The Arrest Records of Joseph Smith from 1826 to 1830 are Rediscovered and Given to the Mormon Church.

“Joseph Smith's Arrest Record Surfaces In New York”  excerpt:

…``It is not a small thing. These are important papers to a major religion,'' she said. ``It's a piece of the historical puzzle that was missing for nearly 35 years.'' …

… The documents include arrest warrants, court transcripts and legal bills from four separate charges filed against Smith. Storms said the cases involved Smith's involvement in glass looking, or treasure seeking, and being a disorderly person. …

…One of the documents includes a bill from then-South Bainbridge Justice Albert Neely to the county for services rendered. Included in the bill is a $2.68 charge for fees in examining the case of ``Joseph Smith, the glass looker.''

This is from an article Sep. 16th, 2005.  Source:  http://kutv.com/topstories/local_story

 

Subject:

Re: Joe Smith's Arrest Records

Date:

Sep 16 16:33

Author:

Jefferson

Dr. Nibley was able to maintain plausible deniability when he made this statement in 1961. I wonder what he would say today if he were alive?

BTW, what an appropriate name for his book...The Myth Makers!

Taken from the Tanner's website:

"The noted Mormon apologist Hugh Nibley published a book in which this statement appeared: "...if this court record is authentic it is the most damning evidence in existence against Joseph Smith." (The Myth Makers, 1961, page 142) On the same page we read that such a court record would be "the most devastating blow to Smith ever delivered." Because he could see the serious implications of the matter, Dr. Nibley tried in every way possible to destroy the idea that the court record was an authentic document."



Subject:

Joseph Smith's arrest record on glass-looking charges--and Hugh Nibley's warnings about their serious nature, if proven true ( and they are now proven true.)

Date:

Sep 17, 2005

Author:

steve benson


What is particularly damning about these latest press revelations is that they further validate the devastating nature of the crimes that Smith committed--as, in fact, admitted by Mormonism's historically pre-eminent apologist and water carrier, Hugh Nibley.

In 1961, Nibley authored a book entitled The Mythmakers, in which he ventured to boldly debunk assertions that Joseph Smith had committed, or had been arrested for, the crime of "glass-looking." Nibley (in words he probably later wished he could retract) went so far as to declare that if, in fact, Smith was actually proven guilty of such nefarious activity, it would constitute the most damning blow that could be imagined to Smith's claim of divine prophetship.

Derick S. Hartshorn, in his work, Bearing the Testimony of Truth, reviews the history of apologetic denials uttered by Mormonism's stoutest defenders--and then compares those desperate defenses to the actual evidence found--evidence that cuts Smith off at the knees.

Under the sub-section, Guilty! Next Case!, Hartshorn exposes the serious nature of the charges against Smith and how they have plunged a dagger into the heart of Smith's claims to divine guidance:

"It was charged that Joseph Smith was accused and found guilt of parting a local farmer from his money in a less than honest scheme, commonly known as 'money-digging' or 'glass-looking.' It was reported to have been an activity that brought him rebuke from his soon-to-be father-in-law, Isaac Hale. It is also historically recorded that he was removed from membership in a local Methodist church because of the activity and trial results.

"Joseph Smith skims over the specific event leading to the trial in the Pearl of Great Price, explaining that he was only a day worker for the man so engaged and not personally involved.

"Mormon writers have continually challenged its doubters to find the records (seemingly lost) and prove Joseph Smith a liar or stop the attacks. Mormon writer Hugh Nibley, the most prolific defender of the Mormon faith, used almost 20 pages in his book, The Mythmakers, in an attempt to discredit this 'alleged' court trial. On page 142 we find:

"'. . . If this court record is authentic it is the most damning evidence in existence against Joseph Smith' and would be 'the most devastating blow to Smith ever delivered.' [emphasis added]

"Of course, when that was first published back in 1961, Dr. Nibley undoubtedly felt that after 130 years no such record would turn up in 1971. Once again, the actual evidence, which the Mormon Church had denied ever existed came to light in 1971. You can read about how it was discovered as well as the relevance of other historical documents of that time that Joseph used a 'seer' stone to find money, etc. in the 54=page brochure 'Joseph Smith’s Bainbridge, N.Y., Court Trials.'

"One might wonder why this should be cause for concern among investigators of Mormonism. The fact is the up to then, the Mormon Leaders had denied that there WAS such a trial. Indeed, they claim that the story of Joseph’s arrest was a 'fabrication of unknown authorship and never in a court record at all.'

