Recovery Board
: RfM
Recovery from Mormonism (RfM) discussion forum.
It seems ChurchCo may be distancing itself from the doctrine of becoming Gods.
So what I want to know is, what in heck's name is the purpose of Mormonism if you can't become a God? How will they be able to sell their brand? I mean, if all there is in the end is going to heaven and hanging out with Jesus and your family, why on earth would you bust your butt in TSCC? You could go to the mainstream Christian church down the street and wear your jeans, enjoy a cup of coffee, give only if you feel led, and not worry about oppressive interviews by your bishop. Not to mention going for one hour instead of three.
And what was the whole point of the "restoration" then? Supposedly Mormon Jesus needed Joseph Smith to restore all of the far out stuff that Bible Jesus didn't bother teaching, and yet now Mormons just want to be another Bible Jesus church.... albeit one that makes the Southern Baptists look like a bunch of laid-back pot smoking hippies.
So I wonder how the faithful will take this blow. If I had endured 50 years of rock-paper-scissors in the temple and scrubbing toilets for Mormon Jesus, only to be told that, "Hey that whole you becoming a God thing was just a crazy fable told by overzealous members", I think I might just flip out.
ChurchCo may soon find out that mainstreaming is a great way to lose even more members, while attracting pretty much no one.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2012 11:45PM by mobegone.
So what I want to know is, what in heck's name is the purpose of Mormonism if you can't become a God? How will they be able to sell their brand? I mean, if all there is in the end is going to heaven and hanging out with Jesus and your family, why on earth would you bust your butt in TSCC? You could go to the mainstream Christian church down the street and wear your jeans, enjoy a cup of coffee, give only if you feel led, and not worry about oppressive interviews by your bishop. Not to mention going for one hour instead of three.
And what was the whole point of the "restoration" then? Supposedly Mormon Jesus needed Joseph Smith to restore all of the far out stuff that Bible Jesus didn't bother teaching, and yet now Mormons just want to be another Bible Jesus church.... albeit one that makes the Southern Baptists look like a bunch of laid-back pot smoking hippies.
So I wonder how the faithful will take this blow. If I had endured 50 years of rock-paper-scissors in the temple and scrubbing toilets for Mormon Jesus, only to be told that, "Hey that whole you becoming a God thing was just a crazy fable told by overzealous members", I think I might just flip out.
ChurchCo may soon find out that mainstreaming is a great way to lose even more members, while attracting pretty much no one.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2012 11:45PM by mobegone.
Here's where it's heading:
It is something "new"-- a fusion of community/neighborhood and religion for the modern age which doesn't have time to invest in both. Give your child a peergroup in school that has good morals, adult supervison, and is better organized than Methodists.
Outsource your family values to professionals who are experts in brainwashing, now teaching simple Christian beliefs. You, the parents, can control the peer group this way through LDS friends for your kid.
Your kid is too old for a Nanny, so this is a bargain for only 10% of your income. We reinforce your fractured family. We help you raise good kids in troubled times. God knows you need it.
Anagrammy
It is something "new"-- a fusion of community/neighborhood and religion for the modern age which doesn't have time to invest in both. Give your child a peergroup in school that has good morals, adult supervison, and is better organized than Methodists.
Outsource your family values to professionals who are experts in brainwashing, now teaching simple Christian beliefs. You, the parents, can control the peer group this way through LDS friends for your kid.
Your kid is too old for a Nanny, so this is a bargain for only 10% of your income. We reinforce your fractured family. We help you raise good kids in troubled times. God knows you need it.
Anagrammy
You raise a good point. But maybe the leaders know that the only way to save the Mormon church is to do away with Mormonism. They are definitely stuck between a peep-stone and a hard place. What they might agree to do is tell the public one thing (the milk) while reserving the meat (becoming gods etc) for the meeting houses. They already do that anyway. They could call it the law of "I don't know that we teach that".
I like that! I will use it. thanks!
Please do. Glad to be of help.
If you can't become a God, then what on Mormon God's green earth is the point of Mormonism?!
-for the LDS Corporation to steal as much money from you as possible on a long term basis.
-for the LDS Corporation to steal as much money from you as possible on a long term basis.
Playing "rock paper scissors in the temple" .... Hilarious.
