Warning: I'm really bitchy right now. This may or may not suit you.

I can't remember if I've ever ranted about this before, but since it came up again in my life recently, here goes...

I'm a decent amateur photographer-- have been since I got my first 35mm SLR at the age of 14. My dad had a photo lab in our basement during my younger years, and I spent a lot of time watching him and learning from his books. Courtesy of dad's instruction, I enjoyed old-school black & white, develop-it-yourself photography from a pretty young age. Currently, I've got some nice photography equipment (still getting used to Digital and my D7), I know a lot about it (for a lay-person) and I have taken some very nice photos. I'm particularly good at composing flattering portraits, and I'm great with natural lighting. Every photo isn't perfect, but I've got a good critical eye and I know when I've got it right.

I have people who know me ask me to photograph events and family portraits all the time. If it's a friend or family, I do it for free because I love taking photos. I'm always looking for interesting subjects and I love making people I love look fabulous.

Otherwise, I refer inquiries to peeps of mine who are "real" photographers-- as in qualified professionals. I know a few qualified professional photographers who are very supportive of my amateur efforts. They give me great advice on equipment as well as critical feedback on my shots.

So, the reason I don't have a business, is not because I couldn't get business, but because I respect the art and I know enough to know that I take photos that are good for a hobbyist. I don't have the breadth or depth of knowledge, skill or experience that is needed to get great shots under less-than-ideal circumstances, thus ensuring that customers are happy.

So anyway, I stay in touch with a number of Mormon friends and relatives via facebook. I love these people, but I don't understand them. Ten years ago, they were all crazy scrap-bookers. I wasn't so into that (not that there's anything wrong with it, I was just more interested in producing pictures that stand alone). Following the scrap-booking craze by a few years, my scrapping friends finally saw the appeal of better photos and got into photography. They bought a lot of expensive equipment they don't know how to use and post their pictures all over the internet like they're freakin' Annie Leibovitz.

Over the past two years or so, several of these friends have started photography businesses, and I've looked through their portfolios. I've been asked for feedback, which I don't freely give because I don't think they really want to know what I think. Instead I point out the one or two photos that aren't bad, and I limit my feedback to those select few.

If I were to be honest, few of these photos are professional-quality, and by that I mean, they are ripping off people by charging for their work. We're talking terrible composition, bad lighting, under/overexposure, incorrect focus, bad photo editing, etc. I'm not overstating how bad these are-- we're talking photos that look like someone got into photography yesterday. Further, my friends are so unversed with basic critical theory that they have photos in their portfolio that are so flawed I'd be embarrassed to have anyone see them if they were mine-- and I'm not too picky about what I post-- sometimes I post my bad shots because they're funny, plus I'm not trying to attract business, I'm just posting pictures of friends and random stuff I attend.

So, I don't get it. Why are they in such a rush to start a business and make money when they haven't bothered to obtain even rudimentary skills? I'm a professional musician, but I wouldn't have dreamed of making a business of it after dabbling for a few years. I didn't even start teaching lessons until MY teacher started referring students to me. I can't see how photography, as an art and craft, is easier, or less-deserving of respect.

Why are all the bad "professional" photographers I know Mormon? Do they see it as a better alternative than a pyramid-scheme or other business venture by which they could take advantage of their friends and family? The lack of respect for good photography really pisses me off.

**The lone exception among them is my SIL-- she has really got an eye, knows how to work the Photoshop and takes great, professional photos. In short, she's a genius. If anyone lives near American Fork and wants a great photographer who won't charge an arm and a leg, contact me-- I can't recommend her enough, she'll make you and your family look like models.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/29/2010 11:01PM by angsty.

Her photos are amazing...but I don't have a professional eye, so....

I have seen this a lot with Mormon women. They want to feel like they have a purpose in life since they didn't finish (or even start) college and had to get married and have kids right away. They have to spend all that time figuring out how to just use the damn camera in the first place. It's something they can do while they stay home and raise their children. It's an easy way to say they have a business without doing any of the work.

