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Posted by: Texas Sue ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 11:23AM

A new perspective on Helen Mar Kimball. So much of the controversy revolves around her age and whether or not the marriage was consummated. What about the fact that Joseph told her, "if you take this step, it will ensure your eternal salvation & exaltation and that of your father’s household & all of your kindred."? "This promise was so great that [she] willingly gave [herself] to purchase so glorious a reward."
(http://www.wivesofjosephsmith.org/26-HelenMarKimball.htm)


Doesn't this MOCK a little something that TBM's revere like the atonement! Just like it's not fair for men to be punished for others' sins (Third Article of Faith), how is it fair that one person's action would exalt all of her father's household and her posterity in the Celestial Kingdom? Is this not evidence that Joseph was coercing these women into plural marriage, because even from a TBM perspective, he was offering more than anyone other than the Savior could give? Just a thought. Please correct me if I'm mistaken in my thinking.

On a side note, how is Helen going to have posterity unless Joseph consummates marriage?

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Posted by: William Law ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 11:30AM

Yes, that's correct. JS made the story up as he went along.

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Posted by: vh65 ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 11:38AM

I think the things Helen said in an autobiographical letter to her children that was sealed until her death are very interesting. She agreed because she trusted her parents and it made her miserable. She I suspect still doubted that it would be seen as the right choice. And the "for eternity alone" quote in the poem is something I interpret to mean she just did it for the blessings. Seems to me to indicate not only was there no love on her side, she was looking forward to his eventual death so she could resume her life - but probably thought it would be many years. Helen was so bright and loving and sensitive. This just breaks my heart:
http://rsc.byu.edu/archived/womans-view-helen-mar-whitneys-reminiscences-early-church-history/11-appendix-one

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Posted by: CL2 ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 12:34PM

I'm glad that she found some love and happiness. Too bad she had to share the one she loved with other women. I'm going to have to get out "In Sacred Loneliness" and read the part about her again.

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Posted by: generationofvipers ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 01:06PM

I love it--the atonement as pick-up line for Joe.

No better evidence exists in my mind that Joseph Smith didn't believe anything he ever said than this cynical, disingenuous use of what is supposed to be the most sacred tenet of his faith: the salvation and exaltation made possible through Jesus.

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Posted by: Texas Sue ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 04:42PM

Thank you for putting it more eloquently than I could. Why does this aspect of Helen Mar Kimball's story not make every TBM furious?

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Posted by: 2+2= 4 nli ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 02:13PM

I agree.

What's more, please note this, never mind JS and Helen Mar Kimball, you can read this on the current, modern day, official LDS website: a mormon must marry another mormon in the mormon temple in order to enjoy "exaltation in the celestial kingdom". This is totally in conflict with the concept of the atonement and also free will.

Go to their site and read about the CK and temple marriage and think about it. Contrary to what they claim, in Mormonism, there is no free agency. In the interest of truth in advertising, mormon agency should be called "couple agency" or "group agency".

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Posted by: forestpal ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 02:28PM

Because Mormonism overrides and belittles the Atonement, the Mormon cult is not only not-Christian, it is truly anti-Christ, IMO.

I have one word for Joseph Smith: Sociopath.

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Posted by: mags ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 02:34PM

The stated purpose of Polygamy was to "build up the Kingdom" So why would he go to effort of obtaining a 14 year old girl if only to have a platonic Marriage with her. It makes no sense at all

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Posted by: anonugh ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 02:41PM

Not only does it qualify as anti-Christian, but taking into consideration the unalterable "blessings" JS was offering to Helen Mar Kimball's family, he was actually usurping gods power and position as well. Sociopath no doubt.

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Posted by: Third Vision ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 05:46PM

Not that they're mutually exclusive, but it's the narcissists that are preoccupied with their great power, great intelligence, ideal love, etc.

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Posted by: michaelc1945 ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 04:56PM

Remember folks JS already thought of himself as a god so what he offered was something within his perceived power.

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Posted by: ette ( )
Date: November 22, 2014 05:19PM

I hadn't thought about it this way before. Thanks for the link to a byu version of the story. It's gonna be hard for my tbm family to call this anti mormon propaganda when it comes from the Lards University.

Something nasty that occurred to me is that I was taught these same mind control tactics as a missionary in training. Challenge the investigator to live a commandment, then use my special priesthood to promise fabulous blessings.

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Posted by: Third Vision ( )
Date: November 23, 2014 01:27AM

Joseph Smith derived much of his power from promising shortcuts to salvation. Second Anointing, men who go on missions, couples sealed in the temple, apparently those related to his brides...there was an exception for everyone, because Smith needed people to sacrifice NOW for his own purposes. He couldn't promise the same thing twice, though, and I think William Law felt confident enough that he never wanted the temple blessings.

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