You've got the basic, entry level of belief/faith (read Moroni's promise, pray about it, etc.)

Second is skepticism and doubt--testimony crushed, belief out the window. People tell you to refer back to level number one. Just pray and believe and all will be okay.

Third is people who have made it through level two--which is the deciding level. Either you hit the wall and leave (or want to really badly), or some people soldier on and claim to have transcended the skeptic level, i.e., "I've seen all the issues; I know all the dirt, but I choose to believe regardless."

I don't understand how or why level three exists, or continues to persist. I know there is willful ignorance or big-time denial, and reasons that people continue to attend (family, etc.), but why the lording it over others? Why the superiority and dismissal of people at level two? If you've been there, if you've experienced it, there should at least be some sympathy or understanding, not shame and hurt. (I know that's not how the church works, though).

What say ye? Is this relatively accurate?

-Because you WANT to believe
-Social pressure

Some people go all Joseph Campbellish in stage three. They are kind of like, "Myths are stories that speak about important ideas. They ring true with our hearts and minds. They deal with our hopes and aspirations. Our ideals of how we want to be. These mythical stories never actually happened on earth or elsewhere, and no one was ever supposed to think they actually happened, because that is totally missing the point. But humans like stories, especially stories with important meanings."

I personally think it is just easier to go atheist. I can still enjoy stories and philosophize about ideas and morals without sitting in church for three hours ever Sunday.

Level three recoils from the abyss.

Level One~ Begin the washing of the brain.

Level Two~ Add more soap and water and repeat.

Level Three~ Rinse and repeat

They go all hard core because they know the longer someone spends in the doubting period, the greater the chance of them discovering history as at happened, not as it is told.

A lot of it is generational too; leaving means stating publicly that your ancestors were deluded and or decieved. It is much easier to 'get over your doubts' and 'accept the truth' than call ancestors and living relatives deluded. It is easier for them to tell you they are not deluded (they are not stupid, after all, they say) and you should not allow yourself to be deluded by 'the world' and or 'satan' and leave your family and the church. They must reinforce their own belief by telling you what you should believe.

Emotional blackmail at it's highest level. You do love and care for and possibly even respect your immediate and extended families and your predecessors who have passed on. It is hard to tell someone that you think differently without them feeling put down.

today's anon Wrote:
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> some people soldier on and claim to have
> transcended the skeptic level, i.e., "I've seen
> all the issues; I know all the dirt, but I choose
> to believe regardless."

This is the basis of "testimony." It is a choice that someone
makes to believe no matter what. This was underlined by
Holland in his recent talk to the CES people:

"I have a question. What CONCEIVABLE, historical or doctrinal
or procedural issue that may arise among any group could EVER
overshadow or negate one's consuming spiritual conviction,
regarding the father's merciful plan of salvation, his only
begotten son's birth, mission, atonement and resurrection; the
reality of the first vision, the restoration of the priesthood;
the receipt of divine revelation both personally and
institutionally, the soul shaping spirit and moving power of
the Book of Mormon, the awe and majesty of the temple
endowment, one's own personal experience with true miracles,
and on and on and on."

Holland is basically saying your decision to believe
overshadows not only the evidence, but any conceivable
evidence. When someone says, "I know all the dirt but choose
to believe," they are basically saying, "I don't care what the
facts are, I choose to believe regardless of the facts."