Well, frankly, I think that:
Rock--Paper--Scissors--Lizard--Spock
is probably even more appropriate, even if I cringe to allow any association between my beloved Dr. Cooper and Mormonism!!!
Rock--Paper--Scissors--Lizard--Spock
is probably even more appropriate, even if I cringe to allow any association between my beloved Dr. Cooper and Mormonism!!!
I was thinking about this one yesterday. The thought actually crossed my mind - "what if it's all true? well if it is, then this new interpretation actually makes it easier to leave. The less appealing Mormonism is, the less I stand to lose..."
I don't believe anymore, but when I did believe the idea of becoming a God - eternal progression - was absolutely central to my motivation. The idea of God is incredible, but the idea that I could be a God is as awesome as it gets! Eternity is a very very long time indeed, and so there needs to be something worth striving for that takes a very very long time to achieve, or better, something that never ends - "worlds without end". That is why the doctrine of eternal progression is so powerful. Most people, if they think about it, would find the idea of eternity pretty dull if all they did was sit on clouds near Jesus playing harps. But if you can comprehend in your mind an eternity of learning, of knowledge, of creativity, of endless sex with 999 wives... then it starts to sound like a decent plan. Within the context of Mormonism, it actually makes sense.
So now they come along and reinforce that they don't teach that. So what's left? They don't know. They have replaced their greatest promise with absolutely nothing. If current members don't realise this - and most won't - then new members certainly will. Eventually this will stop being taught. It will go from being classified as "meat" to the false doctrine bin with Adam-God, blood atonement and polygamy.
I don't believe anymore, but when I did believe the idea of becoming a God - eternal progression - was absolutely central to my motivation. The idea of God is incredible, but the idea that I could be a God is as awesome as it gets! Eternity is a very very long time indeed, and so there needs to be something worth striving for that takes a very very long time to achieve, or better, something that never ends - "worlds without end". That is why the doctrine of eternal progression is so powerful. Most people, if they think about it, would find the idea of eternity pretty dull if all they did was sit on clouds near Jesus playing harps. But if you can comprehend in your mind an eternity of learning, of knowledge, of creativity, of endless sex with 999 wives... then it starts to sound like a decent plan. Within the context of Mormonism, it actually makes sense.
So now they come along and reinforce that they don't teach that. So what's left? They don't know. They have replaced their greatest promise with absolutely nothing. If current members don't realise this - and most won't - then new members certainly will. Eventually this will stop being taught. It will go from being classified as "meat" to the false doctrine bin with Adam-God, blood atonement and polygamy.
The sales pitch will be/is that if you want to go to heaven and be with your family and friends forever, then you need to receive certain saving ordinances that can only be provided by THE ONE and THE ONLY TRUE CHURCH on earth.
After receiving those ordinances you need to be sure not to sin. If by chance you do sin, you need to confess. This can only be done to a legal representative of the one true church. To help you stay clean, God's church has LIVING PROPHETS and APOSTLES to lead you and guide you through this scary life. Their is a scary person called SATAN. He's a really bad guy and will want to make you sin. To avoid that FOLLOW THE PROPHET and the GA's and your SP, and your BP and your........ and be perfectly obedient to everything they say. They speak for GOD and they are the ONLY ONES who know HIS MIND and WILL. So you really need them!
If you do all this and cling to the TRUE church then you will be able to go to heaven. Works for me.
After receiving those ordinances you need to be sure not to sin. If by chance you do sin, you need to confess. This can only be done to a legal representative of the one true church. To help you stay clean, God's church has LIVING PROPHETS and APOSTLES to lead you and guide you through this scary life. Their is a scary person called SATAN. He's a really bad guy and will want to make you sin. To avoid that FOLLOW THE PROPHET and the GA's and your SP, and your BP and your........ and be perfectly obedient to everything they say. They speak for GOD and they are the ONLY ONES who know HIS MIND and WILL. So you really need them!
