California voted, not once, but TWICE against gay marriage.

California is the ONLY state in the country where the right to same sex marriage was confirmed by the state courts, and same sex couples were actively getting married then the votes of CA voted to take that right away.

Now THIS:

"Calif. AG may have no choice but to allow ‘shoot the gays’ proposal to go forward"


http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2015/03/calif-ag-may-have-no-choice-but-to-allow-shoot-the-gays-proposal-to-go-forward/

It's at the signature gathering stage at this point, but I doubt the Mormon church is going to push people to sign this or support it since they learned from the Prop H8 fiasco. I don't think it would get enough signatures to even make the ballot at this point. Things have changed to the point where a third attempt to ban gay marriage might fail to pass as Californians are getting used to the idea of gay marriage.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 08:41PM by adoylelb.

Does not change the point I am making.

People post here as if CA is some sort of gay ideal, it is not.

California votes still have the distinction of being the only state in the union to vote away an existing, practiced right, from gays.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 08:44PM by MJ.

People in California are trying to get the fanatic who started this disbarred as he's an attorney.

People in California trysted to stop prop 8, but didn't. This guy is using the same process as prop 8.

It seems your argument now is that some people of California are threatening his lively hood for exercising his right to participate in the political process. They are not boycotting (a personal choice) the person, they are threatening to disbar the person (punitive action by a governing body). Your defense of California is not helping California.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 08:53PM by MJ.

http://oag.ca.gov/system/files/initiatives/pdfs/15-0008%20%28Sodomy%29_0.pdf

“The People of California wisely command, in the fear of God, that any person who willingly touches another person of the same gender for purposes of sexual gratification be put to death by bullets to the head or by any other convenient method.”

Oh, yeah! this was my parenting style! It's really effective! As long as I kept my kids unarmed, it worked fine...

It's obviously a hail mary act by a deranged fanatic. He's going to reap what he sowed, though. This insane act will indeed get him disbarred. The guy has obviously gone off on a tangent from which he can never recover, never regain any sort of serious reputation again. Maybe the legal restrictions will require it to actually be considered as a ballot initiative? All it really will accomplish is to illustrate how crazy it is to oppose human rights for everyone. We should probably be glad this nut came to the surface.

That's what I think this is, just a Hail Mary from some fanatic who will most likely be disbarred for this. Only the Westboro Baptist Cult and some fundamentalists like this fanatic would be in favor of killing gay people.

Not all that long ago, lots of people were in favor of putting gays in prison, at the least.

None the less, I am sure that had this come from Utah, this thread would be full of bash all of Utah for the actions of this one person.

Um, yeah, I'm sure this proposal will get a lot of traction, because, well, you know, California sucks.

Stay tuned, we're lockin' & loadin' already, because, well, we ARE California and we ain't too bright...

Just remember, CA passed prop 8, probably the worst action against gay rights done by ANY state.

I would not say they are not so bright, but it appears Californians are willing to do some pretty bigoted stuff.

I would love to see the reaction if this was coming from Utah. I am sure the thread would already be full from people bashing Utah as a whole because of the actions of this one person. Even though California has done some stuff worse than Utah in regards to gay rights.

Homosexuality exists.

Get over it.

Tell it to the religious bigots, and this guy is a religious bigot, that are pimping this sort of crap in the name of God.

California is a big, giant pot of people of many, many different backgrounds, ethnicities, etc., from us...you can never know what's gonna happen...

Utah, on the other hand has a majority group of homogeneous robots that think and act in lockstep.

Two completely different scenarios....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 09:56PM by csuprovograd.

So the people of CA are diverse? They STILL passed the single worst act against gay rights.

Even the non-diverse Utah has done better than that.

The diversity defense goes away if all the diverse groups are united in bigotry. IT seems they are united in their common enemy, GAYS!

California should be judged by its actions, not on an irrelevant claim of diversity. Diversity does not automatically make CA non-bigoted.

If CA passes more and worse anti-gay bills than Utah, it should be viewed as passing more and worse anti-gay bills, regardless of claims of diversity. The state, diverse as it may be, voted to pass prop 8, diversity does not excuse that. Nor did diversity prevent it.

Diversity is irrelevant when considering the bigoted actions of the state as a whole.

Or to put it more simply:

A diverse stated that does evil stuff is not better than a non-diverse state that does good stuff. Again diversity, in and of itself, is irrelevant in judging the actions of the group.



Edited 6 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 10:21PM by MJ.

I would like to believe that a significant number of the 7,001,084 Californians who voted in 2008 would NOT vote for Prop 8 if it were on the ballot this year. In other words, they may have learned better.

That figure is of the 13,402,566 who voted.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_8_%282008%29

CA's population in 2008 was estimated to be in the neighborhood of 36,600,000
https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&rlz=1CAACAC_enUS622US622&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=california%20population%20in%202008

19% of the population (which is not the what the figure would be of registered voters) made that decision for CA.