IMO they are either too lazy or not allowed to go back to school, get a degree, and work a real job.

I am definitely torn on this one. Photography aside, the basic principle at hand can be applied to any field.

I do enjoy the 'purists' approach, but I wouldn't let analysis paralysis stop me from making a buck off a consumer group that is willing to pay it.

McDonalds is rated in the bottom 70 on quality and look at the empire they have built.

Depends on what you are trying to accomplish. Some do things for the love, some do it for the money, some have found the equlibrium between the two.

I dunno if it's completely fair to just completely lump every Mormon into the "bad photography" category, or even bad artists in general.

I've studied music at a college-level for about 5 years, and before that I was with various teachers, and in my current band I'm on the low-end of our musical ability. And the thing is 2/5 of them are Mormon, and I'm ex-mormon (so it was 3/5 at one point).

Although I WILL agree that it's horribly annoying when people think they can be "artsy" with little to no actual training. I can't count the number of times musicians audition without any idea of key signatures, timing, chords, ANYTHING. It just makes me so angry. How can you expect to play in a serious band while knowing literally NOTHING about music.

If people simply work hard enough for something, they're going to get good at it eventually. I don't think religion really plays a part in the artistic ability of someone.

I know some amazing Mormon artists.

MY SIL is Mormon and totally self-taught and FABULOUS. She has a few friends who are on the same level.

My gripe is that I know a preponderance of Mormon women who have home-based photography businesses who have no idea what they are doing.

This whole admittedly-bitchy post was motivated by an online fight between two of my LDS female relatives (yesterday). One of them runs a photography business and was angry with the other for hiring another friend (non-relative) to do her family portraits. Basically, there are enough photography businesses in my Mormon family tree that it's impossible to give business to one without offending four others-- and only one of them takes good pictures!

People are just people and most just wander about doing what they want without thinking...literally at all.

If someone wants to pay them for not so good photography, well they have the problem.

It takes a long time to learn a camera and then to take good photos...some of us do it almost naturally...most artists I know take their own pictures for their paintings, I do almost exclusively...I know exactly what I want for the painting. I've been doing watercolors and oils for a long time...some I sell some I don't...cause I won't part with some of them...

Who knows what goes through people's minds...most of the time I bet it's nothing.


stormy

Meh. It's a TBM SAHM fad. Mormons are cheap and will pay less for lesser quality.

But, I do have one TBM friend who is actually a super talented photographer. But then again, she started doing photography before it was trendy.

I have no artistic eye or training to judge the quality of photos but it is really annoying that every Mormon SAHM with an SLR thinks they are a photographer.

The true artist (photographer, writer, musician) is looking into depth of character--some way of bringing out the subject's (or express his own) personality--in order to evoke interest and emotion.

Mormon photographers are looking for PERFECTION. They dress everyone alike, thus erasing any individuality and self-expression. If all 8 subjects aren't smiling just right, they use photoshop, and swap heads, like in that TV commercial. How much more interesting and memorable one of those other family photos in the commercial would have been--perhaps, the photo in which the father is trying to extricate an action figure from his child's ear, and the tenn-ager is texting. That tells a story!

I hired a good photographer for my daughter's wedding. I told her I would not buy any photographs with the temple in the background. (But the groom's family demanded she take pictures at the temple.) Their walls are filled with group family photos, all dressed alike in denim, kaki, black-and-white, celestial white--depending on the fad that particular year.) Why people think it is cool to have a beautiful young couple backed by hard granite steps leading nowhere, and a heavy wooden (fake) door where no one can enter--how is that romantic? That does not say "Love" or "wedding", but I guess it symbolizes the cumbersome, unyielding burden the cult places on vulnerable newlyweds. You can't even tell what season of the year it is, as there is no living thing visible in the background. Sorry to go off on that, but even as a TBM, I hated those pictures. It advertises the cult, and doesn't express the couple's unique love story at all.

