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Posted by: danboyle ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:21PM

The very first sentence in that essay is a lie.

The "standing law of marriage" according to mormon doctrine is polygamy, suspended for now but will be reinstated in the millennium and in heaven. This essay claims it is "one man, one woman".

They can't even start with a true statement.....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/22/2014 12:26PM by danboyle.

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Posted by: tenaciousd ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:25PM

Whatta. Load. of. Bullshit.

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Posted by: wanderinggeek ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:31PM

WOW


This is the FIRST time I have heard it said BY the church that an angel came with a sword...

"During the third and final appearance, the angel came with a drawn sword, threatening Joseph with destruction unless he went forward and obeyed the commandment fully."



Another "WOW" They admit that he married Helen who was shy of her 15th year. But that it was "eternity only" so no sex....

I don't know if I can read this entire thing.

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Posted by: Becca ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:39PM

Funny how they say: Just shy of her 15th birthday....

they are trying to make that sound better than '14'.

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Posted by: zenmaster (nli) ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 04:05PM

Just to clarify (emphasis added):

"who was sealed to Joseph SEVERAL months before her 15th birthday"...

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Posted by: brucermalarky ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:03PM

Why did the angel have a sword? You would think that angels would have better weapons technology than bronze age desert wanderers. Like maybe a laser or even a gun.

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Posted by: Becca ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:10PM

how about just a burst of energy coming from a finger...

;-)

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Posted by: scooter ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:33PM

Strange things happen when someone pulls my finger.

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Posted by: CA girl ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:47PM

Forgetting entirely that their own scriptures say the ONLY justification for polygamy is to raise up seed unto the Lord so marrying someone and NOT having sex with them is a slap in God's face, rendering Joseph Smith a disobedient servant and fallen prophet.

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Posted by: Becca ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:38PM

Oh my,

that is hard to read, it is so full of it...

lie after lie after lie after lie...

No sources given, no evidences provided... ..

*puke*

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Posted by: ificouldhietokolob ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:38PM

From the essay:

"After receiving a revelation commanding him to practice plural marriage, Joseph Smith married multiple wives and introduced the practice to close associates."

Wait...the "revelation" came in 1843.
Smith was doing Fanny Alger in the barn in 1836.

So the claim that he began his "plural marriage" activities AFTER receiving the "revelation" commanding it is an outright lie.

Not surprising, of course, that they'd lie -- just so blatant.

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Posted by: atouchscreendarkly ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:40PM

Am I just moving further away from my old fealty, or are these essays seeming weaker and thinner the more they put out? We're there so many 'virtually absent's and 'practically's in the others?

I feel dirty even reading this one. The energy to oppose it is sapped almost entirely by the hopeless disregard for the really big, confusing issues.

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Posted by: Chicken N. Backpacks ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:41PM

Another lie: that God commanded it, "... He did not give exact instructions on how to obey the commandment."

C'mon, D&C is pretty detailed IIRC, with all that "espoused virgin..." stuff.

Hey, here's a related question: how much did Joseph personally write about how tough it was to obey the commandment? Others came up with that line later.

"Hey, Babe, I don't really want to get in your pants, but GOD told me, so let's get down to it."

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Posted by: cynthia ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 12:44PM

I couldn't read it all. The lying will never end.

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Posted by: ConcernedCitizen ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:02PM

...so the Church is admitting that as early as 1831 JS was considering the notion of polygamy. Gee, wasn't that about the time the fledgling Church was recruiting large numbers of the Cochranite devotees who specialized in open and communal sex?

Go figure.

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Posted by: Anonymous User ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:08PM

You will notice that the essay confirms that plural marriage was illegal at the point Joseph decided to practice it.

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Posted by: MormonThinker ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:09PM

I like how in a round-about way they admit Joseph had sex in some of the marriages - by segregating them in eternity only marriages and time & eternity marriages instead of saying sexual and non-sexual marriages.

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Posted by: sstitanic ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:10PM

Fanny Alger and Joseph Smith were never married.


Another during the same conversation told me that plural marriage only existed between Nauvoo and in Salt Lake because so many Mormon men were killed by mobs there were not enough men to marry.

