Recovery Board  : RfM
Recovery from Mormonism (RfM) discussion forum. 
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In
Posted by: Jim Whitefield ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 06:31AM

Several people have asked if I have notes relating to the latter part of my presentation at conference, regarding Joseph Smith and the underlying evidence of his claims and his journey from monotheism to polytheism, showing that in 1820 he wasn't even religious, let alone having visions. I have now posted an article I wrote earlier in the year from which that part of the presentation was drawn. It is rather long to post here so you will find it on my website at www.themormondelusion.com on the side bar under the simple title of 'The First Vision'.

For anyone who was at conference, it was an absolute pleasure to be there and it was an honour to be asked to speak.

The promised Volume 4 of "The Mormon Delusion: The Mormon Missionary Lessons - A Conspiracy to Deceive" should be published in January 2011 and meanwhile there is a 25% discount for the month of October on all my books but only via my publisher, Lulu. I don't control Amazon et al. A direct link to my book store is on my web site. My grateful thanks to all those who have read my work and sent such kind messages.

Best wishes to everyone.

Jim Whitefield

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Master C ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 08:12AM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Connecticut ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 09:17AM

have meet you at the exmo conference.I wish you the best in all that you do and again it was my pleasure in meeting and talking with you in person...

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: NormaRae ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 09:47AM

Thanks for the info, Jim. I want to commit some of those points to memory. They are such great talking points. The presentation was awesome and you are fun to listen to. Also enjoyed talking to you at lunch on Sunday. I will definately be purchasing the books.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: cludgie ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 10:32AM

I was talking to you and wanted to say good-bye when I spied someone who looked like she was leaving, and I had to say good-bye to her. When I came back I couldn't find you. But I thought your presentation was quite riveting, and I wish that all Mormons would at least spend a few minutes listening to you.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/24/2010 02:02PM by cludgie.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: honestone ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 11:15AM

Volume Four sounds great.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: msmom ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 09:23PM

and the material itself of course!

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: mav ( )
Date: October 25, 2010 01:28PM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Susan I/S ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 02:50PM


Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Cyn ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 04:12PM

Before I bought your books, I was actively attending church and was a temple worker (I'm serious!). But things in the temple started to feel "not right" to me. This concerned me because I had loved the temple for 20 years...but suddenly, I felt nothing except discomfort when there. I saw your books and bought them, feeling guilty. Read them all with great dismay, actually.

But now, I believe that the Lord was leading me very slowly OUT. I am usually not a precipitous person, but within three months, I broke the psychological tether of fear and guilt that was keeping me in my forebears' church (I'm a 5th generation mormon with ancestors presiding at the Nauvoo temple and saving those records).

To leave a tribe is hard. But I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

Thank you for your hard work and research.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: msmom ( )
Date: October 24, 2010 09:24PM

and the presentation itself!

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: shelly ( )
Date: October 25, 2010 12:37AM

Jim you had me at hello. within the first minute of your presentation, I knew it was going to be good and I was so very excited for all of us who would be listening to you speak, and for you who had come all that way to deliver such a riveting presentation.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: forestpal ( )
Date: October 25, 2010 01:00AM

Thank you so much! I thought about it for days and days. I thought, "No wonder I was always so confused in Mormonism!"

Your presentation made me realize that after a lifetime in Mormonism, I still don't really know who God and Christ are, exactly who we pray to, exactly who is the "God of this world," and if one or both have human-like bodies. I'm as confused as Joseph Smith was! How can I call myself a Christian, if I don't even know Christ?

The facts you presented are not upsetting at all; rather they have opened doors onto more areas of study for me. I might end up an agnostic or atheist--it is too early to know. I feel illuminated!

I can't wait to read more!

I hope you will join the conference again next year! Thanks for the info on your writings.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: libby ( )
Date: October 25, 2010 01:03AM

Jim,
On your website it says "I served a mission early and was married in the temple a week after my eighteenth birthday"

I was under the impression that missionaries had to be 19. At what age did you serve your mission?

I loved your conference talk. It was fantastic! I did not know you had written books, so I am going to check them out!
Thanks!

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Jim Whitefield ( )
Date: October 25, 2010 06:26AM

In the sixties, they were building lots of new chapels around the world and for a period were calling "Church Building Missionaries" whose task it was to labour on the Church building sites for two years each day and also two evenings each week along with members who would work on the sites too. On the other evenings we split with the proselyting missionaries to teach. As we were mainly involved with construction, we only had to learn the first three lessons (parrot fashion in those days - Brother Brown) but still had an hour of morning study as a group on site. Such missionaries were called from age sixteen. I was the youngest ever called, two months before my sixteenth birthday. My then future wife also served a Building Mission in the Church offices as in a secretarial role. She was a year older than me. I finished my mission at Christmas 1963 and married my sweetheart in February, three days before I was eighteen. Our Mission President was Marion (Duff) Hanks and as we had both served missions, he sent us to the Temple to be sealed a year early. In those days you had to be nineteen to be ordained an Elder but he ordained me early. I do hope that explains things and I am sorry it isn't clearer on my web site.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Jim Whitefield ( )
Date: October 25, 2010 06:30AM

Oh - in case the timing isn't clear, in England you can't be 'married' in the Temple as it is not a public place of worship so by law you have to marry in the Chapel first and go to the Temple later to be sealed. Members in England love this as of course it means all the family can attend. We married Sat 15 Feb - I was 18 the following Tuesday (18th) and we were sealed the following Sat 22nd. Hope that's all clear now.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: Comfortably Numb ( )
Date: October 25, 2010 11:26AM

I wasn't at the conference because I live in Chicago but I loved listening to your presentation a few days later. My biggest regret is that I can't meet you in person to express my thanks for what you are doing. You summarized very nicely what I studied in 2007 when I left the church. I was sitting with my Bishop and some of his men trying to get them to listen to this timeline of events and evidence and not a single one of them baught that there was no evidence of Joe's claims supporting the First Vision and the rest until much later on. Wish I had your timeline then - it would have made it easier to follow, but I doubt it would have opened their minds because they were no listening to my reasons for leaving the church because they were convinced that was all a smoke screen for something else like pride, sin, etc.

Options: ReplyQuote
Posted by: SpongeBob SquareGarments ( )
Date: October 25, 2010 03:50PM

I'm really bumming I couldn't make it this year. I really wanted to meet you Jim but couldn't get there this time.

Options: ReplyQuote
Go to Topic: PreviousNext
Go to: Forum ListMessage ListNew TopicSearchLog In


Screen Name: 
Your Email (optional): 
Subject: 
Spam prevention:
Please, enter the code that you see below in the input field. This is for blocking bots that try to post this form automatically.
 ********         **        **  ********   ********  
 **     **        **        **  **     **  **     ** 
 **     **        **        **  **     **  **     ** 
 **     **        **        **  ********   **     ** 
 **     **  **    **  **    **  **         **     ** 
 **     **  **    **  **    **  **         **     ** 
 ********    ******    ******   **         ********