http://www.kirotv.com/news/25412144/detail.html

Faulty wiring or arson? Interesting that the building also didn't have a sprinkler system.

Hmmm...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/16/2010 02:04PM by knotheadusc.

Yeah this is all over my FB, all the lds on my fb are thinking it has to do with negative feelings towards the church and someone purposely burned it down........ they sure did jump on the persecution train quick.

If that is not hate in action I do not know what is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/16/2010 02:09PM by MJ.

Possibly a hate crime and should be prosecuted as such if it is, but it could also be some pyromaniac, reckless teenagers or some other reason someone would commit arson.

That's terrible and could have resulted in people dying. It is never okay to hurt other people, even if you disagree with them.

Mormons, however, do love to jump on the persecution wagon. It makes them feel a lot better about themselves.

vandalism. Churches are easy target for property crimes, given that they're usually unoccupied at night.

I just wonder why the church building had no sprinkler system. That seems negligent to me, but I admit I know nothing about safety codes in public buildings.

knotheadusc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I just wonder why the church building had no
> sprinkler system. That seems negligent to me, but
> I admit I know nothing about safety codes in
> public buildings.

Most older buildings don't have sprinklers. When a church I used to attend remodeled, sprinklers and other code upgrades were part of the deal. This included up to date handicapped access and a VERY LOUD fire alarm, called by the congregation the "Armageddon alert."

Sprinklers are cheap to install but ridiculously expensive to retrofit.

I am also quite sceptical of the 800 attendees quoted in the article, more like 200...

My thoughts exactly. If there was only 2 wards meeting in the building there is no way they had 800 members. Utah,maybe. Just like the lds church is the fastest growing church...hardy har har.

Yeah I think it was a typo. It meant to say 80 people. I don't think they even have 800 people in Mukilteo! Hate crime, maybe. Probably more like some bored kids.

This church is in a very posh area in the suburbs of Seattle. A lot of wealthy Boeing employees live in this area. Not usually a lot of crime here or angry pyro gays.

Two Wards meet in the building. Fire broke out at 3 a.m.
More info here.

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=12848130

Woohoo! One less of those ugly little buildings in my state!

Glad no one was hurt in it.

So the attics can burn, and due to the sealed nature of the attics, there is virtually nothing that a fire department can do to stop attic fires in LDS buildings.

But there are sprinklers installed in the ceilings of LDS buildings as part of the building code in most areas of the country.

Chances are (and from previous LDS chapel attic fires) their was an electrical short somewhere that triggered the fire.

I sincerely doubt that the fire was due to arson. Nope!

since the martyrdom, this kind of attack is GREAT PR for the church.
Darn, darn, darn you freakin' arsonist.
You just gave the Morg a bunch of persecution points.
Now people are a little more wary of criticizing it let we be seen as accomplices to an arsonist.
F-you arsonist. You just gave the church a way to say to it's members that satan is persecuting them and that prophecy is being fulfilled, so batten-down and be even MORE orthodox!

That's arson too.

There's been no evidence yet pointing to an actual case of arson. As far as they've been able to tell it was just an old building with no sprinklers that had an electrical short, and burned down. There's already fools all over the cult circuit trying to call this an arson case, let's not give them fuel for their arguments.

Take it for what it is so far, a random old building burning down. The building I use to go to was fairly new and had a ton of wiring problems all over it. I wouldn't be surprised at all if others just went up in flames. The mormons don't seem to be hiring many skilled workers when they make these places.

Besides if JS supposedly had empty shafts built into some temple for elevators in the future, why didn't the more recent prophet$ see in visions that fire burns and building should be made of mud instead. I've never seen mud burn.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/17/2010 12:42AM by allen.

"Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire." Matthew 7:19

"But if it be not built upon my gospel, and is built upon the works of men, or upon the works of the devil, verily I say unto you they have joy in their works for a season, and by and by the end cometh, and they are hewn down and cast into the fire, from whence there is no return." 3 Nephi 27:11

And if this is the hand of God, is it still arson or an inside job?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/17/2010 01:47AM by mick.