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Posted by: brucermalarky ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:13PM

Your family member is completely right. JS and fanny alger were never married, it was an affair where he cheated on his wife. He got caught in a barn and then passed the blame off on god.

Total douche bag.

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Posted by: BeenThereDunnThatExMo ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:29PM

Yeah right...Woodruff's 1890 "Manifesto" ended polygamy in the Church.

You lying bunch of geriatric-loser-charlatan-bastards!!!

Your effing polygamy doctrine shredded my family apart and led to the rape and incest of thousands of little girls in the inter-mountain West.

You a$$holes are lower than pond-scum!!!

Or so it seems to me...

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Posted by: wanderinggeek ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:30PM

OHHH

I found a new line in here that is GREAT!

"Latter-day Saints’ motives for plural marriage were often more religious than economic or romantic."

And I TOTALLY agree!!!! Lust isn't romance.

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Posted by: brosephsmith ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:46PM

I think I will have to post a link to this article on Facebook. #sharegoodness

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Posted by: exodus ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:48PM

#tendermercies

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Posted by: sb ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 01:59PM

#lipstickonthatpig

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Posted by: moose ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 03:51PM


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Posted by: anon22 ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:02PM

It actually talks about polyandry. And they use Todd Compton's book in Sacred Lonliness as a source.

Can't wait for Mormonthink to dissect it!

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Posted by: wanderinggeek ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:11PM

It does and acts like it was only "eternal" sealings only. So "no sex!"

But they didn't mention how BY married Zina for TIME only, while she was still married.

I don't like this part on polyandry. Cause I know my DW will eat this up. And be like "See! No sex, they said so! It all works out. Sure we don't do it that way today. But god knows what he's doing!"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/22/2014 02:12PM by wanderinggeek.

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Posted by: cynthia ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 04:33PM

The article also states that "few records of the time provide details." However the essay writer is providing that detail without the evidence. If the evidence is to thin for people to assume, it is too thin for them to assert as fact.

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Posted by: wanderinggeek ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:06PM

Ok, someone help me with this.

Under the Joseph and Emma section is says
"The revelation on marriage required that a wife give her consent before her husband could enter into plural marriage."

Which we have seen before. But two paragraphs before that it says

"Emma approved, at least for a time, of four of Joseph Smith’s plural marriages in Nauvoo, and she accepted all four of those wives into her household. She may have approved of other marriages as well. But Emma likely did not know about all of Joseph’s sealings." But Emma likely DID NOT KNOW about all of the sealings.

This essay has to be a joke right? Did someone sneak in there and put this up and run?

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Posted by: moose ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 03:52PM


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Posted by: rt ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:08PM

Latter-day Saints believe that monogamy—the marriage of one man and one woman—is the Lord’s standing law of marriage.1

rt: Except that D&C 132 says differently and calls it everlasting. This is only partly offset by OD 1; church policies still facilitate polygamy.

=====

In biblical times, the Lord commanded some of His people to practice plural marriage—the marriage of one man and more than one woman.2

rt: there is no such commandment in the Bible anywhere.

=====

After receiving a revelation commanding him to practice plural marriage, Joseph Smith married multiple wives and introduced the practice to close associates.

rt: except that there is no record of such a commandment until 10+ years after Joe started boinking the maid in the barn.

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This principle was among the most challenging aspects of the Restoration—for Joseph personally and for other Church members.

rt: except that there is no record of Joe ever finding it challenging, apart from keeping it a secret from his wife and the bulk of his followers.

=====

Plural marriage tested faith and provoked controversy and opposition. Few Latter-day Saints initially welcomed the restoration of a biblical practice entirely foreign to their sensibilities.

rt: not to mention that it was against the law.

=====

But many later testified of powerful spiritual experiences that helped them overcome their hesitation and gave them courage to accept this practice.

rt: how many? As many as would always have a hard time with it? More? Less?

