Most of us on this board know the signs of sociological-defined cult. It struck me, after having spent time with my wife's large TBM family, that many TBM families take if the aspects if a cult.

I'll focus on one aspect--total control of its members.

TBM father-in-law and mother-in-law refer to themselves as the patriarch and matriarch (P & M) of the family. Adult children and adult grandchildren never do anything without seeking the advice of the P & M. Children have turned down jobs of outside Utah based on the opinions if P & M.

P & M have specific terms of endearment that the grandchildren must use (no, I'm not making this sh!t up).

P & M have hijacked all the holidays and it's rare that someone doesn't show up to the mandatory gatherings. P & M will often assign family members to fellowship guests; sometime P & M will use place cards for dinners to "help promote" conversation.

The Boner, along with a couple of other exmos are carefully watched and our conversations are carefully monitored. If Boner et al walk outside, P generally follows because he needs to take out the trash, of some other lame excuse.

P & M are the Facebook guardians for the family. They monitor and friend every new individual.

I have only focused on the control aspect, but all other indicators are present. TBM wife considers alliance to P & M the highest as M has said to the family, spouses only have to follow their partners in righteousness!

Am I alone in dealing with TBM family cult? What other aspect of a cult have you seen in TBM families?

You know, "Recovering Agency: Lifting the Veil of Mormon Mind Control" touches on this subject a little bit.

The church's influence permeates the homes of members, and TBM family members tend to police each other. The author's point was that, even if Mormonism doesn't have a typical cult compound, often times TBM households function as "mini-compounds".

Growing up, my dad took the patriarchal role very seriously. When we first joined, he banned my mom from wearing pants or the color red. When I was 9, he tried to make the rest of us wait for his signal (a single, stern nod) to start eating if we were at a restaurant or some other public place.

I remember having to dress in our formal Sunday clothes so he could do a worthiness interview with me and my brother in our living room. We also had to wear our church clothes all day every Sunday, even if we were shooting the breeze at home. We were also forbidden from napping too long because snoozing the Sabbath away was disrespectful to God, apparently. Going on a pleasant stroll together on a pretty Sunday afternoon? Forget it.

My brother went to the movies with a nevermo girlfriend once, and a TBM from our ward snitched on him to my parents. My dad pretended that God just happened to tell him all of the details so we'd think he was some all-knowing patriarch.

Thankfully, he isn't quite as controlling in his older age (he'll let my mom change into her pajamas when they get home from church, for example).

I don't want to discount the good things he's done for me, but after reading that bit about compound families in "Recovering Agency", it helped me make more sense out of my weird upbringing.

Because my parents weren't Mormons, I missed out on the fathers personal priesthood interviews. I can't imagine a worse way to talk with a teen than making them wear church clothes to have a talk with a Dad.

"My dad pretended that God just happened to tell him all of the details so we'd think he was some all-knowing patriarch."

Hey! My husband just happened to have a mission president do that very same thing. When on his mission, the church monitored their email, found out something about him, and called him in - all under the guise that he had been 'inspired' to do so, and 'inspired' about this information. What a crock of crap!

That is extreme and sick. How do you do it? I mean really, how?

I had a lot of that in my family--definitely no questioning of the patriarch and you do exactly as he said when the family gathered. My Mom shadowed me at my sister's wedding to make sure my conversation stayed acceptable. But it wasn't really 24/7 with them. There were a few relaxed times--except now that I think of it they were only relaxed because everyone knew the rules and played by them. Hmmmnn. Maybe I do know how you do it.

Thank god I didn't have parents like this. These are the type of families that used to freak me out as I was growing up. I always worried that this is how Mormonism would be in the CK, but, you know, I had to have that forever family.

There is such a wide range of living Mormonism, but the way your DW's family lives it seems to me to be the desired one that everyone is striving for.

My husband's ex wife runs her household like this. She is a convert to the LDS church, but even before she converted, she ran her house like a mini personality cult. I think Mormonism attracts narcissistic control freaks.

