I haven't had sex for the last 15 years of my 22-year marriage. No real explanation was ever given except that my husband held a grudge for some perceived wrong early on in the marriage. Additionally, he has OFTEN told me he wasn't attracted to me (I am a very pretty woman with normal flaws, aging but still attractive).

I am dead certain he is not/has not acted on his homosexual desires during the marriage ... BECAUSE the church mindfucked him so badly that he won't allow himself to act on those desires. They are deeply suppressed, but it hasn't always been that way. He had a number of gay encounters in his 20's (one that I've always known about and several others that have surfaced over the years). In fact, he was excommunicated just before his mission to Belgium for confessing to his Bishop that he had sex with his girlfriend AND a guy(s).

One encounter seems to have been a watershed event in his life. As he was having sex with another man, he had some kind of religious/moral experience. He kept hearing in his mind, "This is WRONG. This is WRONG!! I think that he decided at that moment to "be straight" and I was eventually part of that plan. After marrying me he was able to be rebaptized, go to the Temple, and be sealed to our children - which is a HUGE big damn deal in his GA-related family.

He had many, many female sexual experiences before our marriage, but nothing ever lasted very long. He cuts women off as soon as they make him angry. He also stopped having sex with his first wife after she pissed him off (see the pattern here?).

However, the one thing that doesn't square up with my theory is my husband's constant sexual talk and dirty jokes about hot women. It's beyond obnoxious and so crazy-embarrassing. He has no shame in ogling women in public and making disgusting sexual comments about them right to my face. Any porn I've ever discovered over the years has been straight. He's in the hospital now so I've been able to get into his emails and comb his internet history ... plenty of girl porn but absolutely no gay porn, not even a lone pop-up.

I was a cheerleader in high school, a sorority girl in college, and a party girl in my 20's (obviously not a Mormon yet). I've had plenty of sexual experiences with both straight men AND gay men who had not come out yet. There is a palpable difference in the sex. My husband's performance in bed falls on the side of the gay men. I always attributed his reticence and awkwardness to being Mormon.

I have so many questions now. I've researched this thing obsessively for weeks. I feel fairly certain that I'm right and with his partial admission last night I'm even more secure in my belief. But a couple of things don't add up so I need my gay friends on the board to enlighten me.

My first and biggest question:

Why would a gay man watch straight porn and ONLY straight porn???

;o)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2015 10:34AM by shannon.

"Why would a gay man watch straight porn and ONLY straight porn???"

Perhaps because he knew you might find it (and straight porn films also include MALE junk...).

Love and best wishes to you, Shannon. Hope things work out.

Tom in Paris

I completely agree with Soft Machine!

If it is couples porn, then he is probably getting off on the guy parts. I think the better question you should ask is this: Does his porn history include any female-only (masturbation) or lesbian porn? As a hetero-male, I can testify that these are the only true types of porn.

And I suspect most hetero-males have to agree with Joseph Gordon-Levitt's character Jon (from Don Jon). The guys in couples porn usually just ruin the shot! That is unless you are gay... I guess?

Shannon: On a separate note, I feel for you. I am in a 15 year marriage that has been sexless for 11 years. And the first 4 were not great either. This can have a pretty devastating impact on a person's psyche. I hope you are holding up okay!

I have often wondered if my wife is a lesbian trapped in a "Mormon" marriage... because that is what god wants.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2015 07:42PM by joesm.

Marital counselling. But look at the prospect of divorce.

I don't know why any gay man would look at straight porn.

But from your description of your life, it would take a helluva lot of positives to make up for the negatives. The admission of the attraction is a good thing and hopefully ends the fence sitting.

As a gay man who was raised Mormon I would say Tom in Paris is onto something. The straight porno is most likely a cover.

You learn to do anything and everything to throw suspicion off of yourself. I remember well the fear, the desperation, and the self loathing which goes deeply in tandem with the Mormon brainwashing. Two things eating at your very deepest self. What a combination!

Be fearless with your honesty. You deserve to be in an honest relationship because the road to happiness is not the high road or the low road but the road straight through the tough stuff.

I feel for you and I wish you the best.

It's either a cover or he's trying to train himself to be into straight sex?

I'm no expert but could he be bi?

I figure my ex was either a closeted gay, or bisexual.

He really liked sex with women but without intimacy - meaning he didn't like kissing - intercourse without kissing.

He had a real fascination with gay bars and clubs and when he mentioned it, I asked him straight out if he was gay but he said no. This made me then wonder - either he was ashamed of his natural tendencies, or perhaps bi.

from conversations I've had with ex-wives of gays.

Yes! I can only remember one time that we french kissed - on the beach on our first date. Anything else is a quick smack on the lips.

;o)

What can I say? We have discussed this once before. I thought MAYBE it was just the fucked up messages that Mormons receive. How many gay men have tried to convince themselves they aren't gay? How about that TLC show? Heaven forbid we have to admit to ourselves we are gay.

My first thought is what Tom said--he is covering. He has been hoping his whole life that he isn't "that!" As so many gays have said before, why would anyone CHOOSE to be gay with all the negative messages and wondering if everyone they love will reject them, see them as a monster, a pervert?"