When the LDS church told us to stop performing the Greats (Bach, Beethoven, Brahams, Mozart, Chopin, Debussey, etc, etc) and gave us the durges in the new hymn book instead, and when they banned Rodin from BYU--that's when I realized I had no place in the Momron cult.

I think it goes deeper than just "taste." I think it is the way you view the world. Mormons, as a group, seem half-dead, to me.

Since you were paying for the photographer, who ended up winning the argument betwixt you and the groom's family? I'm figuring that you did, but some people, you know . . . ?

Nothing makes me gag faster than those mormon family pictures where everyone dresses alike or in some theme--khaki, white, blue, denim, etc. And the funny thing is that it never bothered me 10 years or so ago. But now it just screams "see, we are teaching our children that individuality is evil--look how we all conform."

I guess it's just that after escaping Conformity World things like that give me the willies.

"They dress everyone alike, thus erasing any individuality and self-expression."

Yeah, this seems to be a big Mormon thing among some of my TBM sibs....unless it's a photographer's suggestion.

When I asked her why she dresses everyone all alike, she said, "It's for unity".... I was thinking to mysef:

Yes, unity seems to be a big deal among TBMs... although for me, that's a superficial unity, Unity in a photo means nothing if the unity isn't a reality in their daily living, and it pretty much isn't in at least her family.

In my family, I'm also annoyed by near perfect photos of my other TBM sister's family, which is basically a joke because they look so "well off and professional" in the pics but in real life, are very poor, nearly starving, living off church food and can barely make ends meet. The image in their photos makes it look like they are very well to do, etc. and successful etc. Not!

...there are too many customers who can't tell good photos from bad. That's the way it is in any business.

One of my nieces is trying to be a photographer. She's technically very good and has a great sense of composition and lighting. Unfortunately, her subject matter is the usual angelic kids and love-at-home families stuff all her Utah customers want.

I am a professional photographer. 40+years. In the last few years I have found that anyone who can buy a $200.00 digital thinks they are a "PHOTOGRAPHER".
As a result the photography business has been decimated with people who have no concept of what they are seeing.
This is also a result of being inundated with mediocrity since thay days of Frank Roosevelt and his "new deal"
In our economy today people generally care more about cheap than quality.
It is sad but a fact of life

Roosevelt? Really?? LOL

I think it has to do with the Walmartification of America. Why value - and pay for - quality when you can get crap for virtually nothing? You can buy even more crap that way. That's a Walmart thing and it's what we Americans have come to expect; so what if it breaks after a few months - you didn't have to pay much for it to begin with and you can always buy another one.

Quality, knowledge and expertise are generally no longer valued by the populace.

Why people bother with Wal-Mart is beyond me. Cheap garbage for a cheap price.

I actually got out of photography when it went digital. I guess I liked spending lot's of time in a dark room messing with chemicals. I still have my good ol Nikon F3. I think the new digital cameras aren't built very good. I took my F3 to the Amazon and I wonder if one of these new cameras would hold up.

The hardest thing in photography is lighting. I worked in film production a bit and it's the biggest challenge and it's what is always holding up a shoot. I don't consider anyone who can't manually adjust exposure or even compensate with adjusting the film speed on a manual camera a real photographer.

Having a good eye and cropping in the view finder is actually the easy part.

I worked with a guy who's father was a photographer for Playboy. It sounds like the dream job but he said he was concentrating on lighting and getting the shots right he often would forget the women were nude. He also said Heffner was a perfectionist and was not easy to work for.

You can always crop in Photoshop and tweak composition that way. I mean, I try to get the picture right from the get-go, but my priority is good lighting and proper exposure. I don't think the people I'm talking about even have a working knowledge of how the balance of ISO/aperture/shutter speed affects exposure.

Plus they haven't figured out that undiffused bright sunlight is not the best way to photograph people-- especially the Lord's blessed white people. Gawd. Wash. No color. Bad stuff. I don't understand why that's not totally obvious. Do we look good when we're squinting? No. Do we look good when all our face detail amounts to varying blurs of whitish light? Well, I guess that might be an improvement for some.