"The charge that Joseph was known to hunt treasure with 'peep' or 'seer' stones, etc., was serious enough that Mormon scholar Francis W. Kirkham stated that if the court record could be found, it would show that the Mormon Church was false:

"'Careful study of all facts regarding this alleged confession of Joseph Smith in a court of law that he had used a seer stone to find hidden treasure for purposes of fraud, must come to the conclusion that no such record was ever made, and therefore, is not in existence . . .

"'If any evidence had been in existence that Joseph Smith had used a seer stone for fraud and deception, and especially had he made this confession in a court of law as early as 1826, or four years before the Book of Mormon was printed, and this confession was in a court record, it would have been impossible for him to have organized the restored Church.'

"Later, in the same book, Mr. Kirkham states:

"'. . . [I]f a court record could be identified, and if it contained a confession by Joseph Smith which revealed him to be a poor, ignorant, deluded, and superstitious person unable himself to write a book of any consequence, and whose Church could not endure because it attracted only similar persons of low mentality if such a court record confession could be identified and proved, then it follows that his believers must deny his claimed divine guidance which led them to follow him. . . . How could he be a prophet of God, the leader of the Restored Church to these tens of thousands, if he had been superstitious fraud which the pages from a book declared he confessed to be? . . . '

"Well, in spite of 140 years of silence, the records did surface. Rev. Wesley Walters discovered the documents in the basement of the Chenango County, New York, jailhouse at Norwich, N.Y. in 1971. The records, affidavits, and other data show conclusively that Joseph Smith was arrested, went to trial, was found guilty as an imposter in the Stowell matter of "glass-looking." It is not a matter of debate, opinion or religious preference. It is a proven historical fact.

"Initially Mormons denied that Joseph ever participated in 'money-digging' activities, saying that would invalidate his claim as a prophet. Now that indisputable evidence confirms that Joseph was a convicted 'money- digger' Mormons have taken a 'so what' attitude. At least one says, now that the evidence proves that Joseph was a 'money-digger' that it really doesn’t matter. (What could a BYU professor say?) Mormon scholar Marvin Hill says:

"'There may be little doubt now, as I have indicated elsewhere, that Joseph Smith was brought to trial in 1826 on a charge, not exactly clear, associated with money digging.' [Fawn] Brodie’s thesis that the prophet grew from necromancer to prophet assumes that the two were mutually exclusive, that if Smith were a money-digger he could not have been religiously sincere.

'This does not necessarily follow. Many believers active in their churches, were money-diggers in New England and western New York in this period. Few contemporaries regard these money-diggers as irreligious, only implying so if their religious views seemed too radical . . . For the historian interested in Joseph Smith the man, it does not seem incongruous for him to have hunted for treasure with a seer stone and then to use with full faith to receive revelations from the Lord.'

"Marvin Hill’s appraisal of the treasure seeking activities make it appear that contemporaries of Joseph Smith treated this enterprise with a casual air. One such contemporary that was closer to Joseph than most, could hardly disguise his disdain. This was Isaac Hale, father of the girl that Joseph would later elope with. In an affidavit signed by Hale and published in the Susquehanna Register, May 1, 1834, Joseph’s father-in-law said:

"'I first became acquainted with Joseph Smith, Jr. in November, 1825. He was at that time in the employ of a set of men who were called ‘money diggers’; and his occupation was that of seeing, or pretending to see by what means of a stone placed in his hat, and his hat closed over his face. In this way he pretended to discover minerals and hidden treasure.

"'Smith and his father, with several other money-diggers boarded at my house while they were employed in digging for a mine that they supposed had been opened and worked by the Spaniards. Young Smith made several visits at my house, and at length asked my consent to his marrying my daughter Emma. This I refused . . . [H]e was a stranger, and followed a business that I could not approve. . . . Smith stated to me, that he had given up what he called "glass-looking," and that he expected to work hard for a living . . .

"'Soon after this, I was informed that they had brought a wonderful book of plates down with them . . . The manner in which he pretended to read and interpret, was the same as when he looked for the money-diggers, with the stone in his hat, and his hat over his face, while the Book of Plates were at the same time hid in the woods.'"

http://www.saintsalive.com/mormonism/ftruth/ft1.doc

 

 

 

Subject:

Re: Nibley & Kirkham

Date:

Sep 17 11:07

Author:

Jn

Thanks Steve. I have done quite a bit of reading about the "glass-looking" but I wasn't aware of the "quotes" by Nibley and Kirkham regarding this.

Of course it always gets explained away by current apologists, but, how long can they continue that?

It just doesn't pass the "smell test".