=====

Although the Lord commanded the adoption—and later the cessation—of plural marriage in the latter days, He did not give exact instructions on how to obey the commandment. Significant social and cultural changes often include misunderstandings and difficulties.

rt: this is what makes Mormon polygamy unique. There is no social or cultural change to compare it to.

=====

Church leaders and members experienced these challenges as they heeded the command to practice plural marriage and again later as they worked to discontinue it after Church President Wilford Woodruff issued an inspired statement known as the Manifesto in 1890, which led to the end of plural marriage in the Church.

rt: well, almost the end anyway.

=====

Many details about the early practice of plural marriage are unknown.

rt: Examples? What is meant by "details"? Why is this important? To create plausible deniability? Play dumb?

=====

Plural marriage was introduced among the early Saints incrementally, and participants were asked to keep their actions confidential.

rt: or, in other words, lie about it. From the beginning, lying was a prerequisite for the Mormon practice of polygamy.

=====

They did not discuss their experiences publicly or in writing until after the Latter-day Saints had moved to Utah and Church leaders had publicly acknowledged the practice. The historical record of early plural marriage is therefore thin: few records of the time provide details, and later reminiscences are not always reliable.

rt: except when they fit the Mormon narrative, like Joe's later reminiscences of his first visions. Also, the volume of the record was influenced by all the lying and the secrecy going on, and the destroying of the printing press of thoses who did want to document the practice.

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Some ambiguity will always accompany our knowledge about this issue. Like the participants, we “see through a glass, darkly” and are asked to walk by faith.3

rt: no ambiguity here whatsoever.

=====

The revelation on plural marriage was not written down until 1843, but its early verses suggest that part of it emerged from Joseph Smith’s study of the Old Testament in 1831.

rt: is this one of those later reminiscences?

=====

People who knew Joseph well later stated he received the revelation about that time.4

rt: Funny how they quote a report from 1878 here. What about the people who knew Joe all too well and thought he was just chsing skirt?

=====

The revelation, recorded in Doctrine and Covenants 132, states that Joseph prayed to know why God justified Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, David, and Solomon in having many wives. The Lord responded that He had commanded them to enter into the practice.5

rt: Good call from the Lord, who forgot to include this little detail in the Bible.

=====

Latter-day Saints understood that they were living in the latter days, in what the revelations called the “dispensation of the fulness of times.”6 Ancient principles—such as prophets, priesthood, and temples—would be restored to the earth. Plural marriage was one of those ancient principles.

rt: except that it wasn't. It was a cultural practice of a genocidal bronze age clan of sheep herders.

=====

Polygamy had been permitted for millennia in many cultures and religions, but, with few exceptions, was rejected in Western cultures.7

rt: and for good reasons which shall go unmentioned here.

=====

In Joseph Smith’s time, monogamy was the only legal form of marriage in the United States.

rt: and in Mexico and Canada.

=====

Joseph knew the practice of plural marriage would stir up public ire. After receiving the commandment, he taught a few associates about it, but he did not spread this teaching widely in the 1830s.8

rt: because there was no such teaching during the 1830s. Just philandering.

=====

When God commands a difficult task, He sometimes sends additional messengers to encourage His people to obey. Consistent with this pattern, Joseph told associates that an angel appeared to him three times between 1834 and 1842 and commanded him to proceed with plural marriage when he hesitated to move forward. During the third and final appearance, the angel came with a drawn sword, threatening Joseph with destruction unless he went forward and obeyed the commandment fully.9

rt: the angel with the flaming sword, the Mormon equivalent of the "God made me do it" defense.

=====

Fragmentary evidence suggests that Joseph Smith acted on the angel’s first command by marrying a plural wife, Fanny Alger, in Kirtland, Ohio, in the mid-1830s. Several Latter-day Saints who had lived in Kirtland reported decades later that Joseph Smith had married Alger, who lived and worked in the Smith household, after he had obtained her consent and that of her parents.10

rt: this is new to me, I have to look into this late reminiscence of 1903. The question, though, is how Joe pulled this off 5 years before the sealing power was restored by his buddy Eli.