If you do all this and cling to the TRUE church then you will be able to go to heaven. Works for me.
yep - there's a lot of bullsh!t to have to put up with to be a good mormon
and they are getting rid of the only carrot: godhood
it's all stick now
if they're going to demand more of people they should at least be promising more in return - generic heaven and families together forever and all of that is being sold by every xtian church for A LOT less time/money/effort...
and they are getting rid of the only carrot: godhood
it's all stick now
if they're going to demand more of people they should at least be promising more in return - generic heaven and families together forever and all of that is being sold by every xtian church for A LOT less time/money/effort...
Gospel Principles Manual Chapter 47
Those who receive exaltation in the celestial kingdom through faith in Jesus Christ will receive special blessings. The Lord has promised, “All things are theirs” (D&C 76:59). These are some of the blessings given to exalted people:
1. They will live eternally in the presence of Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ (see D&C 76:62).
2. They will become gods (see D&C 132:20–23).
3. They will be united eternally with their righteous family members and will be able to have eternal increase.
4. They will receive a fulness of joy.
5. They will have everything that our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ have—all power, glory, dominion, and knowledge (see D&C 132:19–20). President Joseph Fielding Smith wrote: “The Father has promised through the Son that all that he has shall be given to those who are obedient to His commandments. They shall increase in knowledge, wisdom, and power, going from grace to grace, until the fulness of the perfect day shall burst upon them” (Doctrines of Salvation, comp. Bruce R. McConkie, 3 vols. [1954–56], 2:36; italics in original).
Those who receive exaltation in the celestial kingdom through faith in Jesus Christ will receive special blessings. The Lord has promised, “All things are theirs” (D&C 76:59). These are some of the blessings given to exalted people:
1. They will live eternally in the presence of Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ (see D&C 76:62).
2. They will become gods (see D&C 132:20–23).
3. They will be united eternally with their righteous family members and will be able to have eternal increase.
4. They will receive a fulness of joy.
5. They will have everything that our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ have—all power, glory, dominion, and knowledge (see D&C 132:19–20). President Joseph Fielding Smith wrote: “The Father has promised through the Son that all that he has shall be given to those who are obedient to His commandments. They shall increase in knowledge, wisdom, and power, going from grace to grace, until the fulness of the perfect day shall burst upon them” (Doctrines of Salvation, comp. Bruce R. McConkie, 3 vols. [1954–56], 2:36; italics in original).
nice find!
What will be the point of the marriage ceremony with the two mirrors representing no beginning and no end? If there's no beginning multiple god's and only the mormon god, what did he do for the eternity before being god of earth 6000 years ago?
The three degrees of heaven is also a contentious issue, which has no biblical basis (it's a completely erroneous interpretation of 1 Corinthians 15:40) I wonder if they'll do away with that too. They still seem to be going with the "God has a body" myth. There's so much embarrassing stuff that you wonder what will be next on the chopping block.
IF ONLY I had known this 3 weeks ago!
Conversation with my TBM dad (paraphrased):
Dad: Well, how do you think we got the god we have? He was once a man and now he's God. If we can't become like god and be gods, then what's the purpose of life?
Me: blabber on with my idea of life and afterlife that he finds absurd
How I wish the convo went:
Dad: Well, how do you think we got the god we have? He was once a man and now he's God. If we can't become like god and be gods, then what's the purpose of life?
Me: oh. Maybe you didn't hear: your church doesn't believe that anymore. Sorry.
::I direct him to the church newsroom FAQ::
::His testimony cracking can be heard audibly::
The end.
Conversation with my TBM dad (paraphrased):
Dad: Well, how do you think we got the god we have? He was once a man and now he's God. If we can't become like god and be gods, then what's the purpose of life?
Me: blabber on with my idea of life and afterlife that he finds absurd
How I wish the convo went:
Dad: Well, how do you think we got the god we have? He was once a man and now he's God. If we can't become like god and be gods, then what's the purpose of life?
Me: oh. Maybe you didn't hear: your church doesn't believe that anymore. Sorry.
::I direct him to the church newsroom FAQ::
::His testimony cracking can be heard audibly::
The end.
I have been thinking this same thing lately. With all of the distancing they are doing, won't that cause as many problems as it solves? Sure the current members probably don't immediately leave but when they can see doctrines changing before their eyes and witness the obvious political spin job firsthand, doesn't that create a bunch of cogdis? I don't see how it could be effective. The people they are trying to look good to aren't going to convert and the ones that already are members must be thinking: "WTF?"