I pity anyone who marries any of her kids because she treats them as extensions of herself and will meddle in their relationships. She drives wedges between people in her little cult and others. It's very sad, because three of her five kids (by three different husbands) are in the prime of their lives and should be enjoying their independence.

I had a friend who was a talented singer and dancer. He and his wife met Alicia Bridges, and long story short, she asked him to sing and tour with her band. Of course, he had to pass it up because TBM dad told him how unrighteous that type of song and dance was and he was not "allowed" to go. The guy was 25 yrs. old at the time, but minded his dad like he was 7. (This of course was back in the 70's.)

My TBM family was extremely insular. We moved a lot and had to rely on one another for companionship. Our immature parents encouraged us to torment each other for entertainment, so our relationships were strained, to say the least. We had a micro-culture of shame and ridicule. We were Mormon first and human last. The family was led by a tyrant father and an invertebrate, though often hysterical, mother. Our family motto was: fail early, fail often.

That's one way to go through life.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/25/2014 10:22PM by donbagley.

She's the oldest in the extended family, the most pious (minus the mary jane), and, like, wow.

Mind. Blown.

This sounds very familiar. I cut ties several decades ago because I didn't want to do a rerun of my parents life. UGh.

It's the best thing i've done for myself.

As a kid, I never wore shorts, because I was supposed to getting ready for wearing the garmies. I started wearing them in high school as something of an act of rebellion.

Needless to say, as a male, I was not allowed to sleep without a shirt on, even if it was 90 degrees in the house. I got in trouble for doing so. I was supposed to be getting ready for garments.

My mom is an ultra-Mormon. She's softened somewhat. Her dad was, until his death, something of BKP/McConkie clone. He's been dead since 2005 and I'm still scared of him.

He's been dead since 2005 and I'm still scared of him.


LOL, I understand, but it's still a funny way to put it.

If you believe that they are in the spirit world looking over your shoulder, guiding your every move...
Then the fear and control continues.

I prefer to think of the dead as dead.

Control and manipulation. Fear that they must interfere with associations so that no one else "falls" away with the jack-apostate-learned. Fear that the Mormon aspect has two faces. Another reason to hate family gatherings, or aspects thereof. These types are facades of real people. They manipulate and posture to the grand-kids, despite the parent's own wishes. They touch and taint every piece of a family get-together. They muddy the waters of a proper relationship. Cult family because of cult church's demands, whitewashing and whippings. All wrong. All unnatural. All un-wholesome; the opposite of what we were raised it was or wasn't. It is of the devil, they constantly try to ignore.

M@t

I bought into that, and repeated it often until I was in my 40s

Like bearing testimony, It was a regular 'thing' to talk about what a wonderful, righteous, loving family we had, and what a righteous priesthood holder and provider my father was. In reality, he was emotionally distant and controlling. Judgement was emotionally (not physicially) harsh and sometimes has included permanent labels for not measuring up or being non-cooperative. There is a culture of harsh criticism, passive aggressiveness, labeling and gossip (disguised as concern . . . . just like in the church).

My mother was emotionally fragile, powerless and unhappy for as long as I can remember. Her relationship with my father seemed like mother/daughter instead of equal. He called the shots and divvied out approval/disapproval for whatever she wanted to buy or do. This the way the church treats women in the church organization, too. Their role is a supportive one, not a leadership role, and not one that leads to personal growth or fulfillment. The only power she exercised was passive aggression. And she has done it very well.

Like the church, we had a leader (my dad) who set up expectations and micromanaged everybody, right down to how we broke up the lettuce, or peeled and cut up the potatoes. He knew the best way to do EVERYTHING, and if it you didn't do it his way, you got in trouble. As if it really mattered how you peeled the potatoes. The sad thing is that my siblings have paid a really high price for being micromanaged. Indecision, lack of ambition, dependency, etc.