=====

Little is known about this marriage, and nothing is known about the conversations between Joseph and Emma regarding Alger. After the marriage with Alger ended in separation, Joseph seems to have set the subject of plural marriage aside until after the Church moved to Nauvoo, Illinois.

rt: this seems like a good point to insert Oliver Cowdery's contemporary reminiscences of this filthy, nasty affair, no?

=====

The same revelation that taught of plural marriage was part of a larger revelation given to Joseph Smith—that marriage could last beyond death and that eternal marriage was essential to inheriting the fulness that God desires for His children. As early as 1840, Joseph Smith privately taught Apostle Parley P. Pratt that the “heavenly order” allowed Pratt and his wife to be together “for time and all eternity.”11 Joseph also taught that men like Pratt—who had remarried following the death of his first wife—could be married (or sealed) to their wives for eternity, under the proper conditions.12

rt: which is still true in the Mormon church today.

=====

The sealing of husband and wife for eternity was made possible by the restoration of priesthood keys and ordinances. On April 3, 1836, the Old Testament prophet Elijah appeared to Joseph Smith and Oliver Cowdery in the Kirtland Temple and restored the priesthood keys necessary to perform ordinances for the living and the dead, including sealing families together.13

rt: what do you know, just five years after Joe hooked up with Fanny.

=====

Marriages performed by priesthood authority could link loved ones to each other for eternity, on condition of righteousness; marriages performed without this authority would end at death.14

rt: ah yes, the old Mormon conditionality of love & marriage.

=====

Marriage performed by priesthood authority meant that the procreation of children and perpetuation of families would continue into the eternities. Joseph Smith’s revelation on marriage declared that the “continuation of the seeds forever and ever” helped to fulfill God’s purposes for His children.15 This promise was given to all couples who were married by priesthood authority and were faithful to their covenants.

rt: so having loads and loads of kids in the afterlife is still on? Mainstreaming must be over...

=====

For much of Western history, family “interest”—economic, political, and social considerations—dominated the choice of spouse. Parents had the power to arrange marriages or forestall unions of which they disapproved. By the late 1700s, romance and personal choice began to rival these traditional motives and practices.16 By Joseph Smith’s time, many couples insisted on marrying for love, as he and Emma did when they eloped against her parents’ wishes.

rt: An interesting illustration of Joe's true attitude toward marriage and family relations.

=====

Latter-day Saints’ motives for plural marriage were often more religious than economic or romantic. Besides the desire to be obedient, a strong incentive was the hope of living in God’s presence with family members.

rt: not just hope, Joe promised his brainwashed minions that they would be saved if they sacrificed their daughters and wives to him.

BTW, my blood pressure is rising.

=====

In the revelation on marriage, the Lord promised participants “crowns of eternal lives” and “exaltation in the eternal worlds.”17 Men and women, parents and children, ancestors and progeny were to be “sealed” to each other—their commitment lasting into the eternities, consistent with Jesus’s promise that priesthood ordinances performed on earth could be “bound in heaven.”18

rt: and if that isn't enough of an incentive, there's always the threat of destruction.

=====

The first plural marriage in Nauvoo took place when Louisa Beaman and Joseph Smith were sealed in April 1841.19 Joseph married many additional wives and authorized other Latter-day Saints to practice plural marriage. The practice spread slowly at first. By June 1844, when Joseph died, approximately 29 men and 50 women had entered into plural marriage, in addition to Joseph and his wives. When the Saints entered the Salt Lake Valley in 1847, at least 196 men and 521 women had entered into plural marriages.20 Participants in these early plural marriages pledged to keep their involvement confidential, though they anticipated a time when the practice would be publicly acknowledged.

Nevertheless, rumors spread. A few men unscrupulously used these rumors to seduce women to join them in an unauthorized practice sometimes referred to as “spiritual wifery.”

rt: how different Joe's disgusting psychological manipulation was.

=====

When this was discovered, the men were cut off from the Church.21 The rumors prompted members and leaders to issue carefully worded denials that denounced spiritual wifery and polygamy but were silent about what Joseph Smith and others saw as divinely mandated “celestial” plural marriage.22

rt: "carefully worded denials" = bullshitese for "lying"

=====

The statements emphasized that the Church practiced no marital law other than monogamy while implicitly leaving open the possibility that individuals, under direction of God’s living prophet, might do so.23

rt: and more lying.