Nor do they have the slightest clue how to manage depth of field, etc.

I can see that I just need to let this go, but I'm glad to know there's other hobbyists who find it just as annoying.

I watch a lot of sports on TV.

HD is cool. But.... being able to see each fan in the stands clearly behind the batter is a distraction to me. "In the old days" they/we would intentionally "open it up" when taking pictures to blur the foreground/background. That doesn't seem to happen anymore. I can't tell if they're doing it to show off the clarity of the new HD, or perhaps, they don't have the light latitude with the newer cameras....

Yeah, I know... not much on topic.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/01/2010 10:08PM by jpt.

I used to have all the depth of field and lighting formula's in my head. It's been years ago and I would have to relearn a lot of that stuff. You have to love professional outdoor shoots. Shading the direct sun and then having extras holding reflectors to get some fill. Those shoots become a real zoo.

I used to use the big studio lights instead of flash and I would be getting the lighting right and by the time I did the heat would make my subject break out in sweat or make the makeup run but man those big lights are the cat's meow for exact lighting control.

for a very good price. I also get skin care products there -- very high quality products for the lowest price.

oh yeah rat.... i am sure that mediocrity started with FDR!! yeaH OK....how the hell did you get that in a post about photography??
you lost me there.... but you are right about the digital age.... FDR huh??? wow!!

I'm an accomplished amateur photographer (with a fine arts degree) but I know my limits. Sometimes I peruse the online portfolios of Utah wedding photographers, and often find their work to be cringe-worthy for all the reasons that you mentioned. I can't believe that people pay those photographers good money for their wedding photos.

That reminds of this not-so-bright girl I was friends with. She decided she wanted to be a photographer and make big bucks. I started laughing and explained she needed the training first and foremost, and even having a good eye isn't going to guarantee a job with a big magazine.
She thought I was stupid, even after I explained a photographer friend of mine isn't rich and he actually had the talent.
I suggested she go to school and get a degree in psychology or computer science and she replied, "What the HELL am I going to do with a degree?!?"

I have 0 artistic talent myself, but for extra money in college I posed for the photography students several times. They all managed to make me look fabulous =)

I'm at the age where a lot of my friends have gotten married in the last couple of years. My nevermo friends all have very nice, flattering, well composed engagement and wedding photos. My TBM temple married friends, even for their engagement pictures, seem to choose the shots that are least flattering of themselves. Someone is making an odd face, the composition is off, the light is wrong, the pose is awkward...and they flaunt these photos on Facebook! If I was the photographer, I would have left most of these shots on the cutting room floor, not emailed them to someone and god forbid let them choose them as their engagement photo!

So the problem may be two fold--the customer doesn't know what a good shot is, and neither does the photographer.

Owning a Nikon (or Canon or...) doesn't make you a photographer, it makes you a Nikon (or Canon or....) owner.

This is a total generalization, but being involved in art for many years, and a landscape photographer, the LDs concept of "art" leaves much to be desired. They are much more interested in getting a "deal" than having good art in their home.

Even when they want something good, they try to cut a deal and drive down my price. I simply ask, "What is it about my photograph that makes you think it is worth less than where I priced it?" I live in Utah, but seldom sell anything here, despite being featured in galleries, etc. Nearly all of my sales are out of state.

A lot depends on what the person/family requests and what kind of vision they have for their pictures.
Match a very creative client with a creative photographer and the result is fantastic!!!

Not all people are able to think things through.

I interviewed a person running for office in our state last spring. She was running on a one idea platform. She would not and could not discuss other matters that were important to our state but would be part of her job!! She only cared about health care, she was a registered nurse but knew NOTHING about anything else that is of concern to the citizens of this state! I did not vote for her!

People look at a photo and think that's cool. They have no idea what goes into it. So they are foils for the cheap business people who take 'snapshots' (as my photography instructor called it) and sell them as family photography!

