from the Online Etymology Dictionary:

atheist - 1570s, from Fr. athéiste (16c.), from Gk. atheos "to deny the gods, godless," from a- "without" + theos "a god" (see Thea). A slightly earlier form is represented by atheonism (1530s) which is perhaps from It. atheo "atheist."

The existence of a world without God seems to me less absurd than the presence of a God, existing in all his perfection, creating an imperfect man in order to make him run the risk of Hell. [Armand Salacrou, "Certitudes et incertitudes," 1943]
Related: Atheistic (1630s).


http://richarddawkins.net/articles/1243-atheism-is-the-absence-of-belief

Atheism is the absence of belief

Reposted from: http://www.hattiesburgamerican.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070605/OPINION01/706050342

OFTEN WHEN I hear atheism mentioned it's followed by the bewildered statement, "How can you be sure God doesn't exist?" I would like to attempt to clear up a few common misconceptions about atheism. Namely that atheism requires faith, that outspoken atheists are "fundamentalists," and that agnostics are weak or non-committal while self-professed atheists are arrogant.

Theism is an active belief in a god(s), so the lack of this belief is "a-theism." It requires no active belief, neither affirmative nor negative. It is simply the absence of a belief. In the same way Christians lack a belief in Zeus or Hindus lack a belief in Jehovah, the atheist simply lacks a god-belief in general. It is no active affirmation that a god(s) does not exist.

To quote Dr. Richard Dawkins, "We are all atheists about most of the gods that societies have ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further." I would add that we reject belief in your god(s), whichever it happens to be, for essentially the same reasons you reject all those others: because the onus is on the believer to provide proof for their assertion.

Atheism, being the complete lack of any document or dogma, can never be fundamental. It has no core belief to be fundamental to.

What an atheist can be however, is passionate. Passionate about the horrible wastefulness of religion, the retarding of scientific inquiry fundamentalism inevitably demands and the dangerous tribalism it always foments.

When one stands up and says that faith is a dangerous thing that mankind would be better off without, he may be speaking passionately and you may find his words offensive, but this doesn't place him in the same category as the radical Muslim and Christian fundamentalists who actively try to force their beliefs on society.

Atheists and religious fundamentalists are not simply opposite ends of the same spectrum with agnostics falling somewhere in the middle. Agnostic/gnostic deals with a different question altogether. It asks, "Can the existence of a god(s) ever be truly known?" While fundamentalists are by definition gnostic on this question, there are many theists who are agnostic yet still believers. The atheist is not making a definitive declaration about the existence of god(s) at all, but merely stating he or she lacks a belief in one, so most would be agnostic-atheists.

Does the fact that the atheist admits we can never prove god(s) doesn't exist weaken our position? Hardly. I can't be certain that a meteor isn't going to fall from the sky and kill me when I walk out of my house.

But without some proof that there is a significant chance this will happen, I don't allow this lack of proof to affect my daily life. I may be technically agnostic, but practically atheist about getting brained by a meteor.

Atheism is not only a viable alternative to faith, it is, I believe, the most probable, most promising, and most positive view of life.

Butch Bailey is a forester who lives in Hattiesburg.

(Let's see if the link to older posts thing changed with the new board...)

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,169114,169114#msg-169114

I picked them up today, but my librarian wasn't there. I've never actually read about atheism; I just kind of got there over a long period of time. I kept trying to fight it, and I don't remember a time in my childhood when I was an atheist: I was so immersed in religion. Fucking imbued with it. Meh.

What I do enjoy is _The Atheism Tapes_. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Atheism_Tapes They are so much more interesting than _Atheism: A Rough History of Disbelief_. Maybe the horrific music made me cringe. Meh. Anyway, _The Atheism Tapes_ stream on Netflix if anyone is interested.

Again, thanks for this post.

I'm about to go to bed with Brian Greene. Nerdgasm!

Have a good night, you guys.

and being turned over to missionaries after my mother’s death. Of course I was told she wanted us to be baptized, but we were really bartered for promised assistance with her funeral expenses.