For the May, 2008 election, CA's Secretary of State said there were 23,033,970 voters, of which 16,123,787 actually registered. Obviously, 7,001,084 votes to enact Prop 8 was NOT even close to 50% of the total number of registered voters. But it was passed with a 52% of the vote.

https://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/ror/ror-pages/15day-stwddirprim-08/hist-reg-stats.pdf

Now it's my recollection that in a postmortem of how the hell it passed, it was determined that it was definitely right wing bigotry that pushed it across the finish line. Los mormones were complicit, as were a very active Black fundamentalist block of anti-gay voters.

I want to believe that significant numbers of these two groups, the mormons and the Black fundamentalists, have changed their minds. One deranged bigot isn't going to influence me in this regard.

California DID pass prop 8. That is ALL that matters. Your speculation is nothing but speculation. I know lots of people that claimed Californians would not pass prop 8, myself among them. I, and they, were wrong. You could be as well.

Facts, not speculation, are what is important here.

My, how people try to excuse the hate and bigotry that has come from California.

When is everyone going to use the excuse that Californians were bought off by the Pro-prop 8 faction out spending the opposition? You know, how Californians sold out? The idea that prop 8 won because there was more money spent on the pro-8 side usually comes up about now. Of course to use that excuse, one needs to admit that California voters can be bought.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 10:41PM by MJ.

One item that is coming across as factual is that you are grinding and grinding and grinding your axe. Once you get the desired edge, what do you want to do with that hefty bastard?

Or are you working on a plan of some kind? Or is it enough that you can repeatedly vilify the entire state based on one man's current action?

Repeatedly telling us that California dissed the Gays not once, but twice, and repeating it every chance you get... That's useful?

We're members of the same board you are. Wouldn't it make more sense, and be more useful, to vent your ... whatever it is... on a board with people who WOULD vote to keep gays from marrying? Why are you pounding the lectern in front of this congregation?

You now are trying to make this personal and about ME.

SHAME ON YOU.

The facts I have presented stand regardless of any ax grinding from me. Those facts stand regardless of any behavior on my point. You should be ashamed to stoop to such low brow bull-shit.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 10:44PM by MJ.

Save the bullshit. Why are you taxing this board with a rant that ends up being about one crazy Californian?

You don't think that there are people of this stripe in every state and country of this world?

SHAME ON YOU!

(see how silly you're being?)

Your reply is ignored because it does not address the actual issue being discussed.

Sad that all you can resort to is petty deflection.

I am doing nothing that has not been done to Utah, did you complain about that?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 10:48PM by MJ.

Sounds like he is a bit jealous of the self proclaimed Islamic State.

can we start a ballot iniative to have Matthew G. McLaughlin shot on sight since god does not like him ?

He actually wants people who only TOUCH other people for sexual gratification shot in the head?

This man would appear to have a mental health issue of some kind.

Many want gays put to death simply for being gay. They bible says to do it, at least according to them.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 10:58PM by MJ.

I stated that California is populated with a wide diversity of people. I DID NOT state that diversity was equivalent to a viewpoint that would make you comfortable, MJ.

I stated that diversity can result in very unexpected results or actions.

You seem to be a bit disenchanted with CA. Okey-dokey, be all irked, but in your quest to validate your opinion, please don't twist up what I say to prove your point...

As I stated before, diversity is irrelevant in regards to the bigotry California has shown towards gays.

It may have value elsewhere but it is irrelevant in regards to passing Prop 8 and other anti-gay actions committed by CA.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/20/2015 10:50PM by MJ.

No, not really.

If indeed diversity and a blend of wildly varied ethos and intellects resulted in not one, but two negative scores for the gay population, it is indeed Germaine.

You're dismissive attitude is rather off-putting.

Yes?

Did Diversity stop Prop 8, yes or no?


You are making a claim about diversity without showing how diversity affects, or excuses, the fact that California passed prop 8.

Your vague claims about diversity are meaningless unless you can show how they make the bigoted actions of passing prop 8 somehow less bigoted.

Quoting The Princess Bride: “You keep using that word; I do not think it means what you think it means.”

In this discussion, you seem to be implying that this one bigot's current action rekindles the guilt that ALL Californians must again take upon themselves because twice in recent history things were made 'unhappy' for the Gay community. When attempts are made to mollify you with our 'beliefs', you label them irrelevant, (with an 'a'), as if your declaration is sufficient. You seem to consider yourself 'in charge' of this discussion and if something is written that doesn't please you, it is "irrevlevent"...

Is there much wailing and gnashing of teeth at COB trying to decide whether or not to support this initiative ?

MJ...

If California is not on your list of twenty-first century "good guy" states, which states do you think are superior to California---in THIS century---in human rights (which obviously includes LGBT rights)?