Jn

 

Subject:

You know, if TSCC would be honest about everyone's imperfections

Date:

Sep 17 14:42

Author:

Devil's Advocate

If they would be honest enough to admit that yes, Joe tried to use his new-found powers for purposes other than God's work and got in trouble for it, wouldn't that be a better example than to falsely claim that Joe never did such a thing, that he was perfect as a prophet, yadda yadda yadda? Shoot, any of us might do the same thing ourselves. If they were honest and accepting of people's error-prone human nature, wouldn't they be more God-like? Brig's bank failure is proven - for now at least (will TSCC be trying to cover that up in the future??) so why not use it to reassure people that yes, we are all human and yes, we do forgive, God forgives --- wait! I'm painting a picture of a church that is God-like, not the one we have all rebuke on a near-daily basis! Fools!! All they had to do was be honest about the past mistakes of everyone, instead of holding Joe up as a god to be worshipped! But their lies, their increasingly unGod-like behavior will catch up to them one day, mark my words. We will see them implode because just like they say, any house built on sand cannot last, and their lies upon lies is more and more sand instead of their firm foundation. They will fall, I just hope they don't take any more of my loved ones down with them when they crash.

 

Subject:

Re: Joe Smith's Arrest Records

Date:

Sep 15 16:13

Author:

bnaur

It is fun to read news like this and then READ FAIRS analysis, trying to suggest that these documents do no exist, there defense becomes their condemnation, their inability to accept truth and deny the facts continues to fly in the face of intellectuals:

http://www.fairlds.org/pubs/conf/2002AndR.html

 

Subject:

Ya know, I could write an exhaustive rebuttal to this FAIR article.....

Date:

Sep 15 18:48

Author:

Randy J.

.....if I had the time and energy to do so at present. But I want to comment on one statement that amused me:

"It will be noticed with interest, that although Bishop Tuttle and others had access to the Pearsall account for several years it was not published until after her death. That combined with the fact that the torn leaves were never allowed to be examined, would cast some doubt on the completeness or accuracy of that which was published."

Let's apply this Mopologist's argument against the authenticity of the Pearsall account to the production of the Book of Mormon.

Notice any funny similarities? :-)

 

Subject:

Yeah, and this part is hilarious!...

Date:

Sep 16 15:32

Author:

Shiner Bock

"We need to be careful that we examine the life of Joseph Smith from the perspective of his environment. We can read the following from the Palmyra Herald, July 24, 1822, when Joseph was 16 years old.

"digging for money hid in the earth is a very common thing and in this state it is even considered as honorable and profitable employment"

"One gentleman...digging...ten to twelve years, found a sufficient quantity of money to build him a commodious house.

"another...dug up...fifty thousand dollars!"

You can imagine how you would respond to this type of information if you were 16 at the time and read this in the newspaper? You would likely find yourself out there digging as other fairly respectable people were doing. Let's think about how Joseph Smith fits into the 1825 timeframe. That is the key, to not put our environment on Joseph Smith, but to look at Joseph Smith in his own environment."

Yet Smith said in his history that he was NOT a treasure digger like the above would suggest.

 

Subject:

I'm surprised to see KUTV reporting on this since they are a tool of the mormon church. .. n/t

 

Subject:

KSL is the one owned by the Morg, but....

Date:

Sep 15 17:36

Author:

scarecrowfromoz

KUTV did present it so that members of the Morg could dismiss it. At the beginning of the TV segment, they very briefly mentioned it was in the 1820s.

At the end of the TV segment they gave the Morg spin of how JS was killed by an "anti-Mormon mob" and said he was "arrested many times in connection with the Mormon Church." [paraphrase] They way they presented it, it came across that Smith's arrest for glass looking was in regard to "anti-Mormons" out to get him. There was NO Mormon Church when he was convicted of "glass looking."

I e-mailed KUTV that it was very dishonest the way they presented it, implying that his charge of glass looking was by "anti-Mormons", when there was no Mormon Church when he was convicted.

 

You can say that about all the TV stations, radio stations, and newspapers in UT. What else is new? KSL is one outright owned by the Morg.

 

 

Subject:

I can settle this

Date:

Sep 15 18:34

Author:

stuck

KUTV walks a fine line in trying to please the Mormons while serving the non-Mormons. It would be expected for Channels 2 and 4 to have stories that are not entirely complementary to the LDS Church without being too offensive. After all, many Mormons look to the Salt Lake Tribune for any real news about the Church, so also it is expected that 2 news and 4 news will be somewhat objective without losing too many ratings points. All the Mormons watch Channel 5 anyway, so I don't know if it makes any difference.

 

Subject:

Was this before or after his First Vision?

Date:

Sep 15 19:40

Author:

M31

I recall reading somewhere that Joseph claimed to have had his vision in 1820? Is that correct?

