This popped up on youtube suggested videos today, and although I almost gagged at first, I ended up appreciating it for highlighting (likely unintentionally) a simple truth: men in the LDS church hate going to church.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmGp3rThIzA

You see how the men are mocking the way they perceive the women take the church so seriously, so organized, and so forth. Then you see how the women perceive the men. I found their portrayal of elders quorum meetings to be spot on --- low attendance, people on cell phones checking the game score, absolutely nobody paying real attention or taking it seriously. Half assed lesson plans that rely on the idea that *someone* there will want to take the floor with a long-winded, almost relevant story to kill time so that you don't have to say much (as the teacher). When I was mormon I would just sit there hating every second of priesthood meeting and watching the clock so I could go home. This never really changed; there were never any teachers who were more or less interesting to listen to, there were never any lessons that were more or less engaging, and I would only attend because I thought that skydaddy would punish me if I didn't.

It reminded me of the time that I saw a glimmer of actual honesty from a district leader on my mission. He basically did a training on "keeping investigators entertained during church," because "how many of you have been bored at church before? It would make sense, then, that our investigators could get bored too."

I was as church yesterday and was thinking the same exact thing. I NEVER liked going to church...I went because I thought it was where I was supposed to be. Now, having learned the truth, I can't stand church...especially this year. It's infuriating to sit through the church history lessons that are full of half-truths and watch sisters get teary-eyed in sunday school over blatant lies.

torwards my last days in the cult, I would go to lust do my calling and then head home. I became very direct with mormons at that point. One time one thanked m for my lesson and asked me if I wento to HP or EQ. In front of 3 people, including the bishop's wife I said, I am supposed to to go HP but I relly dont do becuase I rather go home and get some work done during that hour, the lessons are super boring and I have heard them multiples times before.
He was smiling speechless, the bishops wife look over her shoulder to inmediately confirm who was there to hear my apostasy. I said well, I gotta go have fun and walked out.

No one likes going. Yuo may get to where you feel good you went or you were even ispired by a teacher, but going to church is a dread for all men of all religions.

I would have to agree. The last time I went to EQ meeting, or, in other words, the last time I attempted to go to EQ meeting, I walked into the room to see the words "Why we should go to the temple" written on the markerboard. I immediately turned around and walked out. No way I was going to sit in a boring meeting for 45 minutes and listen to people talk themselves into going to yet another 90-minute boring ritual.
The last time I went to Sunday School, the instructor opened his Book of Mormon, and said "Today we are going to talk about Lehi's Dream." I got up out of my chair and walked out at that point. I did not want to hear another lesson drawn from a book that I already considered to be ridiculous; especially when the lesson was about the Holy Cafeteria Line.

I can remember the last time I taught an elders quorum lesson (outside of my mission, which doesn't count because I was just having fun with korean). Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic had just come out, and I had spent the entire night prior at a friend's house playing it. Knowing I wouldn't have time to sleep before church, I sustained myself with an entire two-liter of dnL (7 up upside down, basically the same but tons of caffeine). I threw some crap together in 2 minutes, grabbed some barely relevant quotes from the latest general conference, and hoped someone would chime in with a personal story.

Naturally, I was rewarded with "what a great lesson" and "I really felt the spirit in class today" platitudes.

Just one of many experiences that muddled the idea of "inspiration" and "the feeling of the holy spirit." I slowly learned that "the spirit" was just emotion, and that emotion could be manipulated with ease.

When I finished learning this lesson, I was out.

uri nara ey song kyo sa ope heso? odi? onjay? (forgive the bad Romanization)

seoul, 93-95

When I was teaching elders quorum I always wanted to get an orange and camo hunting tarp to cover the table, and adorn it with a deer head center piece to mock the ornate table pieces the RS used to have for EVERY lesson.

Of course, I never did. Because the spirit told me that it was wrong to mock the sisters who are always more righteous than the men. Oh, and I owned neither a deer head nor a tarp.

aigo ilki himduro!

seoul, '05-'07

Spent the end of my mission in Sinchon near the temple. Someday I'll have to tell you the time my companion and I accidentally joined some out-of-town soldiers for soju and samgyupsal.