I do not recall ever having an attachment to gawd or jeezus or religion before that. I did not fear hell or judgment. If left to myself I think I would have stayed away from religion, and not even wondered about imaginary things. The combination of my mother dying, and throwing us to the missionaries was pivotal. We all know TSCC knows people, especially children, are vulnerable, and ready to be taken advantage of, in the midst of tragedy.

I always liked science, loved watching Cosmos, NOVA, and my dad always told me to think, and reason things out. He never told me what to believe or the proper way to do things i.e. how to pray, behave, believe, dress, what music to listen to, etc., in the context of dogma or xstianity. Once or twice my mom said tea was not good for me, while she was drinking it, and that was the extent of it. She never said anything about doctrine. I watched my parents question, reassess, and change their own stance on things as they followed what was reasonable to them. The girls I grew up around, like me, were encouraged to explore, and learn. No one lectured me on the virtues of home ec., and sewing, which, along with shop, was required for both boys, and girls at my jr. high. My brothers sewed better than me, although my project WAS more difficult.

Thank you for the link. I watched most of my atheist lectures on fora.tv, and some on ted. I have not watched any for a while.

I have been wanting to read The God Delusion for months.

I think you were nice to the librarian. I probably would have asked, point blank, why on earth she would suggest I read about jeezus when I ordered books on atheism, because they are two different things entirely.

Atheists can be viewed, and treated like aliens, especially in Utah. People here often treat atheists badly, unless of course they do not know you are one. I have had many conversations with the jeezus freaks, and not just ld$ ones. TSCC creates an atmosphere of fundamentalism where all extremists feel they have license to ”let their light shine”. Normally, I do not mind the misunderstandings much or even bashing, because I can handle the criticism, and I understand where they are coming from, but when professionals promote jeezus in their workplace, that is where I have a problem.

I want to, but he seems like a bit of a dick.

My parents always said I was free to make up my own mind about religion. They also taught me to rely on critical thinking, logic, and reason. When I did finally investigate religion as a young adult, I applied the tools given by my parents. What I discovered was that I really wanted to believe that religion was true so I could fit in with everyone around me. I discovered that even thought I very much wanted religion to be true, it was impossible to go from not believing to believing using critical thinking, logic and reason.

I've never heard it put that way. Thanks!

Society/parents teach religion. If all books suddenly vanished and everybody suffered sudden amnesia, religion and gods would no longer exist.

MikeyA Wrote:
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> Society/parents teach religion. If all books
> suddenly vanished and everybody suffered sudden
> amnesia, religion and gods would no longer exist.

Huh, religion existed long before books.

That does not mean there is a gawd.

atheist&happy:-) Wrote:
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> That does not mean there is a gawd.

I know it doesn't prove there is a god but the fact that about 99.9% of the people who have lived have believed in something shows that atheism is not our natural state. If it were we would all be atheists and the fact is that most people are not and have never been as far back as history goes. There is evidence that even prehumans had religion.It is really a simple concept. Ever read "The God Gene"?

I stated that I had no attachment to gawd or jeezus, and definitely no attachment to the thousands I never heard of.

Atheism is our natural state, because you would not know about jeezus unless someone told you about him. Our ancestors were left more to their imaginations, because they lacked the science to explain the things they did not understand.

Prehumans having religion proves nothing. They kept foolish traditions too.

There are atheistic societies where religion is not being reborn. It is dying. The people know what makes the sun rise, and set now, and do not need elaborate, fanciful explanations. They know they die, and as much as it pains them, are not willing to make up an afterlife or pretend their loved ones still exist. They know life without the delusion is healthier, and more precious.

I didn't say there wasnt religion before books.

If all religious texts suddenly vanished and everyone suddenly forgot everything there would be no more religion or gods as we know it.

People may make up other supernatural entities, events or rituals but it would be completely different to what we have today, and I doubt would have such control or saturation in moden society.

MikeyA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I didn't say there wasnt religion before books.
>
> If all religious texts suddenly vanished and
> everyone suddenly forgot everything there would be
> no more religion or gods as we know it.
>
> People may make up other supernatural entities,
> events or rituals but it would be completely
> different to what we have today, and I doubt would
> have such control or saturation in moden society.

