Help needed - I know there are things in the JST that contradict the BOM - please help me know them.

Isn't that like pointing out contradictions in a couple of Star Trek episodes?

What's the point?


Anagrammy

Argument with a TBM

Specifically, I am talking about actual changed verses in the bible and how they contradict the BOM.

Don't you mean changed verses from the Bible to the BofM? I do believe the Bible came first.

I remem back to when they called it 'the inspired version' haha

It really bothered me that "judge not that ye not be judged" was changed to "judge not unrighteously, that ye not be judged" in the JST version. If I am righteous (in my own eyes, what???) then it is OK to judge the hell out of anyone I please? I do not miss the self-righteousness and arrogance of relatives and friends who were TBM, and I'm currently taking great delight in the apparent exodus from the church by the neices and nephews in the next generation. The collapse of the morg cannot happen soon enough for me. (I'm working on that bitterness thing I have going...)

respectfully, JST is better then the BOM....by that I mean more impressive if real

I've read about that somewhere, but can't remember the details.

The specific places you would want to look would be in 3rd Nephi when Jesus is reciting stuff like the sermon on the mount.

The Lord's Prayer in the BOM is same as in the KJV...Only problem is that JST version reads differently. "Lead us not into temptation..." Gawd can't lead you into temptation. JST corrects this....look at your footnotes in the KJV. You can find talks of GAs talking about how Gawd can't lead you into temptation...what joy to have the JST etc etc. As recent as 2009 Elder Nelson is praising the JST for this very thing and refers to this very passage.

This little discovery was made in the MTC...the was the first major crack in my testimonkey.

Don't misinterpret me....I am not active LDS, however, JST is a brilliant piece of work (objectively speaking); I am very objective myself, however, let me give you one example where Jesus states to the apostles "pray lest ye enter into temptation." Why did he say this? It doesn't fit where its found in KJV. The reason why (pursuant to JST) is because the apostles had begun to doubt he was the messiah and therefore he made that statement. Other examples are too numerous to mention here but JST is far more interesting then the BOM in my (hopefully) objective opinion.

1. JS made changes contrary to any translation and changing passages to suit his theology when he made them.
2. Verses we know now should not have been in the Bible were NOT taken out by JS. A good example is in Gethsemene where JS added "bled from every pore".The verse is not found in the most ancient manuscripts AND is "like" not actually bleeding at all. JS made the change to justify his claim that it was in Gethsemene that the atonement really occurred. Like everything else, today this is morphing to traditional Christian doctrine of the cross being the site of the atonement. BUT JS changed the Bible to justify his wrong doctrine.
3. The JST is not a translation at all, but an outright fraud.

utem Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Don't misinterpret me....I am not active LDS,
> however, JST is a brilliant piece of work
> (objectively speaking); I am very objective
> myself, however, let me give you one example where
> Jesus states to the apostles "pray lest ye enter
> into temptation." Why did he say this? It
> doesn't fit where its found in KJV. The reason
> why (pursuant to JST) is because the apostles had
> begun to doubt he was the messiah and therefore he
> made that statement. Other examples are too
> numerous to mention here but JST is far more
> interesting then the BOM in my (hopefully)
> objective opinion.


Well I certainly am not trying to convince you of Joseph Smith but the fact that JST is an intriguing piece of work, I believe, is the case. JST does not attempt to do "too much" which doesn't fit with the case many try to make that Joseph Smith was an egomaniac. Just sayin. The JST, incidentally, includes small and subtle changes to the Old Testament and, in my opinion in remarkably consistent fashion, corrects certain errors that should have been evident (an maybe apparently were lol). Regardless, and for the foregoing reasons, it is a much more intriguing piece of work then the BOM in my opinion. Read it closely and I think you'll agree. More evidence of the brilliance (or fraud) of Joseph Smith if you read the entire thing closely. Anyway adieu.

Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your Name,
your kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as in heaven.

Give us today our daily bread.
Forgive us our sins
as we forgive those
who sin against us.

