means when he touts "The Lord's Plan"?

Yes, Oaks and his speech are crap, when I read some parts of it in the Tribune I thought "when people would stop using "God" to justify the BS they think or do?"

This! And I wish people would stop blaming "Satan" for the "bad" things they do.
We're flawed people. We're going to make mistakes. That's what makes us human. It doesn't have shit to do with "Satan."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/2017 11:19AM by severedpuppetstrings.

Right when you said dallin my mind shut off.

I think the leadership needs more condescending sanctimonious pricks like him. Maybe it would help people leave.

You might be right but i think they figured that out and so diversified. Example one a sweet german named dieter uchtdorf brought into the fold.

That was a smart move. They need to round up more older pretty boys who can turn on the charm, and retire the oldest of the apostles to make room for them.

That move was genius, makes them look like they dont discriminate.

I want to add something. There is a street named dallin in this town and i flip it off every time i pass it.

D.O. said 'church standards' should never be compromised; based on what happened in my wife's divorce (I wrote him telling him of False court submissions & Hatred), I called him out as a LIAR.

Remember the very human trait of being able to conceive of a Greater Good in order to get away with shit. You do want to become a ghawd, don't you?

Yes i do sounds like fun.

I tried listening to god--for decades. It was a waste of time.

PANIC!!!! They are running scared!

This is coming from a church that once officially sanctioned polygamy and polyandry, that still tolerates polygamy in its home base of Utah, and whose founder had sordid affairs with multiple young teenage girls.

When it comes to the institution of marriage, this church lost any credibility a long time ago.

+1

Wait did dear elder Dall Dall just say this shit today at conference or was this a while ago? Just curious I'm not watching conference so I was just wondering haha. Last I heard he was goin on about " looooovvvveee and how we need to just looooovvvveee homosexuals even though it was HIM that has said such awful things about them and done such awful things to them at byu in the past there was some suicide prevention article with him in it saying how we need to just looooovvvveeee homoaexuals and how parents better accept there gay children. People better accept gays and show them so much looooovvvveee!

How sweet of him! and I'm sure he pushed a lot of gay kids to suicide so its so "nice!" That they had him give the suicide pervention article. Ugh so sickening! My mom also told me that he apperently said something like "its not the church leaders fault for anything they have said about gays in the past" oh wow! Dall ho convienient! (I just realized I spelled how wrong but I'm going to keep it that way since Dalls whole cult was founded by one big ho one big MAN HO it only seems appropriate)

It's from yesterday's talk.

Ugh really?! His suicide prevention thingy just came out not that long ago and now hes sprouting out this "of the world crap?!" Whaaaaaat the helllllll?!?!??!?!?! Ugh the dude makes me sick! Someone please get me a bag cause I'm gonna Barf!!!!!!

Even though it doesn't directly impact my heterosexual marriage, even if people think I'm a close minded bigot, even if a majority of people once considered it perverse but now believe it acceptable, even if people compare me to those who were against black and white marital unions, "marriage" between my two sisters is wrong, and a sign of a culture/society in a death spiral.

"Homosexuality, like androgyny, might be an instinctive racial response to overpopulation, crowding, and stress. Both flourish when empire reaches its apogee." - Edward Abbey

It doesn't matter to me if people used to think that homosexuality was bad and now think it's acceptable, the only thing that really matters is equality.
IMO being against equality is being against human kind.

“Every time that a man is chained in the world, we are chained with him. Freedom must be for everyone or for no one.”
Albert Camus.

... people don't think you're a closed minded bigot, they know It. Go back to the cult... its where you belong.

Wait, you have two literal, biologically related sisters who married each other? In what country? Sounds like a fabricated story to me....

I don't think she was talking about two literal sisters... I think she meant two women... "two sisters" is cult-speak for two women. She is just a brainwashed bigot visiting the board to dip her toe in the real world, spew some hate, so she can then go running back to the fold of the cult.

Jr. High school level rebuttal, i.e., nobody is able to directly address my specific argument.

p.s. - I'm atheist, I also don't follow the buy into many of the beliefs of pop culture.

You didn't make an argument.

You stated a personal value followed by an unsubstantiated claim, followed by a quote of someone else's unsubstantiated opinion.

What evidence do you have that gay marraige is "sign of a culture/society in a death spiral"?

Go ahead, cite a legitimate study, if you can find one, that supports your claim. Then someone may have a rebuttal to give.

this article:

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2008/apr/30/inheritancetax.tax

talks about the elderly sisters who enquired after a civil partnership (the pre-cursor to gay marriage here in the UK) to ensure whichever sister survived longest was not hit with a massive tax bill when the first sister eventually died.

The sisters had spent their entire lives together in the same home they co-owned, yet whichever died first would leave an inheritance tax obligation for the other, something civil unions addressed for same sex couples: inheritance and other legal/money matters.

The first sister to die would not be able to pass on her estate to the person she had shared all financial matters with her entire life. The whole argument for civil partnerships at the time was about same sex couples having the same financial security as hetero couples - partners' welfare rights and pensions, etc. The outcome was that same sex civil partnerships were only for homosexuals and not for heterosexual couples, related by blood or not: something new and unique had been created by government for the small minority population; homosexuals.

Some people at the time wondered where it would all end and so came the publicity surrounding the sisters' inheritance tax case. Their position was understandable, they believed they should have the same rights as other 'same-sex' couples.

"That's some excellent sleuthing, Lord Peter!"
- - Melvin Bunter

+1

-Nothing about TBM Spouses who divorce Only because of a doubting partner, one who calls attention to church lies-

It used to be that marriage was "sacred", whatever that meant;

It used to be that tscc would stand behind their statements, claims...

But NOT ANYMORE.

Is this talk a move by Oaks telling us even though Monson will be replaced soon, mormons will NOT be changing their policy on gays?

Expect more suicides. Those with gay mormon friends, be there for them.

Society, culture and language evolve. This can be seen in consecutive generations, and this old fart is about three or four generations behind. No wonder he's troubled by "the world." He's been left behind! Held back like a dumb kid in school.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/2017 08:27PM by donbagley.

Well, that is the only quote from Edward Abbey on homosexuality. A better quote from him would be. The one thing that is truly ugly is the climate of hate and intimidation created by a noisy few which makes the decent majority reluctant to air in public their views on anything controversial. Where all there pretend to be thing alike, its likely that no on is thinking at all.

Oaks is an asshole. That is nothing new. This is the guy that was president of BYU when they were shocking people's genitals.

He obviously cannot listen to reason or science so we have to assume he will carry his bigotry and ignorance to the grave.

I have learned that arguments laced with vulgarity and venom are full of holes and lies. Truths can be told simply and softly but lies spread more easily when laced with anger and hate.

Are you talking about Oaks?