What is the end game at these places? I am somewhat in the middle of a family situation where a just barely 14 year old boy was sent to one of these places in Utah. His sin? He didn't want to go to church. He was taken to the school on the very day the family was to meet with Child Protective Services over alleged abuse from his own father. The cost is thousands per month.

What really goes on in these places?

Why is his family covering it up for? Eventually this family secret will be come out...Somebody's gonna spill it on social media or at the school teachers or students will ask..

I think Don Bagley had a similar experience, but some years ago.

Don ?

It's rather frightening that it's still going on.

Tom in Paris

You are correct, Tom. When I was fourteen my father tried to place me in foster care. He told me that I was bringing the devil into the house, and he had to cut me off. The Bible told him to do it, and the Holy Ghost concurred (coincidentally, I had recently grown too large to beat). After that attempt failed, I was sent to a boy's ranch. My charges were truancy and proximity to marijuana. My father agreed to a six month sentence. I have no police record now, but I lost my fifteenth summer.

My mom threatened to send me to one of those when I was 13-14. The reason: smoking (tobacco). Otherwise, I was a pretty good kid (even though TSCC convinced my parents that I was filthy).

I told that to a kid who actually did go to "Juvey," and he was appalled and confused that any parent would entertain such an extreme form of punishment for just for smoking.

You may want to Google eric norwood (on my phone right now). And the westridge academy. Here was a quick link I found. He used to have a site I can't locate now.http://scienceblogs.com/dispatches/2009/01/07/chris-buttars-and-the-mormon-g/

I know of kid who's sin was graffiti in Logan Utah. Parents packed him up and spent $24K to send him trekking across the deserts of Arizona for two months in the spring. They adjust altitude with the weather and are ready to put up in a hotel if there is really bad weather. Otherwise they have very little overhead. They make the kids cook their own spartan meals. Travel a few miles each day to a new food and water drop and sleep out for weeks on end ( they are actually close to roads all the time in case of emergency.) They advertise with all the LDS buzz words and parents bite.

He ended up rubbing shoulders with kids with real problems. The staff that is camping out with the kids are often under-educated but they have "qualified staff" that are supposedly available. Does it give kids an appreciation for home life or at least the comforts of home? Maybe. Does it help some kids? Probably and damages others- Can you imagine the sense of betrayal some kids feel?. But they are making dooh and saving souls.

The owner of the Utah Boys Ranch is none other than former Utah State Senator Chris Buttars. Politically, he's a headcase I've skewered on more than one occasion, but my sources also tell me he's a compassionate sort who understands the power of a "therapeutic community." I've heard of "excesses," but I also saw how manipulative and dishonest troubled adolescents can be...

I worked for several operations in the late 1980's, and part of the problem is the kid who is "the identified patient" is frequently merely a focal point for the family dysfunction (often, as noted, an abusive parent, a father and mother who are basically incompatible, and a lot of "multi-generational" crapola that's handed down). In other cases where addictive disease or other mental problems are present, it's the parents who are "the victims."

I saw one operation I worked for briefly that was, IMHO, far worse than the Utah Boys Ranch (no opinion, really on them; I don't know enough to make a judgment call), and yet I ran up against some "shoot the messenger" stuff when the problems became apparent. Speaking out hurt me politically and was part of the reason I left the field.

I also saw another unit with some really toxic folks in charge, but a number of solid recoveries emerged nevertheless.

It's really tricky to identify problem areas in teenagers, even though we know that alcoholism/addiction is often clearly present in some at that age. It's true, however, that adolescent delinquency is no predictor of adult delinquency (one reason I'm often appalled when a juvenile is "certified" as an adult).

Sadly, the "profit motive" is a factor for a lot of operations, and many are "pied piper" in nature, and parents who think their teens are in trouble are often easy marks. The rigidity of "The Mormon Mindset" often contributes to this unhealthy situation; a few years ago I gave a kid a ride home who'd been in the program I mentioned. It was clear to me he had no alcoholism issues; he was now in his 20's and was taking a taxi home around ten at night after a few drinks and listening to some live music. Obviously, that was a case of over-zealousness and misdiagnosis, and there's really no argument something "misfired."

As for the solutions, well, as my old brother-in-law used to say about business consulting, it's easy to coach but hard to play...