=====

During the era in which plural marriage was practiced, Latter-day Saints distinguished between sealings for time and eternity and sealings for eternity only. Sealings for time and eternity included commitments and relationships during this life, generally including the possibility of sexual relations. Eternity-only sealings indicated relationships in the next life alone.

rt: interesting how convenient little undocumented details just pop up when you need them, the thin-ness of the historical record notwithstanding.

=====

Evidence indicates that Joseph Smith participated in both types of sealings. The exact number of women to whom he was sealed in his lifetime is unknown because the evidence is fragmentary.24 Some of the women who were sealed to Joseph Smith later testified that their marriages were for time and eternity, while others indicated that their relationships were for eternity alone.25

rt: cut the BS, there were 30+ wives and he had sex with a bunch of them.

=====

Most of those sealed to Joseph Smith were between 20 and 40 years of age at the time of their sealing to him. The oldest, Fanny Young, was 56 years old.

rt: this would be a good point for a neat table, wouldn't you think?

=====

The youngest was Helen Mar Kimball, daughter of Joseph’s close friends Heber C. and Vilate Murray Kimball, who was sealed to Joseph several months before her 15th birthday.

rt: in other words, she was 14. Pity that they don't include the fact that Joe already approached her when she was 11, nor the disgusting predatory tactics he used the break the Kimball family.

=====

Marriage at such an age, inappropriate by today’s standards, was legal in that era, and some women married in their mid-teens.26

rt: BS, plural marriage was not legal and the average age of marriage was not 14, nor was the age gap between Helen and Joe normal in those days. He was a pervert by today's and contemporary standards.

=====

Helen Mar Kimball spoke of her sealing to Joseph as being “for eternity alone,” suggesting that the relationship did not involve sexual relations.27 After Joseph’s death, Helen remarried and became an articulate defender of him and of plural marriage.28

rt: keep defending the indefensible, you morons. Jesus, those brainwashed fools would still gladly offer their teenage daughters to any conman calling himself prophet today. There is plenty of testimony from Helen and others in her position that they saw the whole thing as a sacrifice, a price to pay. But let's ignore that and pretend that this is all just dandy.

=====

Following his marriage to Louisa Beaman and before he married other single women, Joseph Smith was sealed to a number of women who were already married.29 Neither these women nor Joseph explained much about these sealings, though several women said they were for eternity alone.30 Other women left no records, making it unknown whether their sealings were for time and eternity or were for eternity alone.

rt: oh please, so much more is known about these cases. Lying bastards.

=====

There are several possible explanations for this practice.

rt: I bet you don't wanna hear mine...

=====

These sealings may have provided a way to create an eternal bond or link between Joseph’s family and other families within the Church.31 These ties extended both vertically, from parent to child, and horizontally, from one family to another.

rt: this is actually true: they used polygamy to build an inner circle of church leadership that would be connected through kinship and marriage. It's an ancient way of keeping power and money out of the hands of the masses. It's concommitant practices are nepotism and inbreeding, the effects of both of which are visible in Utah society to this day.

=====

Today such eternal bonds are achieved through the temple marriages of individuals who are also sealed to their own birth families, in this way linking families together. Joseph Smith’s sealings to women already married may have been an early version of linking one family to another. In Nauvoo, most if not all of the first husbands seem to have continued living in the same household with their wives during Joseph’s lifetime,

rt: if they weren't sent away on a mission, that is.

=====

and complaints about these sealings with Joseph Smith are virtually absent from the documentary record.32

rt: how convenient. Maybe because the hubbies in question also got fresh booty as a reward for their loyalty? On another note, I seem to remember a story about PP Pratt and a Hector McLean? And what about Orson Pratt, didn't he have a serious falling-out with Joe over his wife?

=====

These sealings may also be explained by Joseph’s reluctance to enter plural marriage because of the sorrow it would bring to his wife Emma.

rt: such a considerate husband, my heart melts.