This would make a lot more sense out of your life, wouldn't it? You'll be looking back over years and years of experiences and saying, "Oh, that explains it."

Your husband obviously has A LOT of self-loathing. Emily Pearson's book is called "Dancing with Crazy." When I KNEW, it was already crazy-making, but to not really know, it just makes it so much more crazy.

I just repurchased, "The Other Side of the Closet." Oddly, I can't read it now either. Funny thing, I gave my first copy to the Deseret Industries. I bought this book off of Amazon from Good Will. On the front cover it has a price tag that says, "Deseret Industries." Did I buy my own book back? I just found that interesting. You might want to read this book, though. If he says he might be gay, I'd suspect he is. You are also in the closet. It is a major MIND FUCK.

I'd say he makes the statements and watches women to prove to himself more than anyone and to others he is straight. It is also a cover.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2015 11:05AM by cl2.

Thank you Cl2. I was hoping you'd pop in here. You're right, I remember exactly what you said to me after I laid out all my "evidence" to you a few years ago, asking you if you thought my husband was gay or straight. You said, "I don't know WHAT your husband is!"

Me either ...

;o)

Can you imagine coming out in that family? Oh my hell. I would assume many of his problems (hasn't he had problems with drugs) are directly linked to this.

I can't even begin to explain to anyone what it does to you to be married to someone gay. I've talked about it long enough. You lose your femininity. You try to bury any sexuality at all. You become an it. Even if I've been in a straight relationship for 10 years now, my femininity is just finally coming back. I feel more healed right now than I have in 30 years. It isn't necessarily being in a straight relationship that did it, but time. Actually, I was rather shocked when my ex's 2 ex boyfriends told me how good I'm looking these days. I do feel it.

But this is so damaging to YOU! You've struggled for SO LONG and I think this has A LOT to do with it. I'm not going to say I'm sorry because this is the beginning, the beginning of the healing. If he even kind of went there, he is gay.

You can e-mail me any time. colleen84319 at yahoo

Summer,

I DID finally leave him last summer. I took my littlest one and moved in with my cousin a few states away. I was only there for a few days when he nearly died. I had to come back home to care for him. He was in the ICU the entire summer and has been hospitalized since then. He will be in the hospital until mid-April. I can't leave again until he is stabilized.

I'm not a monster. He is the father of my children. We have grandchildren together. I am a good person and I still live by the Christian (Catholic) principals I was raised with. My conscience won't allow me to abandon him right now. He's a human being and he is suffering.

As far as the 15-years thing ... for about half of that time, I carried on an online affair with a lovely man I met when I flew out to Utah for ex-mo conference a few years ago. That filled a lot of emotional/sexual needs for me for a long time.

;o)

edit: crap, I posted this in the wrong place. I'm replying to Summer's comment right below me.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2015 11:24AM by shannon.

You've been through so much. I hope things start getting better for you.

I got it, no worries, Shannon. :) I understand your reasoning. Just understand that your husband is a) gay, and b) has been needlessly cruel to you. See him through this illness and then go find your bliss. You deserve it.

No sex for 15 years? He's not a husband, he's a roommate. I think he makes the comments about women because he knows he will get a rise out of you. For heaven's sake, why are you sticking around? I would have been out of there long ago.

Dogzilla's comment could be it.

My ex was also into straight porn but openly talked crudely about women and was into gay bars. Perhaps because he felt ashamed for having same sex inclinations, he realized he needed to watch straight porn to figure out how to enjoy straight sex, meanwhile his natural urges were for gay sex. I'd never thought of this before!

As someone who is in a similar situation... you make rationalizations. For me it was because I promised God I would stay with her. Then I had my faith crisis, and I stayed for my kids.

It just takes us all a bit of time to figure it out. Because having a roommate... a roommate that gate-keeps your sexuality... that really sucks.

Oh, Shannon, with all you have been through, not this too!

15 years with no sex? What is THAT about?

If he would rather be with a man, there is NO way you can compete with that..believe me I tried.

You both really need to take a hard look at your marriage. If it is not giving you the bliss you both deserve, maybe it is time to move on.

As a gay guy born in mormonism I'd say the straight porn really doesn't tell you anything. I tried at times to "cure" myself in my teens by consciously forcing myself to fantasize about girls while...you know exactly what. (This was before easy-access internet porn). Mormonism can certainly play a number on it's gay members. Also, as been pointed out, straight porn contains male junk aswell. It's perfectly possible for a gay guy to get off on straight porn.

From everything you've told us I'd guess he's bisexual. But that's just a guess. Gay or bicurious or whatever the most important thing though is that this is a seriously messed up guy that also treats you bad. The number one question here is not a detailed review of his sexual orientation, it's wether he is willing and able to come to terms with his sexuality and wether you are up for joining him in that ride. And if you do want to help him it seems professionals are needed here.

The crude ogling of women in public sounds like overcompensation.

