There are numerous toxic aspects to Mormonism. One of the most egregious in my estimation is the narcissistic nature of the doctrine and the Mormon god.

The problems begin with the concept of Mormons being god's chosen people, the most valiant in the pre-existence, and selected to come to earth to bring the world the "truth".

This leads to the bigoted perspective that Mormons, and particularly "righteous"/devout Mormons, are more deserving of the good things in life (god's blessings). I often observe TBMs gloat about other people's challenges and either overtly or covertly state that it is because of the other people's failure to follow the commandments.

The arrogance continues with the belief that Mormons have the only viable formula for living an acceptable life and being moral. This goes to the extreme of maintaining a missionary force of 50,000, millions spent on advertising campaigns, millions spent to influence political decisions, and limited or no boundaries when intruding into other people's lives.

Mormonism also creates selfishness in the act of giving. Because acts of charity are linked so tightly to blessings Mormons can lean toward giving for self-serving reasons. Paying tithing is a means to garner more blessings and to avoid the punishments of god. When funds are given to charity these alms are generally given to the proverbial sound of trumpets and boasting on the street corner.

Oh yes, the chosen ones....the only moral people on Earth and the only ones deserving of blessings. And pay up or else!!! Mormonism is arrogant and boastful and will never stop praising itself. Just what JC wants his people to do. Yeah, right.

They're going to be in heaven's most exclusive VIP room and every one else isn't. So there!

I think Mormons have a deep inferiority streak, though. Otherwise they wouldn't be so obsessed with their level of righteousness, their number of blessings, their place on the ladder to heaven. They wouldn't so willingly follow whatever bozo claims to have the all-access pass.

And when they get upset that our apostasy means the family won't be togethr in the CK, it's about THEIR messed up dreams, not about whether we're at peace.

...with their foolish and prideful questioning / leaving the church!

Although they are afraid of not being together in the CK, and although they believe they have somehow "failed" as parents, the family's greatest and most immediate fear is the LOSS OF STATUS they will INSTANTLY incur in their local ward because of having one wayward member. They will now be viewed as having been deficient in faith, and the level of their callings will be adjusted accordingly.

Meanwhile, the unfortunate member struggling with the shock and anguish of discovering the truth about the church is left to deal with it all by himself or herself... at least, until they find RfM!

Great insights, Stray!

How dare you disrespect us and leave the Church. How dare you not to as your told, how dare you not conform and comply. You know what's right and what's expected of you.

I see that Mormonism would most likely develop into a Muslim like society give the time and given the right political climate, be afraid, be very afraid.

not being able to do anything and giving up so much money and time. It really is a huge sacrifice. And then you get to explain it to people who see how weird it is.

I think a lot of Mormons are embarrassed, like I was.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/2010 03:03PM by munchybotaz.

After I converted I quickly realised I was very embarrassed. I always was so crappy at doing the member missionary stuff. I just didn't like telling co-workers or extended family members or acquaintances that I was Mormon. I thought it was just all new and I'd get over my embarrassment and be proud. I never did.

There aren't even good answers to the most basic questions that would satisfy anyone outside TSCC.

"So why can't you drink coffee?"
"Uh, cause we're told not to."
"But why?"

about neighbors, etc., that "all their children were married in the temple" or "all their boys went on missions" as if it were some sort of cool thing.

All it means to me is that the parents were able to funnel their children's individuality into the system, instead of letting them find themselves and their identity for themselves.

I think it's just sad to hear those statements.

a women attributed her 'big house and wealth' as a direct result of her husbands willingness to accept and serve as the bishop which she admitted was a 'difficult' calling and time for them as he was busy away from her and family etc! lol

But it was worth it, Mormon God dropped them a few more pounds sterling and they were able to live in a big house and with material wealth of the envy of others less deserving I guess.

I thought it was a bit strange at the time to atribute material wealth as a direct result of obeying Mormonism etc because I know people many times more wealthy and have never been to any church except for the odd baptism, wedding,funeral etc.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2010 02:44PM by zeezrom.

I guess that's the logic of it. All this money is flowing in, so that must mean that God approves.

Further we can examine the authors of mormonism. The creators of this doctrine fit the the narcisstic personality disorder which is:

On who feels grandiose and self important. This person will lie and is very superior. There is an exaggeration of accomplishments skills and talents.(Sounds close to BY to me)

Is obsessed with fantasies Bodily beauty or sexual performance all conquering love or passion (This is a JS fit)

Behaves arrogantly and haughtily. Does this sound like someone you know?? They also feel above the law. What does that remind you of.

I believe that leaders in the church as influential as they are have created this disorder among members.

What's your take on it

I think there's an interesting tension in the arrogance associated with Mormonism.

First, what has been written to this point is correct. Compared to those outside the group Mormons are meant to feel unjustifiably superior. The higher up leaders past and present reflect this aspect.

On the other hand, members are often made to feel unworthy and self loathing. And as Stray Mutt pointed out Mormons feel inferior. Probably for two reasons: (1) they don't have the perfect life potrayed in the Ensign, and (2) the constant need to make the church appear to be part of mainstream society. I noticed that Mormons need to point out anybody who is successful (Steve Young, the Marriotts, Mitt Romney etc.) as proof that their lifestyle gets the results, and people should pay attention. When they don't it's a disappointment.

