About things? I'm so sick of my parents telling me I have an attitude, just because I am very vocal and outspoken about my beliefs. Take cell phones for instance. I can't tell you how fed up I am with people preaching at us (teens in particular) from left and right about how we are too dependent on technology these days. I'm like, are YOU paying my bill? No? All right then, stfu! You may think I have an attitude, but I just call it voicing my opinion, even if it may not be a popular one. Honesty, I think the phrase "you have an attitude" is WAAAAYYYY overused and misused.

Thats adult code for shut up and let me control you. That was my experience anyway.

When the SP said that to me at age 53, I told him to go to hell.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2014 12:34AM by madalice.

madalice Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Thats adult code for shut up and let me control
> you.


Yes, and it's a dismissive comment meaning, "I've put you in a pigeon hole where I can ignore you."

It's the same with "disgruntled," which is a weird attitude that your complaints aren't valid because you're a complainer. Poof, I ignore you.

Yes to both manalice and Stray Mutt.

It is also a way to make you wrong when you are not actually wrong. Rather than address the point you are making, change it from the point, to you.

Claiming "you have attitude" is a personal attack that has nothing to do with the validity of the point being made.

It is an attempt at control, it is also an attempt to discredit the person. It then becomes a rallying cry for those that disagree with you. Stand your ground long enough and many that disagree with you will all start clucking the same words, "Oh, (s)he just has attitude so ignore what they have to say".

Other words often used to the same affect:

Rude
argumentative
angry
disrespectful
impolite
anti <point>
obstinate
Closed minded

The list goes on and on.

The first few minutes of this video talks about this very issue in regards to atheists being critical of religion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZ-xK_PEDgc

My TBM father used to tell me that my "liberal ideas would get me in trouble some day." And he didn't even know (before he died) that I had left the church. He was 92 when he passed away, and I didn't tell him because I knew what it would turn into, and I didn't want to possibly destroy our already strained relationship. After all, he told my SIL's sister that if she didn't join the Mormon Church, she was going to go to HELL. So why would I want to subject myself to that?

morgbotnot Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ... He was 92 when he passed away, and I
> didn't tell him because I knew what it would turn
> into, and I didn't want to possibly destroy our
> already strained relationship. ...

Ironic and Interesting that it is always the Ex-Mormon who is concerned about straining relationships and keeping the peace!

Contrast that to what True Believing Mormons say and do, i.e. condemning, insulting, lecturing, and basically casting relationships to hell without a thought. All this on top of their lack of social graces and basic common sense.

Sheep have no right to have an attitude.

Oh, you're not a sheep? In that case, you are assertive and should be patted on the back for standing up for your beliefs.

Exmormons have an attitude that the truth matters.

Mormons have an attitude that some truths are not helpful.

We all have an attitude, don't we?

:)

Kathleen Waters

+1
Having an attitude can save lives. The reason many people have the courage to leave the church is because they're concerned about harmful effects on their family. They have an "attitude" to protect people they love.

After having left, I try to admire people's passion amd drive (call it attitude) over wether I agree with them.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2014 05:03AM by cultivate.

If you're hearing that criticism from more than one source, you may want to consider the possibility that it's true. There's nothing wrong with having strong opinions, but have you mastered the skill of expressing those opinions without being offensive?

You don't come across as someone who is very open to opposing viewpoints, and that will make you appear to have an attitude.

Yeah, because we all know that the majority is never wrong.

I have heard that being gay is wrong from tons and tons of sources, and guess what, they were ALL wrong.

Not just what you say but also how you say it matters. Try to practice what the Bhagavad Gita calls "austerity of speech" - speak truthfully but try to discuss offensive topics more respectfully, more calmly, and more appropriately, ideally to speak the truth more palatably and in a way that the hearers will be more receptive to.

It does not matter when it comes to religion. No matter how you say a criticism of religion many will find it offensive and you rude.

The first few minutes of this video show exactly that. Dennet went out of his way to address how to say something and it did not matter.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZ-xK_PEDgc

Even for topics related to such matters as religion, there are ways to present certain issues which - although they may find it disagreeable - they may not find nearly as offensive.

My experience is that many religious make criticism of their religion rude in and of it self. When the act of criticism, in and of itself, is rude, there is no way to criticizes that would not be considered rude.

How about actually address the evidence presented when one person when above and beyond a reasonable effort to say things the right way and was still hammered.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2014 09:48PM by MJ.

It's not always easy to do, surely, and as every person is different, how one might reach a less objectionable approach may differ. But while they may not necessarily agree with you, they may still be possibly moved to at least not be so offended by you.

Dennett went out of his way to appease the religious and if failed. The amount that one has to do to criticize religion is UNREASONABLE, especially when religion make the act of criticism rude in and of itself.

They're just afraid of technology, and they're mad that they didn't get flying cars like on the Jetsons.

I'm still waiting for that to happen, was supposed to be here by now!

I know. We were so lied to. At least we had mobile phones that looked like Star Trek communicators for awhile.

'attitude':

EVERYONE has 'an attitude', it's part & parcel of living.


'You have an attitude' is just like:

'You have an accent'; it's always the Other Person who has it/one!

Do not get stuck on the words you do not like. Listen to what your parents are unhappy about. What is their INTENT for you? Is that intent unreasonable?

If you told your parent stfu, then you do have a disrespectful attitude.

You might think you are expressing your opinion. You might just be rude.

Respect goes two ways.

RMM

A person should not have to live by the intents of others, period.

That would be true for an adult, not a teen still living at home.

RMM

Bull shit.

And if the intent of the parents is to use the teen as a prostitute to make money for the family? Are you really saying that a child should live by the intent of the parent?

As a teen the child should be learning how to live by their own intents.

You were partly right, the part about reasonable. It isn't intent that is important it is what is reasonable that is important.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2014 10:15PM by MJ.

The way I was treated as a teen was criminal. My father was a bully. He excused himself with his fraudulent priesthood and acted like a cruel tyrant. He thought that the sun shone right out his ass. When parents have no limits on their treatment of their children you get child abuse. You get neglect and hysterical punishment. Anything goes.

My first thought when I see a kid having any trouble is "someone needs to fix the parents."

I have been accused of that...go figure. But I will listen to dissenting opinions and have been known to change my stance on a topic when the other side in an argument present compelling information...but not often....and I do my research...and I'm pretty much fearless when I know I'm on the right track.

Ron Burr



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2014 05:25PM by Lethbridge Reprobate.

As Americans, we do tend to be egotistical and arrogant over our opinions and politics, however.

Always worth a discerning examination, IMO. Americans tend to be very self-righteous in being Americans somehow.

It's a way of changing the focus of discussion away from the
claims of the Church and the evidence regarding those claims and
make it about YOU personally.

This is one of the favorite tactics of TBMs to avoid dealing
with actual evidence and reason. Instead of looking at the
evidence and weighing it carefully and reasonably it's much
easier to accuse you of having an "attitude."

Go to your Bishop or SP with problems about the Book of
Mormon? They'll start grilling you about how often you pray,
how much you study the scriptures, are you keeping the
commandments, etc. It's a way of punishing you for pointing
something out.

Personally when anyone does that to me I point out that instead
of answering the problem they have chosen to insult me
personally. I point out that this is a common tactic of people
who do not want to face reality--attack the messenger.

If I speak up or voice my opinions, I'm told that I'm attacking them, forcing my "radical and wrong" views on them, and negating their views.

Attitude is what you have when your opinions, outlook and life style do not conform to the accuser's.