Is there one of the big 15 who you fear? I mean, if he were take over the helm he would make life miserable for the rest of us.

My vote is Bednar. He gives me the creeps and for some reason I feel he has no soul. And is very, very driven. He reminds me of Hitler without the charisma. I think he is driven to take over the church and rule and reign with blood and horror. Every time I hear him speak I shudder; he has a huge fan base. The gullible TBMs love him.

I agree - Bednar. Too militant and too young. He's going to be around a long, long time.

None. They should fear us.

Exactly, hangar18. I say, "the crazier, the better."

Afraid of Bedwetter? Really? I know he's a Dark Lord and all, but still...

None of them can touch me, and I don't fear any of them; never have, actually. How, specifically, can he make your lives miserable?

That's true. I'm still a newbie exmo. But he should scare the crap out of TBMs. He's like something from a Stephen King novel. I wonder if he ever wears a clown outfit?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/31/2014 07:10PM by Tom Padley.

for 15 years. Don't even know who he is so watched the first few seconds of a talk of his (that's all I could handle. Mormon GA speech irritates the hell out of me). He didn't seem as creepy as, say, a Holland or a BKP but, what do I know?

Specifically, Bednar could outdo Oaks by commanding parents to cease all contact with their inactive, unbelieving, or resigned children.

It's a natural law, you know. Somebody's got to enforce it!

Bednar already gave his after-further-review talk stating that children aren't saved unconditionally through sealed parents:

"The statements by Joseph Smith and Orson F. Whitney are construed by some members of the Church to mean that wayward children unconditionally receive the blessings of salvation because of and through the faithfulness of parents. However, this interpretation is moderated by the fact that the most complete account of the Prophet’s sermon was not available to Church historians at the time . . . Joseph Smith is shown to have qualified his statement to make the promised blessings conditional upon the obedience of the children:

“When a father and mother of a family have [been sealed], their children WHO HAVE NOT TRANSGRESSED are secured by the seal wherewith the Parents have been sealed. And this is the Oath of God unto our Father Abraham and this doctrine shall stand forever.”"

(I changed italics to caps to keep the emphasis)


https://www.lds.org/ensign/2014/03/faithful-parents-and-wayward-children-sustaining-hope-while-overcoming-misunderstanding?lang=eng

Jpt beat me to it. I get nothing out of that talk aside from divine tentacles.

I find it peculiar that my mother, who isn't nearly as judgmental as my father, says she really likes Bednar's conference talks. I think he appears thoughtful to her.

We should fear none. You give them too much power if you fear any of them.

I think Bednar is the biggest threat to Mormon women. Just look at the way his wife worships his misogyny.

Bednar's dad was a non member while Bednar was growing up. He was super serious guy always and straight laced. I know people who know the family of origin. His mom's side is pioneer stock.
I was hoping his background would make him more tolerant.

The one I fear most is Packer.

I have no fear of anything or anyone. As an exmormon, I would welcome Bednar, Holland, Packer, or any of them to become cult leader in chief. I would then wish them to do whatever it takes to dismantle the entire scam.

Actually I do not fear any of them.

However at this time I believe that Uchtdorf is probably the most dangerous.

IF I was going to be afraid of any of them, it would be Bednar. I think he might have space alien DNA ;)

Do not worry about BKKKP. When he passes beyond the handshake sheet into the Celestial room, the Morg will flush him down the toilet like they did with McConkie.

Guaranteed.

Fear? Why would anyone fear those guys? They run a silly religion and have no "power" beyond what we cede to them.

Bednar indeed appears soulless - almost sociopathic, in some strange way I can't put my finger on. Is that a reason to "fear" him? Again, only insofar as we cede our personal sovereignty. If we cede none, he's just another impotent would-be control freak, and for that reason, inconsequential.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/31/2014 10:57PM by Tal Bachman.

Before joining the church, I had never heard of any of these clowns. They simply DO NOT MATTER in the real world.

If any of them appeared on my front porch (without having called first), I would bid them farewell just as I do the mishies. And if they got uppity and refused to go (or worse, started the "dusting of shoes" nonsense, I would turn the garden hose on them.)

I don't personally believe that the shoe-dusting has any power - but THEY do. So in their petty little minds they are intentionally causing me terrible harm. THAT deserves a hosing.

I would SO love to cut Bednar down to size: "What was your name again, Dude? Oh - nice haircut!"

We have absolutely nothing to fear from these geriatric jerks.

Well said catnip. I asked a friend of mine if she'd heard of Thomas Monson, Packer et al.

Response - blank stare and shaking of the head.

She knew the 'real' religious leaders though, including some that I'd not heard of on the fringes of the religious world.