 

Subject:

Good Question, M31

Date:

Sep 16 14:50

Author:

Puli

Let's see, Smith was born in 1805 as I recall and he could would have been 14 for all of 1820 until his birthday in December. According to the Official LDS church sanctioned First Vision story, the First Vision most likely occurred in 1820.

From the link in bnaur's post, the trial took place on March 20, 1826 and JS would have been 20 years old. The trial would have happened after the First Vision. I think even the alternate version would place this trial for glasslooking after the First Vision, it's just a matter of how long after.

Can anyone post what was happening in official church history in the Spring of 1826? Joseph Smith was visiting the gold plates but had not yet collected them? It would be interesting to see what they say Joseph was doing when he was arrested for fortune-telling.

 

Subject:

That's exactly the point....

Date:

Sep 16 15:13

Author:

Randy J.

>Can anyone post what was happening in official church history in the Spring of 1826? Joseph Smith was visiting the gold plates but had not yet collected them?

>It would be interesting to see what they say Joseph was doing when he was arrested for fortune-telling.


That's the point: There was NOTHING happening in "church history" in the spring of 1825. While post-hoc accounts and apologetics say that Smith spent that time farming, reading the Bible, and being mentored by God and angels, the actual historical documentation says that he was being hauled into court for running his "peep-stoning" scam.

As I've noted many times, the earliest documented accounts from anyone outside the Smith family which reported any claims about heavenly visions and golden plates originated around the summer of 1827---more than a year AFTER Smith's embarrassing "glass-looking" court hearing of March 1826. In that hearing, Smith admitted that his "peep-stoning" practice was all a fraud, and he promised the judge that he would give it up and do honest work. The judge let Smith off based on that promise.

Smith then eloped with Emma Hale against her father's wishes. When they returned after being married, Isaac Hale begrudgingly let them live in an old cabin on his property. But then just a few months later, Smith began spinning his yarn about getting the golden plates from an angel, and claiming that he could translate them via the same "peep-stoning" malarkey THAT HE HAD ALREADY ADMITTED WAS A FRAUD.

"The manner in which he pretended to read and interpret was the same manner as when he looked for the money-diggers, with the stone in his hat, while the book of plates were at the same time hid in the woods."---Isaac Hale affidavit, May 1834.

Read more details at

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.mormon/msg/492fff538ca28440?&hl=en&q=stolen+daughter+Isaac+Hale+Randy+

 

Subject:

The big lie.....

Date:

Sep 15 19:51

Author:

craig

... is that they don't explain that "glass-looking" refers to his peep stones, the same ones he used to "translate" the BOM. Any real news organization would have reported that connection. But, then again.... let't keep the faithful ignorant of history that is not helpful. Thanks KUTV for lying for the Lord as usual, you kiss-a$$, suck-ups.

 

Subject:

Why did they give the documents to the LDS church ????

Date:

Sep 16 14:57

Author:

Puli

From the KUTV link: >>Chenango County Historian Dale Storms said she turned over the newly found documents to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, which is based in Salt Lake City.<<

Any guesses why the Chenango County Historian would give up a piece of NY history to TSCC?

I suppose no one will see them again without "proper" clearance from the Brethren. They now slip into the realm of deniability since they won't be easily accessible to whomever wants to see them.

 

Subject:

Re: Joe Smith's Arrest Records

Date:

Sep 16 15:09

Author:

No Moniker

From the Tanner site FYI:

http://www.utlm.org/newsletters/no68.htm#JOSEPH%20SMITH%20GUILTY

If this were just a case that involved a young man getting into trouble with the law, Mormon critics would be foolish to spend their time rehashing the story. Most people would allow Joseph Smith the right to make a few youthful mistakes without maintaining that it would seriously affect his role as a prophet. The issue, however, is much more serious than just the transgression of an early New York law which many today would regard as antiquated. What is involved here is the question of whether Joseph Smith was a true prophet of God or merely a man entangled in occultic practices. The implications of this matter are very serious indeed. Once we accept the validity of the documents concerning Joseph Smith's trouble with the law, we are forced to admit that he was engaging in magical practices at the very time he claimed he was being tutored by the Angel Moroni to receive the gold plates of the Book of Mormon.

 

Subject:

Deja Vu

Date:

Sep 16 15:26

Author:

Baura

The documents which Wesley Walters found thirty years or so ago get lost and no one knows where they are. Then they get found again and the world doesn't find out about it until they are given to the LDS church.

The Papyri that JS got with the mummies becomes lost and no one knows where they are. Then they get found again and the world doesn't find out about it until they are given to the LDS church.

 

 

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