LOL! that's money! I have been back several times since. Going back as an exmo is waaaaay funner!

Hwegeh hara! Eedan morumun gyo pabodur!

Korea Seoul West 97-99

Priesthood classes were classic examples of drudgery. Lessons being prepared in the foyer during Sunday School or opening exercises, the younger half the class hanging out in the clerks office during the whole thing, and the rest too old and tired to go anywhere else. The only time it got your interest was if you were the one having to teach. And then if you really were starting to enjoy the class, somebody would come in and call you out to do something for them. Oh well, at least we were obedient, and that's all our masters demanded of us.

My husband stopped going 7 yrs ago. I didn't want to hear his "excuses." He flat out hated the temple. But, I was still trying to be a TBM. I thought my husband was doomed. Then, 5 yrs ago, I began to realize that all religions are boring at times. I started looking at things from his perspective. When he gave honest heartfelt answers in Sunday School, they ignored him. The Bishops usually made it known that they didn't like him. His frank and open attitude was challenging to them.

I stopped condemning my husband for being bored with church. I stopped letting the Bishop interview me every month, to determine if I still had a testimony. I slowly, ever so slowly, began to see why a man would hate church. The Bishop sets your own wife up against you. The RS women do everything over-the-top. The temple makes you sleepy. Church is 3 freaking hours long.

So what if my husband liked sports on Sunday? So what if he wanted some time off. So what if he wanted to get things done over the weekend. So what! He was still a good man. A good dad. A good husband.

It took leaving the church, to finally be able to understand each other better. We can actually have honest conversations about everything in life now.

I am so glad I left.

Yesterday I went to Mass at the local Catholic church and, as always, I was struck by the number of 40-50 something men who were there alone. I sat toward the back and there were probably half a dozen men in my section alone who were sitting by themselves or with a friend. But who obviously came without a spouse prodding or guilting them into it. I've noticed that before and it isn't just that age group. There are as many single men there as single women. Plenty of families and older couples too. Because everyone who is there WANTS to be there. It's a change from the Mormon thing.

Those men are there because of their mothers. Catholic guilt is a powerful thing...screws with people their entire life.

Kind of joking about the mom part, but mostly serious:)

The same thing in my parish. These are usually men who are married to non-Catholics. I sit next to one on Sundays and he's been married for 50 years. He's there every Sunday :) without his wife.

They did get married in the church but they attend alone.

I don't think hating church is gender specific, although I do agree that women as a whole tend to like it better than men. I've always disliked going to church and I'm a woman. For as long as I can remember, I've been uncomfortable with teary, "express all your feelings" Young Women's and Relief Society meetings. I've asked many times for a nursery or Primary calling so I could avoid those meetings altogether.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/14/2013 12:59PM by want2bx.

Tears and emotions don't equal "The Spirit" or "The Truth"

ugh, me too. I hated the "fakeness" of it all...

want2bx Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't think hating church is gender specific,
> although I do agree that women as a whole tend to
> like it better than men.

That is so strange to me; it sounds like the women would have it much worse (at least those who are mothers, whom I assume the majority of TBM women are). First they have to do most of the work getting a bunch of kids dressed and ready for church, then no doubt they are also the ones primarily responsible for keeping an eye on the kids during services. Ugh.

As a TBM I hated going -- although I would have never admitted it at the time.
It did become a little more bearable once I got a smart phone and could play video games for 3 hours on my NES, SNES, and MAME emulator apps. Then the bishop announced at the pulpit he did not want to see anyone on their phones during church. Fortunately, it was around the same time I left the church.

Sorry I had to comment on The bishop announced at the pulpit he did not want to see anyone on their phones during church

So what if somebody was on their phone? Would they get detention? Get written up and have to attend a class on active listening?

It reminds me of how leaders teach the congregation like school children. Hats off on your exit!