Depending on the type of natural tendency a person has they'll pick up on one of these aspects to a greater or lesser degree. In my own experience they coexisted. I would feel superior to those without "the gospel" (TM), because I had acesess to all these "wonderful truths." At the same time, I frequently felt unworthy for one reason or another, and found myself pointing out

It's how they actually feel about themselves that manifests in the polar opposite.

http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis/p20-pe07.html

Vulnerability in self-esteem makes individuals with this disorder very sensitive to criticism or defeat. Although they may not show it outwardly, criticism may haunt these individuals these individuals and may leave them feeling humiliated, degraded, hollow, and empty. They may react with disdain, rage, or defiant counterattack. Their social life is often impaired due to problems derived from entitlement, the need for admiration, and the relative disregard for the sensitivities of others. Though their excessive ambition and confidence may lead to high achievement; performance may be disrupted due to intolerance of criticism or defeat. Sometimes vocational functioning can be very low, reflecting an unwillingness to take a risk in competitive or other situations in which defeat is possible. Individuals with this disorder have special difficulties adjusting to growing old and losing their former? Superiority?.

N/T

Mormonism harms its members. I could list them all but I don't want to type that much. But a few are things like money, self esteem, time, relationships.

All it would take is 15 minutes of a GA to read this rfm board to see the harm it does. But they don't care! In fact they like to use members and recently have added the toilet cleaning. They have no accountability to its members. The members can't vote, or have a say, or say no, or have an opinion that differs from mormonism, or voice that opinion, or listen to anyones opinion that might differ from mormonism.

But they put on this facade of caring for widows, but the reality is they are wolves in sheeps clothing. I've learned from personal experience that mormonism is a cult, and being a cult follower takes its toll on its members. It consumes your world. It is like a black hole that takes and takes and damages your life, your money, and relationships, and thought processes. Many members become addicted to the cult, and the leaders use them any way they can, while they are taken care of financially, and spend our money however they want, usually on things that the membership doesn't need or few will use.

And they don't care. They have a personal adgenda, growth of members and the resulting money, at any cost and without disclosure or consulting what the membership actually needs. They have complete power, and the membership is abused. And the con is that they are tight with Jesus and are prophets. No, they are narcissistic old men the will stop at nothing to use you for the church's benifit at your expense. The cult is so full of irresponsible expectations, but your are coerced to follow because of guilt, peer pressure, and fear of eternal life. So they make up stuff, make those "mormon" commandments serious (even if they aren't any of the 10 commandments) and get away with it. Tithing is extreme, the WOW is extreme, the time commitments and other financial cost of mormonism is extreme, having more kids than you can afford is extreme, missions are extreme, callings are extreme....

They pulled all these mormon rules out of their butts and people fell for it (and I did) So that they could control, and manipulate us. But I guess that is what cults do.

Even if they took the time to listen to our stories, they'd say we were upset because we were "angry people" or "lost the spirit" or something like that. Not that we had any descent reason to complain. It would be entirely our fault. They didn't do anything wrong and anything they ask of us is completely justified and if we can't take it, we are the unworthy ones. I was reading up on narcissism recently and that lack of caring - lack of ability to see the harm that they are causing - feeling it's justified, all are hallmarks of the Cluster B personality disorder.

Agreed!

They are Latter Day Pharisees.

BOTH Bible & D&C say "God is NO RESPECTOR OF PERSONS"


D'oh; What Does THAT MEAN???

Folks I'm in utter agony. I just found you all. My whole family is mormon except my mother who has NPD and has made my life a living hell. I just said goodbye to my sister who treats me like dirt and she blamed it all on me. I didn't do anything but want to visit with her while she was here in PA from Utah. And now she's mades me the evil of the family! I feel like I'm going insane and I'm am really hurting and have been for my whole life. There is no one around me with empathy and I'm surrounded by horrible people and feel like they're going to make me lose my mind completely. All I wanted was love. Can someone please help me!

I had a sister like that. I left her behind. Google malignant narcissism for lots of answers. You know all about it if your mom is NPD, but it often runs in the family. Odds are good your sister is also a narcissist.

Just leave your family behind. It's the only recourse you have with narcissism. It's hard, but it's way better in the long run.

I'm sorry for your pain. Have you read the book "People of the Lie: The Hope for Healing Human Evil" by M. Scott Peck? It helped me gain a lot of understanding regarding my own mother and malignant narcissism in general.

Plaid n Paisley Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sorry for your pain. Have you read the book
> "People of the Lie: The Hope for Healing Human
> Evil" by M. Scott Peck? It helped me gain a lot
> of understanding regarding my own mother and
> malignant narcissism in general.

That's a great book.

I don't really have any advice, but I wanted you to know that I read your post and I'm sorry you're in pain. My best wishes to you :)

Walking chapel halls
Meeting in small rooms
Cleaning restroom stalls
Pushing dusty brooms

We'll be gods for all we do
We will rule and govern you

He's dealt with several narcissists. In order to recover, he suggests many approaches. One quote I like is, "Learn to live independent of the good and bad opinions of others.'

Of course, sometimes one must go completely No Contact from the toxic people in our lives before we can have the confidence to do that. I'm finally at that stage of healing.

Do a board search on narcissism, and you find several threads.

The beginning of the end for me was that I was married to a narcissistic Mormon for 29 years. He thought he was Mr. Righteous and constantly used the church against me. His favorite line was, "you don't have the Spirit with you," to belittle me in front of our children. He even said prayers that were directly pointed towards me to lecture me or try and get me to do what he wanted. At the time, I was being faithful in the religion. I got tired of being treated that way no matter how hard I tried . My dad told me about Joseph Smith and his many wives--how he never took responsibility for his actions or admitted to his own sins,so I decided to look into it further. He sounded a lot like the kind of person I was married to.
That was two years ago--I left him and shortly afterwards, I left the church. I don't miss either one.

Then when a TBM gets serious cancer and they HAVE PAID THEIR TITHING, HAVE KISSED THE CULT'S BUTT, they don't know what to say. How could they not have the blessings they deserve? How come the Pennis-holder can't cure their cancer?

FU*KED FAKE CULT ANYWAY.