=====

He may have believed that sealings to married women would comply with the Lord’s command without requiring him to have normal marriage relationships.33

rt: why would he think that, if the Lord's command required him to take only virgins?

=====

This could explain why, according to Lorenzo Snow, the angel reprimanded Joseph for having “demurred” on plural marriage even after he had entered into the practice.34 After this rebuke, according to this interpretation, Joseph returned primarily to sealings with single women.

rt: or Joe couldn't remember what lie he told when to whom and winged it, and Lorenzo, who liked young booty just as much as his prophet (remember Minnie?), was willing to believe anything.

=====

Another possibility is that, in an era when life spans were shorter than they are today, faithful women felt an urgency to be sealed by priesthood authority.

rt: so many possibilities, so much speculation, so little evidence yet the obvious conclusion is carefully avoided.

=====

Several of these women were married either to non-Mormons or former Mormons, and more than one of the women later expressed unhappiness in their present marriages. Living in a time when divorce was difficult to obtain, these women may have believed a sealing to Joseph Smith would give them blessings they might not otherwise receive in the next life.35

rt: PAAS - Polygamy As A Service, hahaha.

=====

The women who united with Joseph Smith in plural marriage risked reputation and self-respect in being associated with a principle so foreign to their culture and so easily misunderstood by others.

rt: ironically, they risked the same at Joe's evil hands if they refused his advances. Man, what a despicable narcissist he must have been. If anyone deserved to be summarily shot, it was Joseph Smith

=====

“I made a greater sacrifice than to give my life,” said Zina Huntington Jacobs, “for I never anticipated again to be looked upon as an honorable woman.” Nevertheless, she wrote, “I searched the scripture & by humble prayer to my Heavenly Father I obtained a testimony for myself.”36

rt: was she the one married to Henry? How did that go? And then pawned off to Briggie after horny Joe's demise? Mormon polygamy, an eternal spring of morality and virtue.

=====

After Joseph’s death, most of the women sealed to him moved to Utah with the Saints, remained faithful Church members, and defended both plural marriage and Joseph.37

rt: and many moved to Briggie's harem because getting married to one prophet just doesn't cut it for those eternal blessings.

=====

Plural marriage was difficult for all involved. For Joseph Smith’s wife Emma, it was an excruciating ordeal. Records of Emma’s reactions to plural marriage are sparse; she left no firsthand accounts, making it impossible to reconstruct her thoughts.

rt: not impossible, just unpalatable.

=====

Joseph and Emma loved and respected each other deeply.

rt: my assessment: they were two fraudsters that were doomed to stay together for better or for worse.

=====

After he had entered into plural marriage, he poured out his feelings in his journal for his “beloved Emma,” whom he described as “undaunted, firm and unwavering, unchangeable, affectionate Emma.”

rt: that's what all wife abusers do, first treat their spouse like crap, than cry crocodile tears and beg for forgiveness.

=====

After Joseph’s death, Emma kept a lock of his hair in a locket she wore around her neck.38

rt: how touching.

=====

Emma approved, at least for a time, of four of Joseph Smith’s plural marriages in Nauvoo, and she accepted all four of those wives into her household. She may have approved of other marriages as well.39 But Emma likely did not know about all of Joseph’s sealings.40 She vacillated in her view of plural marriage, at some points supporting it and at other times denouncing it.

rt: like all women who stay with their abusers, she may have hoped against hope that next time, things would be different... Also, as long as she stayed with Joe, the money would keep pouring.

====

In the summer of 1843, Joseph Smith dictated the revelation on marriage, a lengthy and complex text containing both glorious promises and stern warnings, some directed at Emma.41 The revelation instructed women and men that they must obey God’s law and commands in order to receive the fulness of His glory.

The revelation on marriage required that a wife give her consent before her husband could enter into plural marriage.42 Nevertheless, toward the end of the revelation, the Lord said that if the first wife “receive not this law”—the command to practice plural marriage—the husband would be “exempt from the law of Sarah,” presumably the requirement that the husband gain the consent of the first wife before marrying additional women.43

rt: what do you mean, "presumably"? You mean it's not in the Bible? Who knew!