It is like who was hired to paint families in the last century? The richest families of Rome hired the best painters to make backdrop pictures for the local Catholic church using family members to portray the saints and the Holy family in various settings. They were painted well, warts and all. Yet some of the most bizzare paintings come from colonial America when artists traveled and earned their keep staying in the large manors painting the residents!

You are an artist. Not everyone is and they don't know what it takes to create well. For you it is like respiration, breathe in and breath out and you create.

Yet too many people just see what they like and consume it.

They have never learned to make anything for themselves. They buy it for money.

Like the woman who offered $100 for a $1200 hand quilted 'Texas Star' quilt with over 1500 quilt pieces in it! Clue less.

But it is hard when you have the budding talent watching potential customers throw away their money onto no talent photographers. Your integrity is showing!!!!!!

while good photography is difficult and requires both training and artistic ability, modern equipment has made decent photography accessible to everyone. One hundred years ago almost all photographs were taken by professionals or the very wealthy, now everyone owns a camera capable of putting all but the best of such images to shame. In light of that, it's hard for many people, including many Mormons (who tend to be very price-driven) to justify paying a great deal more for professional quality work. Obviously, local professional wedding photogs generally are much better than their amateur counterparts, but the comparisons between them and the photogs out shooting for Playboy or Sports Illustrated are ridiculous - it's like comparing your local club pro to Phil Mickelsen just because they are both better golfers than you are. I might pay to watch Mickelsen play golf; I'm sure as hell not paying to watch my local pro.

It isn't just photography but virtually every other craft or skill...certainly in Utah. For some years I had connections to the art and custom picture framing industry. For every professional picture framer in Utah, there are probably ten times as many doing it out of their garage in a very unprofessional manner.

http://www.villainousturtle.com/Art/Pages/Photos.html#grid

I don't even own a good camera. I usually borrow them from someone else. I am just a hobbyist. But even I understand ISO/Aperture/Shutter Speed better than most of the Mormons I know who own DLSRs. Not that my photos are jaw dropping by any stretch.

This is not exclusive to photography nor mormonism. I have a degree in journalism and have spent the vast majority of my career in desktop publishing. Back in the day when I first started out, we sketched magazine layouts by hand with pencil and paper. We also did paste-ups with composed sheets of text, an X-acto knife, border tape, and a wax machine. (You'd send your copy out to a compositor who would typeset it and send back one giant sheet of all your copy. You had to cut out each individual story, photo caption, and headline, wax one side in the machine and then place it--based on your hand-drawn layout--on the proper place on the layout board.)

All of this process has been automated. I was still working at my first magazine when we began making the transition to doing all of this electronically. Basically, I learned the slide rule method, but soon had to adapt to the scientific calculator method.

And then a magical thing happened. My cousin sent me a homemade Christmas card. That she'd designed herself using MS Paint (which is not exactly the industry standard for outputting electronic design). Pretty soon, everybody was using MS Paint to create complete crap and they wanted me to tell them what a great desktop publisher they are now. Hey man, first of all, you're cutting into my business and your crap work now dilutes the value of the skill and time and effort I put into learning how to do it properly. Nevermind the fact that you violated 17 rules of graphic design, have no sense of color whatsoever, and your piece looks like a five-year-old did it. Yep, you're a publisher now! Oh, and you misspelled "the."

Imagine my horror when people at home started buying Quark, InDesign, and PageMaker for their home projects.

:: shudder ::

The real negative impact of all this is that I have trouble getting freelance work, to the point of, I don't really do freelance work anymore. Everyone thinks they can do it themselves on the cheap, so nobody wants to pay a professional editor to clean up their layout or formatting and check their grammar or punctuation. Spell Check doesn't catch everything, but people rely on it and that puts me out of business (for freelance work). People no longer value the skillset that a highly trained editor brings to the project.

"Ah, I'm a good speeler, I don't need to pay Dogzilla!"

So... you get what you pay for.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/03/2010 04:24PM by dogzilla.