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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 07:47AM

Is supposedly some kind of movement blending scientific advancement with Mormon fundamentals.

Came across this online, to summarize what it means: "Mormon teachings about humans becoming gods connect with transhumanist ideas about using technology to enhance the human condition. Mormon Transhumanism embraces science and religion to work toward these corresponding aims....

What is Transhumanism?

Transhumanism is a growing intellectual movement based on the idea that we should use science and technology in ethical ways to improve ourselves and our world. The term transhumanism is connected to humanism, a teaching that holds the values of human life and agency as central. Transhumanism makes the further claim that humanity should continue to overcome limitations and evolve until humans are so advanced as to warrant a different category: posthumans — that would differ from us in the same way that we differ from prehumans.

What is Mormon Transhumanism?

Mormon Transhumanism takes the Mormon idea that humans should become gods, and the Transhumanist idea that we should use science and technology in ethical ways to improve our condition until we attain posthumanity, and suggests that these are related, if not identical tasks. That is, we should ethically use our resources including religion, science, and technology to improve ourselves and our world until we become Gods ourselves."

Has anyone else heard of this here? Is it a relatively new movement, or been around for some time?

https://transfigurism.org/primers/1

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 09:36AM

If they embraced science, nothing "mormon" would be involved...
So they appear to be quite confused.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 12:13PM

I've known some very fine Mormon scientists who had high callings at church.

Their beliefs didn't interfere with their professional lives. Their educational backgrounds enhanced their theology in fact, perhaps to their detriment. But they are genuine to them ie, beliefs.

They were/are top notch people in fact, at the top in their careers.

There was a book one of them gave me when I was a teenager (he was my bishop at the time,) called "The Faith of a Scientist." I doubt it's still in print but was written by a Mormon scientist. He kept copies for the teens that shuffled in and out of his office to give to us to read.

I loved that guy because of how much he loved his students, the youth in that ward. He was an exceptional man. And IMO an exceptional scientist.

I wonder what he'd have to say about Mormon Transhumanism were he around today? Hmm...

He was dismissive of fads and trends, but maybe not this one.

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Posted by: arosophos ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 08:38PM

Appeals to ridicule demonstrate clear scientific superiority. ;)

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 12:12PM

I think it's an escape hatch for thinking Mormons. There's the same pattern of ideal externalizations. The grass is greener on the other side. Trust me, the grass is greenest where you shit.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 12:16PM

Well you know Babylon, the one thing that Mormonism is losing rapidly is its brain power. If there ever was an "intelligentsia" inside the church, is rapidly diminishing with each passing day.

Some movement like this one I can see the potential to draw intellectuals back into that cultish fold, and retain them because it gives them something to think about besides the dogma that can no longer be defended or rationalized.

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 01:03PM

It's long been speculated here that TSCC would adapt, because that's what it always does. It "fixes" itself in spite of the leadership because brainwashed followers will latch onto anything that keeps their beliefs afloat. Teach a five year old to "follow the prophet" and the rest takes care of itself. Talk about brand loyalty.

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Posted by: arosophos ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 08:42PM

Have you asked them how it functions for them? Consider how your characterization of Mormon Transhumanism illustrates stereotypical values of former Mormons.

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Posted by: BYU Boner ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 09:45PM

Captain Moroni underpants' Mormon uber-mensch nearest to Kolob.

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Posted by: donbagley ( )
Date: May 18, 2017 09:52PM

I'll stick with humanism. Let the Mormons be something else.

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Posted by: arosophos ( )
Date: May 20, 2017 01:49PM

In Mormonism, God is a posthuman and humanity should become God. Mormonism is and always has been a religious humanism, or more particularly a religious transhumanism.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: May 20, 2017 04:27PM

It certainly parts ways with mainstream Christianity in its God teachings, "As man is God once was. As God is man may one day become."

That's downright blasphemous to any of the mainstream monotheistic religions of the world. Why Mormons are not only ascribed a cult, but a heretical one at that.

Albeit Mormonism and humanist secularism are not much different in that they see themselves as superior in putting themselves above God rather than subject to.

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Posted by: arosophos ( )
Date: May 20, 2017 04:49PM

I don't know any Mormons that see themselves as superior to God. That's a mischaracterization. The aspiration to become God does not logically entail the aspiration to be superior to God.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: May 20, 2017 04:59PM

God wouldn't be God if we were co-equal to him in power or knowledge.

