I have not been in Utah since 1990, so I don't know the nature of this thing called "Fontrunner." I think it is a part of Utah Transit Authority. Anyway, a recent facebook post states:

"For my Utah friends that have ridden the front-runner:
I've ridden it to Salt Lake and back twice and not once have they checked my ticket...I really want to know why?"

Comment in response:

"Actually I think it is because everyone in Utah is so honest they don't need to check the tickets. Their motto is "ride with honor"."

It really has nothing to do with honestly - but economics.

Legally you can only ride if you have purchased a ticket. If you ride without a ticket and are caught you are charged a fine. It would be expensive to hire someone to check for a ticket on every car of every train so they spot check and assess fines if they find cheaters.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/28/2013 09:45AM by The Oncoming Storm - bc.

Not so special. There is usually no one to check tickets on my local commuter rail here in the Bible Belt. Does that mean PRotestants are all honest, too?

Sometimes, during large events, especially ones that attract a young crowd, there will be cops on the train to keep things orderly and to check tickets. Other than that...

...Mormons must not be too honest since there are locks on the temple dressing room lockers. And you always need to show your ticket before you can get in the temple.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/28/2013 09:54AM by Stray Mutt.

It does mean a lot to a Mormon to be able to return change to a cashier who gave too much, or to pick up somebody's lost pocket item and return it to them. They practically brag about this kind of behavior. But true "honesty," particularly with oneself, is rare among Inter-Mountain Mormons, and rare enough among Mormons of any region. They learn in a slow and insidious way that it's okay to bilk people for money, and it's okay to lie to people about embarrassing things. I think that's true in most bishop's interviews. But they are particularly good about lying to people about Mormonism itself, especially when it comes to the weird culty doctrines, like Kolob and black people.

Utahns aren't any more honest than the citizens of any other state, but riding the train without a ticket? Probably not. Initiating an Affinity fraud or Ponzi Scheme, now that's where Utahns take the lead.

Once, driving thru Ew-tah.... we left relatives home where we visited Very Early in the morning....

Needed gas at a one-horse town; pulled up to the pump, but no one there.
I pumped the gas we needed, shoved $ thru/under the door.
I felt good about that, I have NO IDEA whether that was accident/oversight or SOP.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/28/2013 10:49AM by guynoirprivateeye.

Surely you jest!

sometimes the transit police will walk the aisles checking tickets.

If you do not have a valid ticket then woe unto you.

mortgage fraud capital of the US.

I've rode trains/subways in other states and countries where they don't check every passenger's ticket, so I don't think its a uniquely Utah/Mormon thing. Wishful thinking on their part though.

If Mormons are so honest, why do they have to participate in tithing settlements every year? Why do they have to have temple recommend interviews?

Another point. Even if Mormons are 100% honest with their trax fare, half the population is still not Mormon. Wouldn't they still have to check people's tickets simply due to the fact that half the people on the train are not actually Mormon?

Many Mormons are only honest when they think someone is watching.

http://deseretnews.com/article/865583513/Social-experiment-shows-Utah-one-of-least-honest-states-in-country.html

specifically, buses, subways (u-bahn) and street trolleys (s-bahn). You see signs everywhere about not getting caught "riding black", i.e. without a ticket. Spot checking of tickets does happen, but in all the time I was there, it happened to me one time.

The DeutscheBahn (federal railroad) does operate differently, but mainly because, if necessary, you can purchase your ticket from the conductor once on board.

This is pretty typical, particularly when you have a large ridership with monthly/annual passes who won't be buying a ticket every time they get on the train.

Here in Seattle / PNW, we have an 'all-transit' card, the ORCA
One Regional Card for All.

It's good on ferries (water kind), busses. When you get on, you pass your ORCA thru a reader, get a 2 hour transfer.

On lite -rail, & 'super-swift' busses (3 doors), you're supposed to pay before U get onboard (standing/paying slows the trips)... but they have 'ambassitors' who travel & check sometimes.

They say their Church is True, that's a Lie. Self delusion, not so big a deal though.

They train their missionaries with lies about the Church then convert people with those lies.

That's pretty serious stuff there, all in Utah.

Lying for The Lord is happening in a big way in Utah!

I ride Trax of Frontrunner maybe 5 or 6 times a month. I have had ticket checks maybe 1 time out of 6, usually at the platform rather than on the train.

I used to commute SLC to Ogden for a couple years back in the 1990s. Taking the train to Ogden is soooo nice. You can read, watch the scenery, count the number of backyard trampolines...

What's up with Mormons and trampolines, anyway?

Almost every home he has looked at--on line and otherwise--has listed "trampoline" as part of the deal. He thought that was "interesting."

Twisted Mormon birth control? A trampoline.

They're eternal families anyways and you can't get ahead, buy a trampoline.

When I used to ride trax and frontrunner I would get my ticket checked about half of the time. It isn't the honor system and UTA isn't doing this because they think Mormons are honest. It isn't well wishing and it isn't naive. If you ride trax or frontrunner with any regularity and you don't pay for your ticket you will get fined. They don't need someone to check every time for that to happen.

yah, well there was not much of any enforcement to check for fare stubs on the lite rail commuter train either when it started up........
BUT THAT'S NOT THE WAY IT IS NOW.

SO, How do you think things are going to go on front runner in a few more years?...??????

Utah is a stronghold of honesty and virtue, just ask a MORmON !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Q6B-ROmZ6A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKjTRWJgKhY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrB2nIsPajk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NxEf1-3RJg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUzpAdrIT0g
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1H2RIdFqXE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbwsI3PPTE8


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1H2RIdFqXE&list=PLQdxP81q-zKj8SJHE389WcYaqROuX7CFf



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/28/2013 04:55PM by lucky.

? What is Frontrunner?

Different route than Trax, but same technology/vehicles?

Trax is light rail, which is similar to a street car, and frontrunner is pretty much just a commuter train.

(pls pardon ALL the questions, I'm 'one of those' (railfans)

does frontrunner go to say....Provo? Is it over a former UP or other main-line tracks/route?

Utah needs a corridor from Boise/ I.Falls thru to St. G... it would save lotsabucks!

former SLC rails: UP, Denver & Rio Grande... Was Western Pacific or Southern Pacific ever there? Then there's the Utah Central, I believe.

gotta read up on it (PUN!)

Haha, don't worry. Ask as many questions as you want and I'll try to answer the best I can. :)

So, I think it goes down to Provo now. Either the light rail line does or the frontrunner does, I can't remember. I know that the frontrunner goes all the way up to Ogden though.

The light rail was built mostly over former train tracks outside of SLC, but I think they had to custom build most of the line inside of the city.

I've rode TRAX before with a valid ticket and don't ever remember being asked to show the ticket. However, I believe the fine for being caught without one is 150 dollars. Transit police may walk in at any time and ask any person for a ticket. For the sake of argument, let's say that the ticket is 5 dollars. You would have to not get caught 30 times in a row before you would break even should you be caught and be forced to pay 150 dollars. One, two, or even 5 times I could understand, but 30 in a row is quite risky and risky enough that I will just pay the 5 or whatever every time.