=====

After Emma opposed plural marriage, Joseph was placed in an agonizing dilemma, forced to choose between the will of God and the will of his beloved Emma. He may have thought Emma’s rejection of plural marriage exempted him from the law of Sarah.

rt: more likely that he was just a selfish, cheating bastard.

=====

Her decision to “receive not this law” permitted him to marry additional wives without her consent.

rt: too convenient. Isn't it marvelous (if you're a Mormon man).

=====

Because of Joseph’s early death and Emma’s decision to remain in Nauvoo and not discuss plural marriage after the Church moved west, many aspects of their story remain known only to the two of them.


I'll leave the rest to the board, I'm fed up with it for now.

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Posted by: exodus ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:30PM

Great analysis... thanks!

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Posted by: Doubting Thomas ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:12PM

It is amazing how deceptive TSCC can be all while trying to tell the truth.

You cannot make this shit up.

So now, on the official website of the church, there is proof that Joseph Smith was exactly who we said he was...

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Posted by: Bamboozled ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:13PM

3..... 2..... 1......

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Posted by: verilyverily ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:18PM

It's God's fault that they were scr*wing everyone in sight. They didn't want to but God didn't make it clear how they were supposed to carry out his order for plural marriage. God MADE them do it. Has JS ever taken any responsibility for anything in this F*CKED CULT?

"all while trying to tell the truth" - doubting thomas - just so you know the CULT has NEVER tried to tell the truth! NEVER and NEVER will.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/22/2014 02:24PM by verilyverily.

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Posted by: Facsimile 3 ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:20PM

Helen Mar Kimball's statement about "for eternity alone" was taken WILDLY out of context. It was a line from a poem she wrote mourning her entry into plural marriage. It seems VERY clear to me, that she meant that she was only taking this step for an eternal reward and had nothing to do with the type of sealing. If it were just an eternal seal (i.e. symbolic only), then there would have been no need for the pitying angels to weep, etc.


I thought through this life my time will be my own
The step I now am taking’s for eternity alone,
No one need be the wiser, through time I shall be free,
And as the past hath been the future still will be.
To my guileless heart all free from worldly care
And full of blissful hopes and youthful visions rare
The world seamed bright the thret’ning clouds were kept
From sight and all looked fair...

...but pitying angels wept.
They saw my youthful friends grow shy and cold.
And poisonous darts from sland’rous tongues were hurled,
Untutor’d heart in thy gen’rous sacrafise,
Thou dids’t not weigh the cost nor know the bitter price;
Thy happy dreams all o’er thou’st doom’d also to be
Bar’d out from social scenes by this thy destiny,
And o’er thy sad’nd mem’ries of sweet departed joys
Thy sicken’d heart will brood and imagine future woes,
And like a fetter’d bird with wild and longing heart,
Thou’lt dayly pine for freedom and murmor at thy lot;

But could’st thou see the future & view that glorious crown,
Awaiting you in Heaven you would not weep nor mourn.
Pure and exalted was thy father’s aim, he saw
A glory in obeying this high celestial law,
For to thousands who’ve died without the light
I will bring eternal joy & make thy crown more bright.
I’d been taught to reveire the Prophet of God
And receive every word as the word of the Lord,
But had this not come through my dear father’s mouth,
I should ne’r have received it as God’s sacred truth.

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Posted by: wanderinggeek ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:40PM

The first few lines of the poem are heart wrenching.

Does she sound like she is ok with all this???? NO!

"I thought through this life my time will be my own"

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Posted by: brucermalarky ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:40PM

Wait, is this is the evidence they use that some marriages were for eternity alone?

It's obvious she is saying that she is only making the decision to whore herself out to joe is because she is focused on the eternal reward. Not that the marriage is for eternity and not for time.

Please tell me they have better evidence that joe didn't have sex with all his wives.

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Posted by: Facsimile 3 ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:50PM

This was the only evidence they presented for Helen Mar Kimball.


