I saw this brought up on another board and I'm curious. There have been a number of ponzi schemes run by mormons. Does the church ex people who are convicted of these kid of scams? My guess is that the church doesn't care, but I don't actually have any experience with this.

If they did, they wouldn't be able to claim 15 million members.

No. I personally know men serving jail time for being convicted of fraud (ponzi scheme). He was never disciplined or ex-ed from the lovely organization. His parents were not convicted but everyone knew that they were high up partners in the scheme and were wealthy because of it.

The members who have nothing to show for their investment in the ward still go up each sunday and say howdy and slap them on the back and talk and laugh with them. They should be slapping them in the face and demanding their money back.

Mormons like to be victims...it's their happy place.

And did he go on a non-proselyting mission to Hawaii? This kind of stuff fascinates me.

No. Those people are somehow given a "Noble" status. Seriously. The bigger the scam the more important these people are in the Mormon culture.

If part of their ill gotten gains goes to tithing the TSCC won't touch them.

TSCC is a fraud in and of itself.

Check here for some info. This is a good summary. Not everything is black and white and sometimes there are circumstances that result in a different outcome.


Scroll down to: Qualifying Offences. Mandatory disciplinary council
Fraud is listed under #1

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disciplinary_council

Funny how they don't seem to be willing to follow their own directives.

amen to all the "No's" above;

I was a victim of a TBM fraud, and one of closest ward friends (a couple) had a few $100 k stolen by another member;

outcome/result/consequences from the Corp: Nothing

It depends on how much money the fraudster makes and how much tithing revenue he/she brings to the cult. Just look at John Swallow for example.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/31/2014 01:48PM by hangar18.

The general answer is: any felony conviction results in automatic excommunication. After they serve their sentence and are active for a year they can apply to re-join the LDS Church. Except for murder.

There have been convicted child molesters with felony convictions that were never excommunicated.

Not true. Top leadership in my ward was busted for criminal al fraudulent schemes, theft, etc. felonies. They went to jail but were not excommunicated.

Excommunications are willy nilly as far as I can tell. If you're a pain or an embarrassment--out you go.

A relative of mine was convicted of felony embezzlement, perpetrated the crime over years. He was not excommunicated but he was disfellowshiped.

It can't x itself

The EX-CoJCoLDS

Well if did they'd have to ex themselves as well!

Stealing from ordinary people is not that big of a deal, not compared to claiming women are human beings or gays should be allowed civil rights. Stealing from the church, well, that's an automatic excommunication.

Years ago I knew a guy that pled guilty in federal court to fraud charges, and did a few years in prison. When he went away, his wife would tell anyone that would listen that hubby was innocent and the proof was he still had his temple recommend when he went to prison. Now, I don't know that to be true but I can certainly see some bishop believing this guy's line of BS - he was very good at it - that he was innocent, it was his partner, etc. Or it could be that the wife was lying her ass off too.

I looked them up a while ago and both hubby and wife were in trouble with the feds on tax issues. But they probably still have temple recommends.

Men are usually needed to fill priesthood roles. So, no. But, if a women was involved in fraud.....

The Brethren have a "friends and family" rule, meaning, if you are a "friend" (which usually means a super-wealthy Member who gives money to the Church beyond tithing or his family), or a family member, you can rape your own daughter, still 10 million dollars from the Members, kill dogs and cats in your spare time, run an underage sex ring, and YOU WILL NEVER BE EXED!!!!! You might be put on "probation" but you'll never...ever...be exed.

No, they call them to be MPs. They are already thrilled that they can lie and keeps secrets.

No, they baptize them.

To be fair, I don't think many religions in general "ex" their adherents based on felonies or other crimes. In fact religious organizations try to sell their snake oil in prisons. Think about it...it's a perfect place to recruit. Many prisoners have mental disorders already. They are just concentrated in one area, so you just save money on gas trying to find them wandering the streets and sleeping on park benches.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/31/2014 11:36PM by orange.

Our neighbor committed fraud, big-time (the scandal made all the newspapers), and caused 4 other neighbors to lose their houses. They had mortgaged their houses to buy into the fraudulent business. When everyone had to move away, the bishop and his wife gave a big open house for--no, not the neighbors who had been victimized--but for the neighbor who had perpetrated the scheme.

Fraud is rewarded, especially if tithes have been paid.

Paul Dunn was never kicked out.

now that they (general rule?) don't announce ex-coms, it's harder to tell.


btw, ex-coms used to be published in the Church News

Not if they are General Authorities.

They utilise the "emiritus status" whereby the offender gets sidelined quietly but gets to keep their financial support from the Church.

I suspect this is done as part of a compromise agreement so that any skeletons are kept firmly in the cupboard.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/01/2014 10:34AM by Stumbling.

The entire leadership would need to be x'd.

If it is in the news and it looks bad if they don't, they will discipline.

If it is under the mainstream radar where they can allow "repent and repeat" they will try to handle it themselves with the pray, pay and obey routine.