I'm guessing that there were men in these straight porn films? (some gay men like watching straight porn, believe it or not)

I find it very hard to believe that he hasn't had sex for 15 years. My guess is that a trip to the Maury Povich Show would reveal some very well hidden assignations.

I'm very sorry for you, Shannon, and hope things turn around for you.

I feel for you Shannon. Isn't it a major disappointment that no human troubles can be eased with the help of the gospel of god? Mormonism has done nothing for you, and perhaps much against you. May the love of your children bring you serenity.

Does it even matter if he's gay? I say no. The man has refused to have sex with you for 15 years. Wow! And here I thought four years of few and far between was insufferable. You can either end that shit by walking away, or step into the endless why loop and waste more years talking about it (because the conversation is somehow emotionally rewarding, or perhaps just less scary than the doing).

Walk or talk? Pretty clear choice, if you ask me. But of course I'm speaking from experience. :)

I still can't get over the no sex for 15 years bit. My girl and I haven't been together that long (~5 years), but we still can't go a few days without jumping each others bones.

You need to move on and find someone who is at least attracted to you.

I like straight porn. I like gay porn. I like both types of human forms - male and female.

Your husband might be bisexual. It can be very confusing to be bisexual because most people I know don't accept it as real. They believe in sexual bifurcation - gay or straight and no in-between.

I've had a very hard time admitting that I was attracted to men when I was a child. I confused it with daddy issues and male role model problems.

But I naturally gravitated to sexual relationships with my friends and initiated them.

I've always found most human bodies sexually attractive and interesting and I love to draw them. Some of my favorite sketches of nudes are of bodies that are not perfect or muscular.

Good luck with your husband. My wife has had to suffer being married to a bisexual person. It is hard but our relationship is a good one and I love her. Sometimes I feel guilty she didn't get a heterosexual man. But she loves me like no other.

You and your husband have been cheated by the mormon church. As a gay man, who was married, let me say to you that you deserve better. I believe you should lovingly and caringly get out of the marriage and start a new like that includes the intimacy you need and deserve. What he does with his life is his business and deserves whatever pain he experiences from this point on. None of this is your fault other than calling his bluff sooner. I would guess he told you in hopes you will cut him free. You and never start enjoying life sooner than today.

Do your self a favor and enjoy the rest of your life with straight men who appreciate your beauty

He might be bisexual?

I also know a gay guy who watches straight porn so that he can imagine himself being the woman.

Shannon -

I don't have anything valuable to add about your husband's admission. I do want you to know how much I admire your goodness and sacrifice in standing by him in his time of need. You have had enough heartache in your life to last for seven lifetimes, and I am so sorry you have this latest round of pain to endure.

If there was anyone that was tough enough to get through this, its you.

-Sunny

An openly gay friend of mine once told me that the only porn that he liked to watch was straight porn. He was also very clear that he had no desire to have sex with women. Human wiring.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/05/2015 03:58PM by madalice.

I'm getting dolled up now to go to the broadway musical "The Book of Mormon" with my mom. Woot! I'm typing with wet nails and I'll be super-pissed if I ruin them.

You guys have given me my answers and I thank you!!! There's so much more I want to say but that will have to be another thread for another day.

Luv u guys!
Shannon ;o)

Don't ruin your nails! Nothing is worth that. Have fun. You'll laugh a lot at that play. It's hilarious.

Aww, I hope that you thoroughly enjoy yourself, Shannon! I'm glad to hear that you are doing something for *you*.

There is a such thing as bisexuality. Many male bisexuals are actually gay men just coming out, but there really are guys and girls who like both. They don't have to like both equally, some may be 2:1 or 3:1 or more, but the point is that they find themselves attracted to both sexes at some point.

If your husband had a string of male and female loves, then he is probably bisexual. He may watch straight porn because he likes both actors in the scene. Some gay men like straight porn if the guys are hot and the girls are not too prominently featured, but most straight porn is designed to feature hot girls and ordinary men.

He clearly needs counseling. Something triggered in him to break this multidecade silence. You probably should go to counseling as well, being stuck in this marriage for so long. He may be signaling he wants to move on, and you should be prepared for that.

You're not alone, hun. I actually have three friends in the same situation. Two divorced. One of the marriages was unconsummated after 5 years.

It's not really that unusual, if you know enough gay guys that is. :-) But the ones I have known were mostly "out." I asked them why they liked it and they said that they liked straight guys.

Now that's a whole other problem but is kind of understandable. And they didn't really even like "butch" gay guys, but rather seemed to love straight guys. The kind they could never have?

I think if that's what you want, you would be pretty miserable in life, but it is something to consider.

However, deep down, I think in this case the guy is just looking at guys in straight porn because straight porn is more socially acceptable than gay porn?

I'm inclined to agree with munchyboaz--asking "why" he behaves this way may not be the most relevant question. You deserve to be in a complete relationship, one that includes the feeling of being desired and desireable.
Just a quick skim left me with this eyebrow-raiser: "She left and then he went into ICU so she had to come back? Hmmm." Some people manufacture emergencies as a way of manipulating others. I don't know if that 'coincidence' has been discussed elsewhere, but perhaps it should have.