I just realized this because i'm reading the book, but in orwell's '1984' the ministry of love is the law enforcement branch of the government. hearing the church's disciplinary court called a 'court of love' reminded me of the obvious parallels between the english socialist party and the church's authoritarianism. they almost have the same exact rules of 'orthodoxy' if not the same surveillance to monitor possible 'thought criminals'. the church wont exactly torture and kill you for thought crime but it uses similar fear based indoctrination methods to brainwash members until they love 'big brother'...er.. i meant joseph christ..no....um, well you know what i mean.

well if any of you have read the book i would like to hear if you have any other insights.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/28/2015 04:23PM by secularhumanguy.

1984 ~ 100 % parallel to TSCC.

just sayin'

You are so right. I had to read it for a college course in California in 1973. I thought it funny that some day it was really going to be 1984 and wondered if the world would be anything like Airstrip One when we got there.

It never occurred to me at the time that I was living in it. Maybe that's because TSCC was a different animal in the early 70s. But years later it hit me and I re-read it. I realized, "OMG, it's a 100% parallel."

+1000000000

If you haven't already, next, read Orwell's 'Animal Farm'...
I talked about it in a thread here awhile ago.
You'll find it equally fascinating as well.

http://exmormon.org/phorum/read.php?2,1483050

Both books are amazing, also, I recommend adding "Brave New World" by Aldous Huxley to your reading list.

thanks ill try to read both, the similarities are mind blowing between the authoritarianism orwell describes and tscc. just thought it was worth posting

It's all about human nature. The dark side, that is.

well i for one am glad for a place to vent my 'unorthodoxy' without any 'telescreens' around :)

Big Brother comes to mind when some talk of how this site is being watched and monitored by the church.
I cracked a joke about that once, except I left the ‘r’ out and just called it _big bother_.
Snort!

Doublethink is a major tool used by TSCC, as is the use of language to try to minimise undesirable thoughts. Plus they use family to spy on possible dissidents. Then there is changing history and the memory hole.

I read the book cover to cover in the back seat of Dad's Oldsmobile on the way to spend Christmas in Utah....and the disturbing culture portrayed in the novel became evident to me when I attended Ricks 2 years later.

Ron Burr

It's been a few years since I've read it, but wasn't the Ministry of Truth the department that specialized in rewriting history?

There certainly seems to be plenty of that in the Mormon church.

exactly. the essays, and MMM explanation, and apologetics all smack of this.

Reading the essays, all I could think of is "We have always been at war with Easasia

Ah, Orwell! Love him (actually prefer his non-fiction, especially both his essays and Homage To Catalonia) but 1984 and Animal Farm are great (as is Burmese Days which is semi-autobiographical based on his experience in the Colonial Police in Burma, also lesser known ones like A Clergyman's Daughter or Coming up For Air) but yes, 1984 is a great novel against all forms of totalitarianism, including LD$ Inc. (it's actually become cliched, with thought crimes, newsspeak, room 101 being regulars in our lexicon). Another great way to describe LD$ Inc. is one of the most famous quotes from Animal Farm
"All Animals Are Equal, But Some Animals are more Equal than others"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/29/2015 12:33AM by iamanevermormon.

I agree 100% with GNPE. I even wondered if Orwell studied the CULT's doctrine to get it so down pat.

Big Brother is the Big 15



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/29/2015 12:56AM by verilyverily.

No, it was actually just about Stalinism in particular and totalitarianism in general. i don't even think Orwell ever said anything about LD$ Inc. in his essays (remember, he was British and there wasn't as many Mormons in the UK in his day), it just so happens that the shoe fits perfectly with the cult, because it's a tried and true formula for repressive authoritarian governments and organizations.

On my mission while tracting we met a guy who had a mountain of books in his apartment. He offered to give us some books before we left and for some reason I was drawn to 1984 and opted to take it - at the time I never heard of it.

I Read it after the mish and couldn't deny the parallels with tscc. 1984 was seminal in helping me realize that tscc wasn't what it claimed to be. Even though I'm very skeptical of supposed supernatural experiences I can't help but wonder why I was drawn to that book.

I have said for a while that the easiest way to describe LDS "doctrine" to the average (at least partially educated!) nevermo is "Orwellian."

It seemed like that to this Never Mo as well.

We should all re=read it. The parallels are astounding.

It was the book that helped me visualize what I was feeling, and that it wasn't my fault.

It was the book that helped me give myself permission to research the church.

The church pretends to smile and use soft terms to get you to comply, but if not, the gloves come off...

That book also helped me out as well, in fact it was when I reread it after I filed for divorce and quit going to the Mormon church that I realized the similarities. I had first read that book when I was in high school, after we had read Animal Farm in an English class. That's how much I liked Animal Farm, that it got me interested in reading 1984.

From 1984:

http://puremormonism.blogspot.com/2010/02/best-conference-talk-you-never-read_13.html

The irony.

Yep. Unbelievable.

I totally agree (thus my screen name). Understanding mormonism, or totalist/coercive/cult tactic groups of any type, it's all about Orwell. For example, it also really applies quite well to Amway/Multi Level Marketing pyramid schemes that promise total financial freedom/Nirvana to their "converts".

Basically, beware of anyone promising Utopia.

Orwell really understood it. In his time it was fascism and Stalinist Russia.

The doublespeak and doublethink in mormonism are truly mind blowing to witness.

More ideas from the book:
Junior Anti-Sex League
Sex crime/having sex for fun
Unperson
Crimethinker
Thinkpol/Thought Police
Bellyfeel
Goodthinker
us vs. them/2 minutes of hate/hate week
Inner Party/Outer Party

I think there are parallels for all of these in Mormonism.

I grew up with a boot stamping on my face--a Mormon boot. It could have just as easily been a jackboot, Orwell knows.

The John Hurt/Richard Burton version is fantastic.

I would like to suggest another book while we're at it
"Why Orwell Matters"
http://www.amazon.com/Why-Orwell-Matters-Christopher-Hitchens/dp/0465030505