Thanks for the link hosebeasticatha.

Now that we know it's been reported as a real arson case... I'd have to agree with what amos said about making the building a martyr. Foolish arsonist just gave local mormons a step up.

I'm all for giving them ways to see how wrong they are, but breaking the law and causing property damage are crossing the line. There are better ways.

This is totally wrong, and I hope those responsible for this sickening crime are caught and the book thrown at them. It is not only illegal and very stupid, but it fuels the persecution complex Mormons have.

They said the fire started on the outside of the building. Wow. I guess the member security program isn't all that effective. The church has people go by every night to make sure the buildings are locked up. Everytime I was asked to do it, I never went. I figured that everything valuable that was inside the building was already behind a locked closet door or room door(library, clerks offices, etc.) Plus, I thought that if anyone wanted to get inside and do some real damage, a locked glass door wouldn't stop them. Guess I was half-right.

Interesting that LDS immediately jumped to martyrdom to fuel the ever-present persecution complex, but no one in these tough economic times (plus the fact that the church books are not open to members or investigators wihin or outside the church), jumped to any thoughts of insurance scam, or cover-up of embezzlement by a member.

It's the first thing I thought of, when arson was confirmed.

Of course, it is possible it was a random whackjob, or teen pyro from the area, or a disgruntled former or current member with an axe to grind, or even an angry, activist gay person, but I'd say look more closely within before jumping straight to the idea it's a gay with a hatred of LDS.

There are crazies everywhere, in and outside of the LDS church. I think it is just as likely that a member did it, as a non-member.

Disclosure: I'm an atheist, a woman, a former Catholic and ex-Moravian, and have had many--I'd say 50-50, good vs. bad--interactions with LDS as an investigator. So please take what I say with a grain of salt...and an espresso.

bookratt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Interesting that LDS immediately jumped to
> martyrdom to fuel the ever-present persecution
> complex, but no one in these tough economic times
> (plus the fact that the church books are not open
> to members or investigators wihin or outside the
> church), jumped to any thoughts of insurance scam,
> or cover-up of embezzlement by a member.
>
> It's the first thing I thought of, when arson was
> confirmed.

It is the first thing I thought of when I heard about this story as well. This is perfect timing for the church after the blow up in the press over Packer's talk, and if the church is really hurting for money, this is one way to get a nice new ward house for the wealthy Mukilteo ward.

But I think the church is self-insured.

You would think (they don't think) that the building would have been updated with sprinklers as a safety precaution, but, then again, the Morg is too busy constructing a mall to care about the average member.

I have to laugh at the "800" members who attend there. Two wards with 800 attending or is that 800 on the records with only 300 attending?

If it is arson, I really do hope that they catch the guy and throw the book at him. As much as I detest Mormonism, nothing they do gives people the right to take actions against them like this. It only serves to further inflame their persecution complex and feel, once again, like victims.

Maybe it was a former janitor, angry that they are no longer on god's team and are now having trouble feeding their family?

There will always be pyromaniacs.This time they were out late at night into the early morning hours. We won't know the WHY until they find the: WHO.
Right now, it's all speculation about the WHY.

I was happy to read that nobody was in the building and no one got hurt.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2010/0210/Texas-church-fires-Who-s-behind-them


But perpetrators of church arson, when finally apprehended, often don’t fit the expected profiles, as shown by more than 1,000 church arson investigations conducted nationally since 1996, when the National Church Arson Task Force was established.

“We’ve had situations where the motivation was covering up burglaries and theft, ... where it was acting out against people in revenge, and we’ve had cases where it had to do with the occult, and cases where people are just making poor judgments,” says Mr. Paulk, the Alabama fire marshal.

Racism, religious hatred, insurance fraud, and thrill-seeking are less common reasons for church arson, according to the Insurance Information Institute.