If we all developed religious amnesia, religion would likely develop again. It would be different, but I doubt it would go away.Nobody knows for sure but we can only judge from the past and religion has always been with us.

I don't understand you saying babies are not born atheist. There is zero belief until society and family/friends puts those religious beliefs onto those kids. Without that there is no inborn religious belief in kids. Being naturally inclined towards fantasy and imagination as children does not have anything to do with religion. Primitive man had a natural inclination towards faith and belief in fantasy because he did not understand his natural world but that is changing and will continue to change as man evolves.

Children are not brought into the world with any kind of natural belief in a sky daddy type. Not at all. Am I missing something?

I'm not sure I agree with the "born atheist" hypothesis. (And I am an atheist). I think we are hard wired to need answers, and if we expand the assumption that we are taught religion by society, it is also true that we are taught science,etc. by society. If neither of those existed, we'd have to "make up" our own answers, which would easily lead to a religion of sorts as we try to sort out the things we don't understand and comfort us with "supernatural" explanations.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2011 11:17AM by Frontal Lobotomy.

...the thought process I went through, when I realized, "Oh, these aren't just stories, like Jack and the Beanstalk or Superman. This is supposed to be REAL. Uh, okay, if they say so. I mean, they know more than me."

I don't remember having innate religious yearnings independent of my indoctrination. I wanted my parents to love me, and they loved me when I went along with the indoctrination.

By the time I was a teen I thought I really believed it. I mean, how could it possibly not be true?

They almost had me for life, but there was a war going on between my devout LDS conscious and my atheist subconscious. Fortunately, my attempts to make the Mormon magic work for me, to find True Happiness® and peace of mind, to be worthy enough, to not hate myself, were making me mentally ill to the point I had to step away from the church. Once free of the constant indoctrination, my atheist self was able to be heard and I realized I didn't believe any of it, including the God thing -- ANY god thing.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2011 10:56AM by Stray Mutt.

I mean, I figured out the Santa Lie when I was about five, but I also thought if it was written, it was true. Then I realized that *that* assumption was false. The doubting while practicing was a serious mind fuck, because no one would answer my questions. Instead I was told that I lacked faith or all the other requisite nonsense for salvation, so I just kept that stuff to myself. Cog-dis in a major way.

I don't agree with the assertion we are born atheists. What we are born with is absence of *content* about God. However, for the most part we are born with a disposition to believe. This disposition is very useful because it allows us to be socialized fairly quickly, which is essential for survival. The fact that some atheists point out that we are disposed to believe and should resist it because it is a processing error, itself argues we are not born atheists.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2011 11:27AM by robertb.

If we're predisposed to trust, we're predisposed to believe that what people tell us is true.

We're also curious, and our minds naturally fill in gaps to satisfy that need; the gaps might be filled with fantasy if that's all that's available. I think it's like when you watch a movie, and your brain fills in the tiny gaps between frames so that you aren't aware that you're watching a series of still shots. It's registered on an unconscious level.

It was about pressure to do things I didn't want to do. Whether I believed in it or not was irrelevant, and I had better be silent about any doubts. That being said, I felt by the age of seven that God was sort of like Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny, but there were so many adults who believed in God that I felt I should give it a chance. By the time I was mission age, I was almost sure it was a lie, but there was social pressure to serve a mission and do all the other things that Mormons do. So, I coasted along hoping I would find an easy way out someday. I never did.

My son figured out that there is no God when he was five without any encouragement from me, however I never taught him anything religious and he has never been to a church. There is a lot of social pressure at school to believe in God though. I've told him that he can believe whatever he wants.

I don't know what the "default" is for religious belief, but based on the huge amount of social pressure to believe in something, I would have to say that a great many people would never believe in God or anything else supernatural if it was not beaten into them. Perhaps there is a segment of humanity who are genetically predisposed to belief, but my son and I aren't among them.

It's like I killed the whole thread. Sorry, guys!

Nothing like trying to game the system...

yeah and I love every minute of it :) Even though people think I will eat their children... which I honestly won't :)

And yes I was indoctrinated temporarily ;)