Briggy

none - why would i fear or care about any of them?

i don't mean to be disrespectful to your question. it's just i honestly think that there's no need to fear any of them.

don't give them power. they are psychic vampires if anything. they prey on fear.

darth jesus Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> none - why would i fear or care about any of them?
>
>
> i don't mean to be disrespectful to your question.
> it's just i honestly think that there's no need to
> fear any of them.
>
> don't give them power. they are psychic vampires
> if anything. they prey on fear.


As I see it, they do pose a real threat, albeit indirectly. Because they control the lives and minds of a great many people, especially in Utah, they do indeed wield a great deal of power over those peoples' seonse of morality and hence the extent to which they will do anything they are told. The G-15 run the state. Whatever they believe- as far as school curricula, alcohol regulations, health care funding, racial segregation, treatment of rape victims, and on and on- gets done. And the LDS church us set up so that there really is no mechanism for putting a damper on anything the head guy says. The whole basis of the church is the idea that he has direct contact with God. The G-15 all know individually that they do not get feedbackfrom God, but they all fully believe that the next guy does. So when the president starts saying that he has in fact gotten instructions from god regarding anything, the rest of the pack will automatically follow whatever he says.

It is not to be assumed that any of this would happen by deception on the part of the head guy. No, the president would likewise come to believe, by virtue of the office, that his every thought and gut feeling and world view is a manifestation of God's mind. And there is no way to stop him.

I wouldn't know an of them if I fell over them in the street. I have been out of tscc too long. Fear them? NOOOO! They have as much power over me as I let them and that is zilch now.

I'm not really afraid or intimidated by any of them, although Monson always did give me the creeps. I hated his stories while everyone loved them, and finally felt like I had to accept him when he got sustained, the relationship went way up until I got emotionally abused on a mission, and personally wrote him a letter and surprise, surprise he's too busy caring about all the other "ones" to care about "one" in Cali! Yeah, the annoying people who are like "OH my gosh! I get to shake Elder so and so's hand!" bug me, it's like, "they are human, aren't you supposed to worship God?"

Yeah, Catnip. People, even ex-Mormons, forget how utterly unremarkable a lot of these guys are without their church status. Take Mormonism away from Gordon Hinckley, and he seems like the semi-retired, resident caretaker/firewood guy at some obscure RV tenting site in Dumptruck, Arizona: an utterly average guy doing an utterly average job. He also always struck me as something of a perv, too, so in my imagination, he'd also have the stack of old Playboys on the back of his RV toilet.

Thomas Monson, by all accounts, was an egomaniac (I say "was", because he's out of commission now). The egomania would have stood him in good stead climbing up the business ladder, but his boring and vapid personality would not have. He would probably have just been middle management at Kinko's or something, and a guy who everyone else had a hard time working with.

Ezra Benson - yes, an exception. Clearly a striking figure who seemed destined to make an impact wherever he went, for better or for worse. But so many of these other guys over the years were just...blah. Even Spencer Kimball, without the church, would have remained a smalltown insurance agent and Rotarian, and certainly, we would never have heard of him.

Like some of the posters here I have been out of the church for a long time, don't live in Utah (or even the USA for that matter) and have no TBM family or friends. Joseph Fielding Smith was the prophet when I left and until I discovered this site a couple of weeks ago I had no idea who the current prophet was or any of the GA's.

I can understand that TSSC rules the roost in Utah but it holds no sway anywhere else in the world. If people have heard of it at all they think merely of polygamy or the WoW. You don't need to fear what is irrelevant to the rest of the almost 7 billion people in the world! (Minus the 15 million Mormons of course)

Perhaps we should hope for the most dangerous one as he may speed up the meltdown of the whole thing,

I probably shouldn't have used the word "fear." I don't fear any of them at all. They are all a joke to me.

But what I was getting at is who would cause us exmos the most concern I guess. I live in the middle of the morridor. I am surrounded by TBMs and my family is 90% TBM. I have lots of TBM friends on Facebook. Most of the time they leave me alone and seem to be afraid of me for fear that maybe I know something they refuse to grapple with in their lives.

Most of the leaders of TSCC I find to be completely harmless, the church just limps along. Monson says nothing, the morgbots basically do nothing of concern. But I see a Bednar type of personality as someone who could command the members to do about anything and they would do it. If his militant personality were to take the helm I see lots more conflict from TBM family, shunning, etc. I don't think BKP has enough life in him to do anything that would galvanize the members. But Bednar...is one scary person. He seriously reminds me of a Hitler type of personality but he lacks charisma, still the TBMs have morgasms over him. He seems to be their favorite already.

I don't happen to fear any of them. If you want to know who will damage Mormonism the most, it is probably Bednar, who is the reincarnated Packer.

The hypothetical one that will advise the local leader in my area to double down on me and my family.

I say we steal the DNA of Boyd and Bednar and merge them together, two GA's with Sexual hang ups I'm pretty sure we'd create Lady GAGA.

None of them have any impact on my life.

Been there done that, not doing it anymore!

Only believers give a rats arse about any of them anyhow.