Save us from the time of trial,
and deliver us from evil.
For the kingdom, the power,
and the glory are yours,
now and for ever. Amen.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2012 07:28PM by menomore.

azpeoriaexmo, it's a very good question, and something I like to bring up to tbm's.

In addition to what's been said above, the Isaiah material in 2 Nephi conflicts with the JST Isaiah



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2012 09:02PM by archytas.

Moroni Ch. 8 there is a verse that says, "I do not fear what

man can do, perfect love casteth out all fear"

how funny because in KJV in John 4 it states "perfect love

casteth out fear"

Isn't it awesome that J. Smith simply added the word all and

incredibly that makes it his own work!


ITS CALLED PLAGUARISM!! DUHHH!

haha and they say no other book is more crossferenced with

bible than the BOM haha yeah thats because he stole large

chunks of scripture from it!

TOUCHE!!!

The Sermon on the Mount given to the Lamanites but changed in the JST:

3 Nephi 13:25-27:
25. ...Therefore I say unto you, take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?
26. Behold the fowls of the air, for they sow not, neither do they reap nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?
27. Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature? “

Matthew 6:25-27: (from the KJV of the Bible – not the JST)
25. Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?
26. Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they?
27. Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature?”


The passages are identical which is understandable as Jesus may have said the same thing to both groups of people in the Old and the New World.

The Joseph Smith Translation of those same passages in the LDS Bible for Matthew 6:25-27
25. And, again, I say unto you, go ye into the world, and care not for the world: for the world will hate you, and will persecute you, and will turn you out of their synagogues.
26. Nevertheless, ye shall go forth from house to house, teaching the people; and I will go before you.
27. And your heavenly Father will provide for you whatsoever things ye need for food, what ye shall eat; and for raiment, what ye shall wear or put on.”


Joseph Smith corrected the Bible. In doing so he also corrected the Book of Mormon. The Book of Mormon is the most correct book and was translated a mere decade before the JST. The BOM was not corrupted over time and did not need correcting. How is it that the BOM doesn’t match the JST?

Another Example:

3 Nephi 14:6
6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Matthew 7:6
6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

JST Matthew 7:10-11
10 And the mysteries of the kingdom ye shall keep within yourselves; for it is not meet to give that which is holy unto the dogs; neither cast ye your pearls unto swine, lest they trample them under their feet.
11 For the world cannot receive that which ye, yourselves, are not able to bear; wherefore ye shall not give your pearls unto them, lest they turn again and rend you.

Why do I suddenly have a hankering for hot dogs and oysters?

The JST is another one of those that you don't get during the milk to meat process in the beginning.

They will claim,

Mish: "no we don't change the bible, we only add to it using the BOM"

Me:
"What then is the JST?"

Mish: Don't concern yourself with those right now.

The JST is a corruption and mutilation of the KJV.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2012 02:09AM by nonldsmichigander.

Agree totally.

(Joseph Smith Translation)

""John 1:1–5

1 In the beginning was the gospel preached through the Son. And the gospel was the word, and the word was with the Son, and the Son was with God, and the Son was of God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not anything made which was made.

4 In him was the gospel, and the gospel was the life, and the life was the light of men;

5 And the light shineth in the world, and the world perceiveth it not.""

Seems like some pretty significant differences from what the Bible says when directly translated from the koine Greek.


KJV Bible

""John 1

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

2 The same was in the beginning with God.

3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.""


Plus if you look at "verses 6-14" the Word is clearly a reference to Jesus Christ according to the context. ~ And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us... ~

""6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.

7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.

8 He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.

9 That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.""(John 1-6-14 KJB).


I don't see how ""the Word" can be in reference to "the gospel" when clearly later later on in the context we see the Bible say.... ""And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.""

I don't believe in the King James Bible or Joseph Smith's version of the Bible..... but the truth is Joseph Smith came up with goofy ideas that contradict the direct translation of the Greek New Testament into the English language.