In the monotheistic religions there is only one God, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

There are no other gods before him, and he is the only one we are commanded to worship.

He is omnipotent and omnipresent. For Mormons to aspire to become as God now is, is considered blasphemy and idolatry (self-worship) by theologians.

To become as god is in post-humanism isn't anything to do with Christian teachings, Judaic, or Islam. By any of those standards including biblical, it would be considered absolute heresy.

That being said, if the "glory of God is intelligence" as we were taught LDS, there is nothing wrong or sinful in learning for its own sake if it glorifies the Creator and betters ourselves and the world we inhabit. That's wholly different than believing in becoming gods or goddesses one day.

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Posted by: azsteve ( )
Date: May 20, 2017 01:32PM

I picture this transhuman person to be someone who has added computer chips to enhance his brain power, or to add a robotic arm if he loses the arm he was born with. Ultimately, you end up with something that looks more like a star trek borg, than the mormon version of an exalted being. The two seem quite a bit different.

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Posted by: arosophos ( )
Date: May 20, 2017 01:47PM

There's no reason human enhancement must entail poor esthetics.

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Posted by: Hwint ( )
Date: May 21, 2017 12:05PM

>supposedly some kind of movement blending scientific advancement with Mormon fundamentals

one person with a blog is not a movement.

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: May 21, 2017 12:27PM

It's not "one person with a blog."

It has regional area meetups in Utah, the Bay Area, and Seattle.

"The Utah meetup group of the Mormon Transhumanist Association gets together about once a month to talk about Mormonism, Transhumanism, technology, spirituality, science, religion, and just about anything else you can imagine.

Recently, we have incorporated our Primers to give participants useful and interesting content to discuss. Most of us are Mormons or have a Mormon background or interests, and similarly most of us identify to some extent or another as Transhumanists, but you don't have to be a Mormon or a Transhumanist to participate.

As the MTA continue to grow in size so will our local meet-up groups. We currently have three meetup groups or chapters in the US. Our largest is our Utah Valley Chapter, followed by our Bay Area Chapter, and finally our Seattle Chapter. Our local chapters not only facilitate discussion groups, but get involved in local community service projects too."

https://transfigurism.org/meetup

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: May 21, 2017 01:21PM

That's some interesting psychology. They deal with the ridiculousness of their religion by latching onto something equally ridiculous. Anything that crosses the "just plausible enough" threshold will do.

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Posted by: Babyloncansuckit ( )
Date: May 21, 2017 01:38PM

Maybe ridiculous is the wrong word. Backward. Looking the wrong way. Divinity isn't out there or up there. It's in here. Sure, I can understand that having all divine affects meaning. If the streets are paved with gold, gold is worth as much as dirt. If you're literally swimming in divinity, where does meaning come from? The meaning isn't in the having, it's in the doing. Joseph wanted to have without doing, and created a fool's paradise to get there. So in that respect, he was a great teacher. But only great if you learn the right lesson. Becoming an even greater fool isn't the intended lesson.

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Posted by: arosophos ( )
Date: May 21, 2017 04:19PM

Maybe your God is exclusively "in here". Maybe others see God both "in here" and "out there", and think nothing less than the reconciliation and beautification of both to be worthy of practical working faith. Let me rephrase that. I know others see things that way because I'm among them. It's not enough to find God only "out there". And for similar reasons it's also not enough to find God only "in here". Maybe the ridiculousness and backwardness you see reflects you as much as that which you're looking at?

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Posted by: arosophos ( )
Date: May 21, 2017 04:22PM

I wish the New Yorker would write about me and my blog. ;)

http://www.newyorker.com/tech/elements/mormon-transhumanism-and-the-immortality-upgrade

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Posted by: Amyjo ( )
Date: May 21, 2017 04:59PM

That's a very interesting article and fills in some of the blanks the one shared prior left out.

Thank you for sharing it.

It is intriguing how as unintellectual Mormonism is in its dogma, that this has taken root among some of the more educated members. It may be one draw to retain some members who would otherwise leave out of boredom, and lack of intelligent discourse among church members.

You cannot question the dogma, or Joseph Smith's polygamous marriages, or Brigham's, or the deception the early church was founded on. Intellectuals have been silenced for decades in the church. I'm not sure this movement is going to lessen that until the church leadership revamps its indoctrination or it has a watershed moment such as what occurred in October 2015.

There's no room for intellectuals in the church unless they zip their lips and remain silent without questioning.

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