I never see anything wrong with sending parents to the appropriate support group (althogh I have misgivings about some such as "Tough Love," even though their tactics have merit at times).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2014 01:14AM by SL Cabbie.

I got an F on my report card and was sent to the Detention Center in SLC. I usually got straight As. The police there told my mom the next day that it was not illegal to get an F and they could not hold me. SO then it was changed to unmanageable, but they still couldn't keep me.
I was in there several times for real things but that time stands out as such a joke. There was a 3 year period in which my parents and I did not see eye to eye on much. I was a Hellion.

Is this place like it and others supposed to get the teens "Scared Straight"???

Well the campus looked very sterile with dorm buildings, an athletic center, administration buildings etc, but nothing that seemed welcoming or compassionate. I drove around on a warm evening and did not see one human being outside...it was creepy, like a locked down facility. It is West Ridge.

I have a relative who was recently sent to such a "joint." Apparently it "fixed" the youth. I believe it made the youngster smarter... meaning the youth has learned how to play the game. We shall see.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/30/2014 10:31AM by fudley.

a friends daughter went to westridge a few years ago. she learned more howto do things, how to lie to her parents and therapists. she was on lockdown at the beginning, getting more freedom as she behaved. worthless in the long haul, she had some serious issues, but this was to prevent her going into foster care, but sh ended up back in anyway.

She is now an adult and doing pretty goodby normal standards, just not by her tbm mom and dad. But not pregnant, not in jail, not doing drugs, so I dunno, could be so much worse.

But even my friends thought westridge was a joke. their insuance paid for it nd when it ran out they kicked her out.

Here is Eric Norwood's story:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/01/05/680293/-Trapped-in-a-Mormon-Gulag


Another source for the whole story of abuse in the "mormon gulag":
http://thedevilisindembooks.blogspot.de/2014/02/trapped-in-mormon-gulag.html

"Gitmo for kids"

http://www.opednews.com/articles/GITMO-FOR-KIDS-Senator-Bu-by-Daniel-Vojir-090219-856.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6AbhYGzvwD0

ABUSE AT THE Mormon Gulag Update

Politicians Involved with the Mormon Boot Camp
http://www.examiner.com/slideshow/politicians-involved-with-the-mormon-boot-camp

See also"BYU Mormon Lawyer Defends Sex Abuse at LDS Boot Camp":
http://www.examiner.com/article/byu-mormon-lawyer-defends-sex-abuse-at-lds-boot-camp

I have some TBM friends who sent their teenage son to a Utah boot camp for boys that was recommended by their Idaho Bishop.

The mother told me the kid was abused and she feels really bad now about sending him. I never asked her what she meant by "abused." But it had to have been something really bad to shake her commitment to a solution suggested by her bishop.

I have had two children go to these types of facilities.

My son went to Provo Canyon School, which was later closed due to us parents complaining about sexual predators inside who used "devil worship" to terrify their victims.

My son told me he was attacked in the bathrooms and there was just no supervision, so screaming, etc, didn't help. At Provo Canyon School the teens were forced to stand at the wall for hours at a time for minor offences while this horrific sexual abuse was ignored.

When he graduated, we all thought he seemed robotic afterward. He was already on a bad track of violence, so it's hard to know what came first, the chicken or the egg.

He did tell me this shocking story. He and a kid from Texas, the son of a prominent psychiatrist, were standing on the wall. When their supervisor went to the bathroom, he attacked this other kid so hard he damaged his vision, possibly for life. The facility called me and formally informed me of the incident and told me that the father had been called and intended to do nothing about the attack. The psychiatrist said his son "deserved" whatever he got.

Kids with minor offenses like smoking are put in there together with the most vicious and hardened offenders, some of whom are sent there instead of to prison. I think it moves them right into the criminal track.

My other experience is with Ravenswood out in Jordan. It has since changed its name and maybe has new owners. This 30 day stay for my oldest daughter helped her. It exposed her to the other kids, who had what she called "real" problems in their family, like no parents, sexual abuse, etc. She said when it came her turn to talk in circle, she had nothing to say. She had never been beaten, starved,raped, she had only been required to stay home at night and not smoke marijuana.



Kathleen Waters