The essay also vaguely claims, "...while others indicated that their relationships were for eternity alone." The cited source is Brian C. Hales, but I do not have his book and cannot confirm the basis for that claim. He could possibly be referring to sealings that took place after Joseph's death, or it may be that some of the polyandrous sealings were for eternity only. Bear in mind, however, that there is NOTHING in that arrangement which indicates there was no sex in this life. It seems like the eternal sealing would supercede the time-only sealing, thereby bringing "benefits" in this life and the next.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/22/2014 02:51PM by Facsimile 3.

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Posted by: greensmythe ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 03:58PM

Despicable. Twisting the phrase of a girl who is in obvious pain and denial that her father sold her out to a con man. If this was a show wedding only she would not be in tears. But they take one ambiguous phrase and use it to burnish her abusers reputation and stab her in the back.

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Posted by: greensmythe ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 04:05PM

"carefully worded denial" TM intellectual reserve inc 2014

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Posted by: sherlock ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:22PM

"But many later testified of powerful SPIRITUAL experiences that helped them overcome their hesitation and gave them courage to accept this practice."

Methinks they simply misspelt the word 'sexual'

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Posted by: Facsimile 3 ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 04:01PM

Totally!

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Posted by: brucermalarky ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:23PM

This is so unbelievable it makes me want to beat my head against the wall. Church leaders time after time denied the practice of polygamy while they were doing it. It looks like this is what they are going to use as their excuse as to why they did that, apparently they never lied at all:

A few men unscrupulously used these rumors to seduce women to join them in an unauthorized practice sometimes referred to as “spiritual wifery.” When this was discovered, the men were cut off from the Church.21 The rumors prompted members and leaders to issue carefully worded denials that denounced spiritual wifery and polygamy but were silent about what Joseph Smith and others saw as divinely mandated “celestial” plural marriage.22 The statements emphasized that the Church practiced no marital law other than monogamy while implicitly leaving open the possibility that individuals, under direction of God’s living prophet, might do so.23

Are you serious? They issued "carefully worded denials" but were silent about plural marriage? How can they say that with a straight face?

How about Joseph Smith speaking publically a month before his death:

"What a thing is it for a man to be accused of having seven wives, when I can only find one?"

He had an affidavit signed by like 50 people who all swore that they were not taking multiple wives that the JS had only ONE damn wife!

How can they explain it all away with that total complete lie?

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Posted by: Airizona ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:26PM

Please someone archive this web page and print this so we don't lose it if it gets retracted.

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Posted by: maeve ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:41PM

"By June 1844, when Joseph died, approximately 29 men and 50 women had entered into plural marriage, in addition to Joseph and his wives."

So some of these men were practicing polygamy without multiple wives or some of these women were married to more than one husband. Their numbers don't add up. (surprise)

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Posted by: Anonymous User ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:51PM

Great catch

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Posted by: Eric3 ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 02:47PM

I was wondering how they were going to square it with historical accounts.

The section with "Joseph Smith was sealed to a number of women who were already married" illustrates how: they concede facts then paint them in a favorable light. Likewise with the underage women, total number, polygamy not OK but then OK but then not OK, etc.

It's well done PR. It pretends to reasonableness by not denying established facts. It then polishes the hell out of that. It's excellent in its use of words and phrases that say almost nothing. And gets top marks for things not mentioned.

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Posted by: shannon ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 03:05PM

What kind of panic and chaos must be occuring behind closed doors at the COB for the Big 15 to even release such an essay? Oh to be a fly on the wall ...

;o)

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Posted by: Anonymous User ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 03:12PM

This essay HAS to have been written by a rabid anti mormon.
It's priceless.

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Posted by: canadianfriend ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 04:15PM

Take screen shots of this essay because it's likely to disappear soon. I don't think the brethren realize how incriminating it is.

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Posted by: rt ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 04:23PM

canadianfriend Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Take screen shots of this essay because it's
> likely to disappear soon.

The first thing I did...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/22/2014 04:23PM by rt.

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Posted by: seeking peace ( )
Date: October 22, 2014 04:17PM

That is a lot of words to say "Joseph was screwing girls in the barn."

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