Well said.

One of the last times I went to church was with my parents and the still-under-my-father's-thumb siblings. I was still trying to believe in tscc, but my younger brother had already figured it out. He wasn't quite old enough to leave home and live on his own.

In the middle of sacrament meeting I was trying to keep my eyes open, and he nudges me, gesturing toward the iPod he smuggled in. He was watching south park, and discreetly offered me one of his earbuds. I really, really wanted to take him up on his offer, but my wife and newborn child were sitting on my other side. I gave him a disapproving glare and he backed off.

Now I wish I could go back and just watch it with him. I see him as a stronger and smarter person than me, because despite the intense pressure my parents put on him to go on mission he resisted and choose to make his own path. Even though I'm about a decade older, it took me years longer than him to figure it out.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/14/2013 03:46PM by soju.

A group of us used to go to the temple, and afterwards we would go out to dinner, or for ice cream. The bishop/SP got wind of this, and told us to stop because it was detracting from the purpose and spirit of the temple. We stopped going.

The bishop commanded us all to be absolutely quiet when entering the chapel. We were supposed to enter quietly, without eye contact, and sit down so we and others could feel the spirit while listening to the prelude music. So, everyone hung out in the halls until the last minute....

Then there's the no electronic device rule that some bishop's apply today. (Back in my day before those contraptions, I used to put a Sports Illustrated inside The Ensign.)

Church leaders are clueless when it comes to looking the other way or realizing they should be happy with people being there instead of being critical. Here's a revelation: "Church is boring!" Mormonism today isn't about humanity or society, but all about obedience. And people like me have finally said, "Fine. Whatever. I'm outta here."

<<A group of us used to go to the temple, and afterwards we would go out to dinner, or for ice cream. The bishop/SP got wind of this, and told us to stop because it was detracting from the purpose and spirit of the temple....>>

In my family ward several couples did this as well. Sounds fun; however, they were viewed as a clique. Maybe the Bishop was asking to not do this to be more inclusive with the other ward members?

Not that I care, my parents never went through the temple; I haven't either. ;)

Regardless, it's still beyond his purview to tell us what we can or can't do after.... And I doubt we were the "cliquish" ones in the ward anyway; we were young and just starting out, and we certainly didn't make a big deal about it. So, I'm sticking with the "spiritual distraction" point.

Nowadays we go to sporting events and then go to sports bars afterwards. No bishop is around to try to control us anymore.

I do know some women who actually loved going to church. I could never quite understand that. Maybe it's because they're very social-oriented.

But I imagine that, for a lot of men and women, it was thought of as yet another chore that we needed to do for Sky Daddy.

It is most-definitely a church of works.

Edit: I was just thinking that this was the biggest cause of my frequent periods of inactivity. It wasn't a testimony problem, at the time. It was that I hated going to church. I always did.

I did it to gain the brownie points. I did it because I was supposed to and I felt good about doing something that I was supposed to do.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/14/2013 04:26PM by Greyfort.

My hope is that those little pieces of "rebellion" may lead someone to think a little more about the organization of which they're a part. But, oh so true!

As a high council member (when I was still a member at all!), I used to love traveling and speaking at other wards and branches--I gave a good show in talking in sacrament meeting and then, I was outta there...no more meetings...I could say I had to go somewhere else and just slip out and skip the rest of the day's travails : )

Anything to skip a meeting!

Would leave one with very little doubt that many a priesthood holder finds perusing the magazine rack to going to church -- or even hanging out in the parking lot.

I love the one guy I ran into that was in full suit -AND- adorned with his "duty-to-gawd" award. B&N must be gawd's initials I suspect.

I'm a woman and I found most lessons very boring, especially Sunday School. I remember way too many Sundays trying to skip the class or just sitting on the last road hoping the time would go faster. I was there because that was 'where the Lord wanted me to be'.

Just reading this thread is bringing back painful memories of elders quorum meetings. That right there is enough to leave the church even if it was true.