Like the church, in our family, if someone (with authority) says "jump" most everybody jumps, even if the request is out of line. And if someone does something kind of shady or mean, nobody dares call them on it, or ask questions or there is hell to pay. How DARE you question that golden person? They are above reproach. Note: only a couple people are allowed to make demands. There is a family hierarchy. The rest know their place.

Like the church, everybody plays nice at gatherings, and talks about how wonderful the organization is. But relationships are shallow and sometimes guarded. People (especially my mom) gossip, which undermines trust and openness.

And, like the church (or any other cult), it's NOT okay to talk about the problems with other members of the organization. One of my siblings and I tried to discuss some issues with other family members and were met with a really cold response and denial.

And finally, like the church, when you buck the system of control, it loses it's power. It seems SO impossible scary to do, like you'll lose everything. But the organization really only has the power YOU allow it to have. You may lose some relationships (or an inheritance) when you do this, but you'll gain your own autonomy and self-respect, and you'll get your life back.

Wow, I could have written your post!

Now the next sign: CULTS NEVER ALLOW CRITICSM OF LEADERS!

The P & M continually talk about family members' most private issues. For example, my brother-in-law apparently has problems with pre-mature ejaculation (not making this one up either). M had to instruct sister-in-law on wedding night to get some vasoline (I couldn't make this up if I tried). Apparently my issues with an alcoholic parent have been thoroughly disseminated. I can't even wonder what they're saying about the Boner that family members don't tell me.

Yet, no one ever critize P & M! Everyone sings P & M praises as they were once featured in the Ensign as one of Mormonism's perfect couples, WTF!

The Boner!

My parents told me confidentially (probably along with everyone else in the family) that a sibling's porn use led to his marital problems. As if that's anyone's business.

I've learned that you never tell them ANYTHING confidential. However, I've also learned that if I WANT everyone to know something, it's very easy to get the word around the family by telling a few key people.

Jeezus!

Anon for this....We must be siblings!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/27/2014 06:04AM by braindead.

This kind of strict and controlled upbringing can breed really rebellious kids. I babysat a couple of boys whose parents were an English teacher and a Lieutenant Colonel. As soon as the parents left the house, they went wild.

I'm sure if they'd had some rope, they'd have been the type who would tie up the babysitter.

I went on the war path at age 11. The day I realized that the only power they had over me was beating me. I decided I would never respond to a beating again. I told my father to go ahead and beat me until I was dead, he wasn't going to get the results he was looking for. The belt stopped in mid air.

After that they decided emotional beatings were the way to go. I moved out when I was 17. I cut contact when I was 30. That was 30 years ago. Life has gotten better since then.

Madalice, you are an inspiration for children who have been used, exploited, or abused by their families. Peace and good fortune!

Mormon families are weird that way. Not that this doesn't happen in non-Mormon families too but its so odd when fully grown ADULTS are still treated like children by their parents. I don't know how many times I have heard about TBM parents sitting down their married 30 or 40-year old son or daughter and chastising them because they noticed that they weren't wearing their garments.

None of my grandparents were Mormon as my parents were converts in their twenties but there is a marked difference between their interactions with their parents and those who are Mormon. The Mormon parents seem to never sever the cord and are constantly in their kids business, at least in religious matters. My parents were always treated as equals and respected as adults making their own decisions.

I have found accurate depictions of my family online, classified as a particular kind of dysfunctional family that typically results from addiction. It got a brief mention that religious fanaticism can cause exactly the same scenario and results!
So it's true, not just mormons will get like this, but I think _particularly_ mormons will be prone to this kind of dysfunction because of the importance the church insists on holding in the members' lives.

Anybody else discouraged from having friends outside of church members? ...In the mission field??? That's abuse right there, my experience.

Luckily my family is not one of these but there were a number of them where I grew up. There were even ruthless feuds between various alpha families when they began competing with each other.

((((((madalice)))))